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Author Topic: Can you come up with a better Ten Commandments?  (Read 2058 times)
tabas
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May 03, 2016, 12:20:37 PM
 #41

Only one Commandment is enough.
Never cheat your woman/man. Grin Grin

This is still not enough to be a person with this one commandment. The bible says, that the 2 greatest commandment was written at Matthew 22:36-40
" Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."

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May 03, 2016, 04:23:31 PM
 #42

Do not harm or deceive anyone
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May 03, 2016, 04:51:42 PM
 #43

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
...
Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

Yes.

There is only 1 command, which combines spirituality, morality and logic. It is also the only command that can lead to a coherent output for societies and individuals alike:

Do what is in your best interest.

The only problem with the above "command", is that people don't really know what is in their best interest because the (current) environment is informing them in the wrong way. We are living in "dark ages" but we don't know it.

For example, if you can steal money and know with 100% certainty that you will not be caught, then traditional game theory will tell you that "the logical thing to do is steal them because you gain".

The problem is that this type of game theory does not account for the hidden costs of the silent observer - which is our subconscious (or superconscious).

When the subconscious watches what the conscious does, it says "if I'm stealing, then this means that I'm worthless to create what I want on my own". This observation then becomes a self-limiting self-suggestion that is extremely powerful. "I'm worthless / I'm a parasite". This is implied, signed and "sealed" by our own very actions.

What we do defines us and, by consequence, prescribes our own limitation - if what we do has self-limiting implications.

Humans have been looking for thousands of years for a system where people can be moral / ethical / law-abiding, without having a god or a policeman to watch over them. They will never find it for as long as they do not understand that cause and effect are already embedded in the human mind.

You steal? You become limited as a parasite. The "judgement" and "punishment" is served immediately as a consequence of our new self-definition. I am stealing = I'm a thief = I am worthless parasite.

Do I want to become a worthless parasite? No. Then why would I steal? Do I need a policeman? Do I need a God threatening me with hell? No.

Likewise for any other "sin". If I'm harming others it's only because I lack faith in myself to promote my wellbeing in any other way. Let's say I'm a worker who feels that by badmouthing a fellow worker I can advance my career. My subconscious sees me harming the other guy and asks "Would I need to be harming others if I could advance on my own? Therefore I'm useless to advance on my own - and that's why I have to resort to such tactics." And at that moment it's sealed that I'm useless. It's sealed that I do not have expanded potential. It's like dis-acknowledging it by my actions. The "punishment" is immediate. The "karma" is instant.

All Game Theory that is based on "rational behavior" while not accounting for the hidden costs of the silent observer = bad science.

Proper Game Theory accounts for the subconsciously implied programming and the associated costs of each action. It understands that there are two thought-streams, one conscious and one subconscious. It understands that what is a "gain" now is countered by a repeated "loss" down the line, where I lose again, and again, and again, because I programmed myself as a loser. So why would I do that? Why would *anyone* do that?

The only reason they would, is because they are unaware of the hidden costs of their behavior. It's 2016. It's about time everybody finds out about them.
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May 03, 2016, 05:53:06 PM
 #44

What about these two:

Thou shalt not fall for politicians.
Thou shalt not practice fractional reserve banking.

Those definetly need to be added on the commandments.

But the 2nd one pretty much falls upon the greed level lol, so I guess thats already covered.

I say adding to one "commandment". My version: Greed is welcomed as long you pay your fair taxes. lol.
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May 03, 2016, 06:08:49 PM
 #45

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt

Don't be a cunt
Moloch (OP)
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May 03, 2016, 06:33:39 PM
 #46

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
...
Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

Yes.

There is only 1 command, which combines spirituality, morality and logic. It is also the only command that can lead to a coherent output for societies and individuals alike:

Do what is in your best interest.

Game theory has it's own issues... it is often used to prove a point, but is not reliable or consistent in all situations

One example would be theft... it is bad if everyone is a thief, good if nobody is a thief... but, it is best if you are a thief and nobody else is a thief... but that is self-contradictory, if you assume more than 1 person understands this concept... it often leads to an impossible/catch-22 situation


I would again defer to the Aborigines:
Do what is in the best interest of everyone
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May 03, 2016, 06:59:05 PM
 #47

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
...
Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

Yes.

There is only 1 command, which combines spirituality, morality and logic. It is also the only command that can lead to a coherent output for societies and individuals alike:

Do what is in your best interest.

