Someone just told me this today... WTF

[danieldaniel]

A person (who shall remain unnamed) in my high school told me that they bought an alienware laptop from someone (worth around $2k) for $250.  Immediately, alarm bells went off, so I asked him how he got it for so cheap.  What he said disgusted me:

He bought it from a guy in Italy who told him that it was with a stolen credit card.


I dont get this.  How can someone morally accept that they are blatantly defrauding some poor unsuspecting person?  I mean, I get it, Amazon.com will probably take the heat for it, but I still don't get it.

How the hell can people think that this is OK?  And, I mean, the guy was 14 or 15 years old.  At such a young age, buying a laptop with a stolen credit card.


I worry about the next generation of humanity.

[payb.tc]

almost everything has a good and a bad side

eg. the more credit cards that are stolen, the more careful people will be with their credit card numbers

he could be doing the 'victim' a favour... but no-one other than the victim will ever know whether this is the case


you are simply speculating that this is bad from his point of view, when in reality you don't know him, his personality, etc.

life-changing events can also change people's lives in a positive way, despite how unrelated third-parties may judge the event from the outside.

[danieldaniel]

almost everything has a good and a bad side

eg. the more credit cards that are stolen, the more careful people will be with their credit card numbers

he could be doing the 'victim' a favour... but no-one other than the victim will ever know whether this is the case


you are simply speculating that this is bad from his point of view, when in reality you don't know him, his personality, etc.

life-changing events can also change people's lives in a positive way, despite how unrelated third-parties may judge the event from the outside.

Well, it's not as if the victim had to have been stupid with their CC info.  Many credit card thefts are at no fault to the victim.

Also, I cant think of _one_ person who would want to have their CC stolen.  I don't think personality matters too much there.

[payb.tc]

Also, I cant think of _one_ person who would want to have their CC stolen.  I don't think personality matters too much there.

i never said he wanted to have his CC stolen, only that having it stolen may have had a positive effect on his life.

not knowing him or his situation or his personality, i can't say whether this event was bad or good.

[jcpham]

;;votekick danieldaniel

[danieldaniel]

Also, I cant think of _one_ person who would want to have their CC stolen.  I don't think personality matters too much there.

i never said he wanted to have his CC stolen, only that having it stolen may have had a positive effect on his life.

not knowing him or his situation or his personality, i can't say whether this event was bad or good.

I don't really understand what you're saying.  How can having something stolen -- not at fault to them -- have a positive effect on his life (not being sarcastic, I actually want to know what you're thinking)?

;;votekick danieldaniel

;;voteban jcpham
;;tell jcpham LOLUMADBRO

[payb.tc]

Also, I cant think of _one_ person who would want to have their CC stolen.  I don't think personality matters too much there.

i never said he wanted to have his CC stolen, only that having it stolen may have had a positive effect on his life.

not knowing him or his situation or his personality, i can't say whether this event was bad or good.

I don't really understand what you're saying.  How can having something stolen -- not at fault to them -- have a positive effect on his life (not being sarcastic, I actually want to know what you're thinking)?

this hardly requires much imagination, so it's perplexing that some may find it difficult, but here's just one of a billion possibilities:

guy is lonely, wants a girlfriend
guy has cc stolen, goes to bank to address the issue and meets the teller of his dreams
guy weds teller and has kids, grandkids
guy tells grandkids, "my life really turned around that day, i'm so glad my cc was stolen"


looking back, i can say that having had my house burgled in 1993 had a hugely positive effect on my diligence for security and data backups. and i'm glad it happened.

[JoelKatz]

He's not defrauding anyone. They just write it off. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCZRqH7sRyA

[MoonShadow]

Whether or not the victim is actually better off in the long run or not has nothing to do with the buyer's lack of moral convictions.

Of course, we are talking about a teenager in high school.  My own mores were not very solid at that age either.  But knowingly buying stolen property is still a crime.  Perhaps you should educate your schoolmate, if possible?

As for all this ;;voteban crap.  This is not a democracy.  No one gets kicked because they express an opinion, even if it's obviously bullsh*t.

[payb.tc]

Whether or not the victim is actually better off in the long run or not has nothing to do with the buyer's lack of moral convictions.

Of course, we are talking about a teenager in high school.  My own mores were not very solid at that age either.  But knowingly buying stolen property is still a crime. 

also, whether something is a crime or not ALSO has nothing to do with the buyer's morals or lack thereof.

[MoonShadow]

He's not defrauding anyone. They just write it off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCZRqH7sRyA

Just because they write it off, does not mean it's not a criminal activity.  This is exactly the reason why businesses that accept CC's have to increase their prices buy about 3%, in order to cover the chargeback theft & fraud.  It's just like how shoplifting increases the costs that everyone else pays.

Granted, that's one more reason for Bitcoin uptake, but it's still wrong no matter how you spin it.

[MoonShadow]

Whether or not the victim is actually better off in the long run or not has nothing to do with the buyer's lack of moral convictions.

Of course, we are talking about a teenager in high school.  My own mores were not very solid at that age either.  But knowingly buying stolen property is still a crime. 

also, whether something is a crime or not ALSO has nothing to do with the buyer's morals or lack thereof.

I intended "crime" in the malum in se sense.  That it's always wrong to knowingly buy stolen property, and it's illegal (or should be) as a reflection of that fact.

http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Malum+in+se

[payb.tc]

Just because they write it off, does not mean it's not a criminal activity.

are you being off-topic intentionally?

or are you accidentally confusing the law (not mentioned in the OP) with morality (mentioned in the OP)?

nm, read your above post.

[MoonShadow]

Just because they write it off, does not mean it's not a criminal activity.

are you being off-topic intentionally?

or are you accidentally confusing the law (not mentioned in the OP) with morality (mentioned in the OP)?

Dude, just keep reading.

[Monster Tent]

Someone should bring out a credit card where instead of the 3 secret numbers you can instead use a code generated by a yubikey or google auth etc. I think this would be a great invention 

[SgtSpike]

A person (who shall remain unnamed) in my high school told me that they bought an alienware laptop from someone (worth around $2k) for $250.  Immediately, alarm bells went off, so I asked him how he got it for so cheap.  What he said disgusted me:

He bought it from a guy in Italy who told him that it was with a stolen credit card.


I dont get this.  How can someone morally accept that they are blatantly defrauding some poor unsuspecting person?  I mean, I get it, Amazon.com will probably take the heat for it, but I still don't get it.

How the hell can people think that this is OK?  And, I mean, the guy was 14 or 15 years old.  At such a young age, buying a laptop with a stolen credit card.


I worry about the next generation of humanity.

I agree.  It's very sad to see people with such fuzzy morals that they cannot see how something like this is wrong.

[cedivad]

I live in Italy and and I was offered a 2012 MacBook Air for 300€ yesterday. I admit that I really wanted it but I refused.

[b!z]

I live in Italy and and I was offered a 2012 MacBook Air for 300€ yesterday. I admit that I really wanted it but I refused.

I'll take it. 

[danieldaniel]

Hah, this is funny.  The guy that he bought the alienware from scammed him, so now he's out $250.

Karma.  It's a bitch.

And I tried to "educate" him, but sadly he didn't really care.  All he could see is that he was getting a great deal on a laptop.  He didn't understand that someone paid for that.

[BigFigurez]

I think people do stuff like this without feeling guilt because of how much the credit card companies and banks rip people off. In the end, they're the ones who will pay for it.

That might just be me though. Still a sad thing to see someone do something like this :/