Issue with Primedice

[galustjan]

Hello,

I've created that topic to tell you my unpleasant experience with PrimeDice. But let's start with a little bit of background.

I've joined PD on November 21st, 2014. So, it's pretty old account. Back then, I've been making bets using automated betting, but since I have an experience in Python language, pretty soon I've decided to implement my own betting script using the public API that PD provides since it is just faster and allows more flexibility. I've added a lot of logging to the script and I kept all the logs on my server. Also, daily stats were delivered using Telegram Bot to my Telegram (on the phone), so I can keep the track of what's going on. I have these thats from September 14, 2015.

So, why I've created that topic? Actually, I'm asking for help. Also, I want to make it public, since PD stuff doesn't want to deal with the case. Let me explain the situation that I'm in at the moment.

My script was running for about a year and everything was fine. On February 25th, 2016 I had 4.34414976 BTC on my account. But on February 26th, 2016 I took a look at the daily stats and it was showing that more than 4 BTC dissapeared from my account, with only 0.32611752 left.

Daily stats

I've started investigating stuff and looking into the logs. I found out that my script didn't performed any bets of such a big ammount (and it can't since it's a stop-loss algo implemented in it). I found out that the maximum bet that was performed was equal to 196608 satoshi (basically 0.00196608 BTC). Also, no sequence of bets were found to be able to lose such a big amount of 4 BTCs. I can provide all the logs if needed on request with a great detalization.

I've checked transaction log as well to exclude the probability of the hacked account:

Transaction logs

Obviosly, no money were withdrawn during that period of time.

So, I've dropped an email to PD support. Here is the whole conversation:

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And from then, they never answered again. All this is pretty strange, because I don't have a "spending bet" number, they refuse to give to me and since I have all the logs on my side, it feels like it is pretty hard for them to "forge" it. Please, get me right: all I want is BetID of the losing bet (or a sequence of bets), so I can verify it using provably fair algorithm. Until now, I don't have it and all my logs are telling me that there were no such bets.

Also, since my script was winning all the time giving me constant profit during the last year, I think my version of forgery is even more legit. They just wanted to shut it down in such a bad way. BTW, here are my stats:

PD stats

Before that 4 BTC loss it was almost 2 BTC in profits.

What will be the best case scenario? What can I do in this situation? I'm ready to answer to all additional questions from your side and provide all the needed info.

Thanks!

P.S.: As I don't have 'member' status of my account on bitcointalks, I cant show you full screens in the post, sorry...

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[ThomM]

looks like you just got hit by a nasty luck to me. that or your script got an error and made an insane losing bet which it didn't log. I mean look at that stats. -928BTC? really?

[Superhitech]

looks like you just got hit by a nasty luck to me. that or your script got an error and made an insane losing bet which it didn't log. I mean look at that stats. -928BTC? really?

It's possible that OP's script didn't log the loss, but it also seems really weird that PrimeDice has never given OP a reply. What's keeping them? It's true that they serve many users on a daily basis, but they shouldn't leave a customer hanging like this, especially after an unexplained loss of multiple bitcoins.

There are many PrimeDice representatives on this forum, so hopefully you can get a satisfactory answer from them. Have you tried PM'ing some of them?

[ndnh]

Well what I think happened is that the bot messed up.
The is probably the only explanation that makes sense to me.


Can you also check the Tip log for the period


Can you provide the full bet history? 0.0019 is small but a 1000 such bets would make the loss 1.9BTC and your stats show a lot of bets.

Probably the reason for not getting a full reply is that viewing all bets by user is only available to a top few staff and that they would have too many things to do already. (consider that your total number of bets stand at around 27 million bets)

[Yutikas_11920]

Only the PD can explain all these issues. Just wait until the party PD do explanation to the problem you're having PD, possible technical errors in the site so that you experience it. Don't worry, if this is indeed purely the fault of the PD is definitely their side will correct these errors

[Stunna]

Hi,

You can try email Edward directly at Edward (@) Primedice.com

Otherwise PM me your username & I'll look into it -- If support hasn't been able to solve it there must not be missing balance on your account (Meaning your profit, withdrawals, deposits, tips all 0 sum up). In this case it is generally the assumption the account was compromised.

As I said we can look into it further for you none the less & come to a conclusion. It's very rare for coins to go missing on Primedice (Sometimes the DB will not log a TX - Never a bet however - causing the accounts 'difference' to be off put). From what I've read it seems like there has been an issue with your script. Hopefully I can pull up a whole bet log for you (Or Edward) and have this sorted ASAP.