Game theory has it's own issues... it is often used to prove a point, but is not reliable or consistent in all situations

One example would be theft... it is bad if everyone is a thief, good if nobody is a thief... but, it is best if you are a thief and nobody else is a thief... but that is self-contradictory, if you assume more than 1 person understands this concept... it often leads to an impossible/catch-22 situation

If you factor the subconsciously implied self-limitations, then nobody would want to be a thief. The long-term losses far outweigh the short-term "gains". They aren't gains really.

Quote
I would again defer to the Aborigines:
Do what is in the best interest of everyone

This is automatically done by doing what is best for yourself. However it will require a broader understanding for the individual to understand what is best for themselves. That's the only thing missing right now.
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May 03, 2016, 07:25:27 PM
 #48

If you factor the subconsciously implied self-limitations, then nobody would want to be a thief. The long-term losses far outweigh the short-term "gains". They aren't gains really.

Sorry, I don't buy what you're selling...

There are no objective "subconsciously implied self-limitations"... this sounds like something you made up and could not possibly apply to everyone

You say the act of stealing means I'm not capable of building something on my own... there is no correlation; that's just silly nonsense... many thieves are highly creative
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May 03, 2016, 07:30:16 PM
 #49

You are simply uninformed. What I'm saying is also applied in hypnosis and suggestion. It is known as presupposition.

You "load" a sentence with a presupposition and it goes right through.

Actions are the same. They are subconscious presuppositions.
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May 03, 2016, 07:35:05 PM
 #50

You are simply uninformed. What I'm saying is also applied in hypnosis and suggestion. It is known as presupposition.

You "load" a sentence with a presupposition and it goes right through.

Actions are the same. They are subconscious presuppositions.

Its simply not true and you cannot possibly prove it

How do you know the correlation is not the other way around?  I could use the same evidence to say that uncreative people resort to thievery... it's because they are not capable of creating on their own that they must steal...
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May 03, 2016, 07:43:59 PM
 #51

You are simply uninformed. What I'm saying is also applied in hypnosis and suggestion. It is known as presupposition.

You "load" a sentence with a presupposition and it goes right through.

Actions are the same. They are subconscious presuppositions.

Its simply not true and you cannot possibly prove it

How do you know the correlation is not the other way around?  I could use the same evidence to say that uncreative people resort to thievery... it's because they are not capable of creating on their own that they must steal...

I cannot prove what is already proven. What do you think the placebo effect is? It's a presupposition / an implied suggestion. If I'm taking this pill, then surely it must do something - otherwise I wouldn't be taking it. Thus I get better.

It also escalates depending the degree of "sacrifice". For example a red capsule may be more efficient than a white pill (all inert / all made of the same substance). And an inert injection can be even more potent than either. Why? Because the subconscious goes like "if I'm going through all this painful process, then surely it must have some positive effect". An injection is a bigger "sacrifice" than drinking a pill. So the "reward" implied is also greater, and it shows.

What you are saying can happen but you must first accept the programming from your environment (in other words being convinced that you have crappy creativity and that it can't get better - when this is false). So you fall into the self-defeating trap of cheating/stealing etc which then "cements" the belief you originally had, which then starts going into a downward spiral of confirmation and repetition.
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May 03, 2016, 07:58:31 PM
 #52

Honestly, you sound like a religious preacher now... asserting things as true, which are not self-evident as such

You make way too many assumptions, such as the placebo affect being a presupposition that you will get better... there are many more likely explanations with more evident credibility

you are also way off topic, please get back on topic
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May 03, 2016, 08:10:29 PM
Last edit: May 06, 2016, 06:33:07 AM by Moloch
 #53

1. Though shalt not use force.
2. Though shalt not deceive.
3. Be excellent to one another.

+1 for #3

Bill and Ted were the most excellent philosophers
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May 06, 2016, 05:13:46 AM
 #54

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
But, since everyone enjoys lists of 10, I decided to go a bit further and fill it out with some substance:

1. Do not harm or deceive anyone
2. Help those less fortunate
3. Identify and improve your own flaws and weaknesses
4. Be observant and considerate
5. Do not be greedy; never take more than you need
6. Think critically before making important decisions
7. Give people the benefit of the doubt; walk a mile in the other person's shoes
8. Lead by example
9. Be kinder to others than they are to you
10. Make the world a better place for our children


It may not be perfect, but I would argue that it is a better list than the bible

What do you think?

Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

according to me, your ten commandements are better than previous one.. moses and other prophets were really fucked up.. for me, you shoul start a new regilion with these commandments.
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May 06, 2016, 06:42:30 AM
 #55

according to me, your ten commandements are better than previous one.. moses and other prophets were really fucked up.. for me, you shoul start a new regilion with these commandments.

I have been thinking about doing something along those lines, and plan to bring it up at the Reason Rally next month...

I'd hate to call it a religion... but, I have been listening to some of the legitimate criticism of atheists, and it makes sense in a way

I am referring to a couple things really... one is that atheists don't have any specific moral code or whatever... I think some religious people would have an easier transition into being an atheist, if atheists had a book they could teach their children morals from that didn't revolve around a god

Atheists have also been criticized for being negative, without much positive... I completely disagree with this statement, atheists do plenty of good things all the time... but, I'm a big fan of leading by example... I'd attend an atheist church, where we read from our book of logic and facts... then cooked some food to feed the local homeless or something... that'd be swell

It's one thing to say, "Hey religitards, you're doing it wrong"... but the right thing to say is, "Watch me, I'll show you how it should be done"
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May 07, 2016, 07:52:47 PM
 #56

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
But, since everyone enjoys lists of 10, I decided to go a bit further and fill it out with some substance:

1. Do not harm or deceive anyone
2. Help those less fortunate
3. Identify and improve your own flaws and weaknesses
4. Be observant and considerate
5. Do not be greedy; never take more than you need
6. Think critically before making important decisions
7. Give people the benefit of the doubt; walk a mile in the other person's shoes
8. Lead by example
9. Be kinder to others than they are to you
10. Make the world a better place for our children


It may not be perfect, but I would argue that it is a better list than the bible

What do you think?

Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

The Christians commandements are a semplification of the 613 mitzvot from the Jews tradition.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_commandments

Commandments are 613 not 10.

Have a nice time in reading those.


Best regards.


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Moloch (OP)
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May 07, 2016, 09:10:20 PM
 #57

I decided the morality of the ten commandments could be boiled down into, "Do not harm or deceive anyone"...
But, since everyone enjoys lists of 10, I decided to go a bit further and fill it out with some substance:

1. Do not harm or deceive anyone
2. Help those less fortunate
3. Identify and improve your own flaws and weaknesses
4. Be observant and considerate
5. Do not be greedy; never take more than you need
6. Think critically before making important decisions
7. Give people the benefit of the doubt; walk a mile in the other person's shoes
8. Lead by example
9. Be kinder to others than they are to you
10. Make the world a better place for our children


It may not be perfect, but I would argue that it is a better list than the bible

What do you think?

Can you come up with a better list, or improve upon what I've got going here?

The Christians commandements are a semplification of the 613 mitzvot from the Jews tradition.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_commandments

Commandments are 613 not 10.

Have a nice time in reading those.

Good to see you are more capable of learning than BADlogic...

Being a Jew myself, I am familiar with the 613 commandments...

The first of which is, "I am the lord your god"... which isn't even a commandment... prolly why the christians skipped that one and went straight to number 2 as their first commandment

Most of them are bullshit and repetitive... including things like not cutting your sideburns, eating meat and dairy in the same meal, wearing clothes made of 2 different fabrics, etc... stupid shit
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May 12, 2016, 02:35:30 AM
 #58

I happened across another list by a humanist

1.    Love well
2.    Seek the good in all things
3.    Harm no others
4.    Think for yourself
5.    Take responsibility
6.    Respect nature
7.    Do your utmost
8.    Be informed
9.    Be kind
10.   Be courageous
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May 12, 2016, 05:26:12 AM
 #59

I happened across another list by a humanist

1.    Love well
2.    Seek the good in all things
3.    Harm no others
4.    Think for yourself
5.    Take responsibility
6.    Respect nature
7.    Do your utmost
8.    Be informed
9.    Be kind
10.   Be courageous


I think # 4 is very selfish. Why would you just think for yourself. It is better if you will also care for others.
I think you must replace it with this : Quoted bottom.

1. Though shalt not use force.
2. Though shalt not deceive.
3. Be excellent to one another.

Vires in Numeris
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May 12, 2016, 05:57:18 AM
 #60

I happened across another list by a humanist

1.    Love well
2.    Seek the good in all things
3.    Harm no others
4.    Think for yourself
5.    Take responsibility
6.    Respect nature
7.    Do your utmost
8.    Be informed
9.    Be kind
10.   Be courageous


I think # 4 is very selfish. Why would you just think for yourself. It is better if you will also care for others.
I think you must replace it with this : Quoted bottom.

1. Though shalt not use force.
2. Though shalt not deceive.
3. Be excellent to one another.

I think some have of this have the same gist,

Be kind and love well

respect nature and harm no other

Some belongs to one category in my opinion.

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