Hope we can figure this out & get you playing again or at the least leaving a happy review.

[galustjan]

Well what I think happened is that the bot messed up.
The is probably the only explanation that makes sense to me.

Can you also check the Tip log for the period

Can you provide the full bet history? 0.0019 is small but a 1000 such bets would make the loss 1.9BTC and your stats show a lot of bets.

I thought about multiple bets spending this amount of money. So, this is the first what I've checked. I can provide full bet history starting from February 17th, 2016. In the end of the script you can see an error of parsing the result received from the server, then the script shut down and the balance loss has occurred. The bet amount on that request was just 12 Satoshis.

Here is the log: https://www.sendspace.com/file/uzkns4. It's a 7-zip archive.
Here is the Tip log: https://i.imgur.com/hnB4Qvi.png. No sign of external tipping.

The version about bot messing up is not relevant. It's pretty simple and also have a lot of logging as well as error processing (all the code is wrapped into try...except statements). I can send someone from that forum (or PD stuff) my Python script for assessment.

BTW, you are seeing -928.16544744 number, because the formula for my Telegram Bot looks like that:

Code:

text = 'Total Balance = ' + str(bal/100000000) + '\n' + 'Today Earnings = ' + str((todays_earnings / 100000000) * 231)

231 is the constant, which represents the USD\BTC exchange rate back then, when I've started running the script. I haven't adjusted it since then, because I wanted to see the natural increase in earnings, if any. So, I need that fixed value, to be able to perform the comparisons. So, that loss can be easily converted back to BTC, which results exactly in the amount mentioned by me in the first post.

It's possible that OP's script didn't log the loss, but it also seems really weird that PrimeDice has never given OP a reply. What's keeping them? It's true that they serve many users on a daily basis, but they shouldn't leave a customer hanging like this, especially after an unexplained loss of multiple bitcoins.

There are many PrimeDice representatives on this forum, so hopefully you can get a satisfactory answer from them. Have you tried PM'ing some of them?

No, I haven't PMed them there.

Hi,

You can try email Edward directly at Edward (@) Primedice.com

Otherwise PM me your username & I'll look into it -- If support hasn't been able to solve it there must not be missing balance on your account (Meaning your profit, withdrawals, deposits, tips all 0 sum up). In this case it is generally the assumption the account was compromised.

As I said we can look into it further for you none the less & come to a conclusion. It's very rare for coins to go missing on Primedice (Sometimes the DB will not log a TX - Never a bet however - causing the accounts 'difference' to be off put). From what I've read it seems like there has been an issue with your script. Hopefully I can pull up a whole bet log for you (Or Edward) and have this sorted ASAP.

Hope we can figure this out & get you playing again or at the least leaving a happy review.

My username is not a secret: john1980 as stated in the logs. From what I've seen, my account is not compromised. At least, I highly doubt it. It has a very strong password and I thread my credentials with the great care. Also, logs, as I mentioned above, showed otherwise: no tipping, no withdrawals.

I hope for that outcome too. If I can see the reasonable answer, I will apologize publicly here. I just want to check that bet (if it exists) using Provably Fair concept.

Thank you for your time.

[phibay]

I hope they are able to resolve this for you! Best thing you can do is keep trying to reach out to them. Try contacting the MODs on the forum .

Best of luck and hope you get your coins back

[katerniko1]

Well as im old player on primedice i thibk that your bot messed up, but stunna will help you grab those betid-s so there should be no worries you will see what happen sorry about. your coina
regards.
-Katerniko1

[galustjan]

Well as im old player on primedice i thibk that your bot messed up, but stunna will help you grab those betid-s so there should be no worries you will see what happen sorry about. your coina
regards.
-Katerniko1

Sorry, but I cannot get this type of explanation, despite it's the easiest one to assume. At least until I see the spending BetID, since bot cannot just "mess up". I guess you are not a programmer, so let me explain. The script is not a human and this is just an algorithm that was pretty straight forward. Even if the script contained some kind of an error, this would probably result in just crashing, but not spending specifically 4 BTC from my account. Especially, that sounds even less likely to happen, since logging was enabled and the logs show no such behavior.

[galustjan]

Otherwise PM me your username & I'll look into it -- If support hasn't been able to solve it there must not be missing balance on your account (Meaning your profit, withdrawals, deposits, tips all 0 sum up). In this case it is generally the assumption the account was compromised.

As I said we can look into it further for you none the less & come to a conclusion. It's very rare for coins to go missing on Primedice (Sometimes the DB will not log a TX - Never a bet however - causing the accounts 'difference' to be off put). From what I've read it seems like there has been an issue with your script. Hopefully I can pull up a whole bet log for you (Or Edward) and have this sorted ASAP.

Hope we can figure this out & get you playing again or at the least leaving a happy review.

Is there any news? I've dropped you a PM couple of days ago.

[7Priest7]

looks like you just got hit by a nasty luck to me. that or your script got an error and made an insane losing bet which it didn't log. I mean look at that stats. -928BTC? really?

It's possible that OP's script didn't log the loss, but it also seems really weird that PrimeDice has never given OP a reply. What's keeping them? It's true that they serve many users on a daily basis, but they shouldn't leave a customer hanging like this, especially after an unexplained loss of multiple bitcoins.

There are many PrimeDice representatives on this forum, so hopefully you can get a satisfactory answer from them. Have you tried PM'ing some of them?

well we all do mistakes, so maybe it forgot to log this huge loss, but it is also very weird, why primedice acts like this, looks like they don't want to give you your bitcoins back

thing you can do is to share this in internet, and don't use primedice anymore, can't do anything else with that

[JasonXG]

Well i'm not so sure what is going on here but your screenshot looks really odd. -928btc ?? what ?? Maybe i just don't understand how it works but i feel you not explaining enough. Having said that i don't know why PD support won't discuss this, they have something to hide ? Interesting....

[Mist]

Well i'm not so sure what is going on here but your screenshot looks really odd. -928btc ?? what ?? Maybe i just don't understand how it works but i feel you not explaining enough. Having said that i don't know why PD support won't discuss this, they have something to hide ? Interesting....

Maybe if you read the thread instead of spamming for fucking yobit you would know that that represents USD

[mexxer-2]

Having said that i don't know why PD support won't discuss this, they have something to hide ? Interesting....

Try reading through one page of the thread. Here's a snippet from Stunna, PD (co-)owner

-snip-

[onlinedragon]

Strange story I bet there is an explanation for this and hope they will sort it out for you. Stunna answered fast so the right person already is busy with this case.

[jonsi]

It is very strange the silence from Primedice. Regarding the fact that Stuna has replied to this thread and thei are unable to come with an unswer until now shure loocks like something very wrong had happend.

I hope you get your money back, or at least get an explenation of what happend.

I'm watching this thread to see how Primedice manage the situation.

[galustjan]

Thank you for your support. This is exactly the same silence that I received after my attempts to get an answer from them via email. Also, it's a week passed since I've dropped him a PM. At least, I hope they would not forge the database somehow. This is my main concern at the moment.

[bitcoin revo]

Thank you for your support. This is exactly the same silence that I received after my attempts to get an answer from them via email. Also, it's a week passed since I've dropped him a PM. At least, I hope they would not forge the database somehow. This is my main concern at the moment.

As much as this is abnormal, I would say that there isn't much of a concern of Primedice faking anything to disprove you. They're a huge gambling site that has a ton of reputation, both on the forum and on the web, and it wouldn't make sense to ruin it for an amount that is probably on the small side (compared to the size of their business).

I'd say give it a little more time, but keep gently pushing for a response. You have a right to want your bitcoins back, after all.

[galustjan]

I'd say give it a little more time, but keep gently pushing for a response. You have a right to want your bitcoins back, after all.

As you may have noticed, I was extremely calm during the initial contact with support. However, I think that more than a month is totally enough to query some values from the database (no matter how huge it is) and to prepare some sort of answer. It just requires a will to do so. From what I see, this will is lacking for whatever reason, pushing me into thinking that "something went wrong" on their side.

[Oriannaa]

If this is a technical error on primedice, usually they get on this..

So I dont know.. in this situation because its not the players job to log all their bet`s each time. So requesting that shouldnt be too hard.. unless you caught them at a bad time when they need oversee other important matters and forgot about it within that 1 month time frame.

[Superhitech]

If this is a technical error on primedice, usually they get on this..

So I dont know.. in this situation because its not the players job to log all their bet`s each time. So requesting that shouldnt be too hard.. unless you caught them at a bad time when they need oversee other important matters and forgot about it within that 1 month time frame.

If they forget, the trick is to keep asking. Don't ask too much as you can be seen as annoying and that may make them not solve your problem, but the occasional nudge for a reminder is necessary IMO. Primedice is a really busy site, and they have many users, so requests can get lost.

[galustjan]

Hey guys. Another week has passed and I still have no answer from PrimeDice. What would you recommend for me to do? I've a bit frustrated after almost 2 month of waiting, without even knowing that my case is being investigated.

[Monnt]

How did you lose 950 BTC with a balance of 4 BTC?

Hey guys. Another week has passed and I still have no answer from PrimeDice. What would you recommend for me to do? I've a bit frustrated after almost 2 month of waiting, without even knowing that my case is being investigated.

I'm going to have to say that you might need to contact dooglus. He's the founder I think, he should be able to help you.

[galustjan]

How did you lose 950 BTC with a balance of 4 BTC?

It was already explained earlier in the topic that 928 is not a BTC, but USD, converted using the specific conversion rate. Total balance is displayed in BTC and Total earnings are in USD, with conversion rate of 231 USD per BTC.

[MICRO]

Hey,

I told you already and just sent you another email.
You need to email edward@primedice.com.

As far as i can see you lost that amount in a bet or series of bets. That is 100% sure.
Now i cant query db for your username and check in which bet or bets you lost it.

You say you kept logs of everything?
Where is your bet logs up to a point where you noticed 4btc missing? You should be able to see it there.

Its extremely hard and expensive to be able to query db with 10 billion bets stored in it.

[galustjan]

Hey,

I told you already and just sent you another email.
You need to email edward@primedice.com.

As far as i can see you lost that amount in a bet or series of bets. That is 100% sure.
Now i cant query db for your username and check in which bet or bets you lost it.

You say you kept logs of everything?
Where is your bet logs up to a point where you noticed 4btc missing? You should be able to see it there.

Its extremely hard and expensive to be able to query db with 10 billion bets stored in it.

What do you mean by "where is your bet logs"? It's the last part of the logs for the period of time, when the 4 BTC were lost. By the way, it's not an expensive operation to query the DB, like you are trying to show it there, since it's just a simple query and it will be executed pretty fast even on such a big data set. It should look something like that: SELECT * FROM Bets WHERE username='john1980'; Or you can even narrow down the search by limiting the request to specific date range. So, this request will be executed in a matter of seconds. I've dealt with big data. Don't try to mislead the people here, who may not be well aware of the technical details.

And the last question: why can't you escalate that yourself, like a support staff? If you cannot solve the problem - escalate. It's a rule of a thumb in any respectable company. Your answer that I've lost that money and it's not a technical issue or mistake is having less proofs and just a guess. My point is based on the logs and other data that I have and presented in that topic.

[jonsi]

Hey,

I told you already and just sent you another email.
You need to email edward@primedice.com.

As far as i can see you lost that amount in a bet or series of bets. That is 100% sure.
Now i cant query db for your username and check in which bet or bets you lost it.

You say you kept logs of everything?
Where is your bet logs up to a point where you noticed 4btc missing? You should be able to see it there.

Its extremely hard and expensive to be able to query db with 10 billion bets stored in it.

This is starting to sound very much like bul...it. It is not hard nor expensive to be able to query db with 10 billion bets. DB's can work with trillions (yes trillions!) of rows in seconds. (https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/dataplatforminsider/2008/10/06/sql-server-2008-performs-1-trillion-row-query-in-seconds-at-bi-conference/).

I really hope to get your money back because this is ridiculous.

[jonsi]

Any news?

[Mist]

Incompetent coding is the issue here. You cant blame PD for your own mistakes.

[BitMaxz]

I never heard a problem like this and i think they can resolve it because primedice has a good reputation why dont you try to cantact the owner of the sites.. and i think more staffs here know about primedice.. maybe they can help you..

[galustjan]

Incompetent coding is the issue here. You cant blame PD for your own mistakes.

You are saying that, even without seeing the code. Very nice argument. I'm as open as I could, providing every evidence possible. From the other side it's nothing, except that it's "too hard to make a query in a huge DB", which is not true.

Any news?

Nothing specific yet. I'll be dropping an email to Edward today.

I never heard a problem like this and i think they can resolve it because primedice has a good reputation why dont you try to cantact the owner of the sites.. and i think more staffs here know about primedice.. maybe they can help you..

I will be contacting the owner (Edward) today. I haven't done that before for the reason explained below: escalation levels. I go from the bottom to the top, instead of reaching top management directly. They should've escalated that case themselves. However, they leave me no option either than do it myself.

[Dogedigital]

I don't get why OP has to be on the defensive here (even after filtering out the sig spammers)

He's being pretty open and is not being aggressive or hostile in the slightest.

Claims that it HAS to be incompetent coding or 100% a bet issue on his end without proof backing it up seems kind of unprofessional from a support member.

Fwiw, I think PrimeDice is an A+ site and service, but honestly I expected a little more out of this.