ETH = Game Over

[Bit_Happy]

ETH is down and maybe out. But let's stop kidding ourselves....

"Let's stop kidding ourselves"
OK
Let's stop kidding ourselves:
Why was he able to raise over $150M for the DAO, before prices crashed?

And...
How can we prevent the next 'scammer' from raising over $100M?

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[BlindMayorBitcorn]

I'm looking forward to the smart contract that guarantees a miner a million ETH for processing the "attacker" transactions. Someone will be bought. And I'll be ready with popped corn.

[iamnotback]

I'm looking forward to the smart contract that guarantees a miner a million ETH for processing the "attacker" transactions. Someone will be bought. And I'll be ready with popped corn.

I agree. I doubt the attacker is done. He has a counter move. I know the attacker from past debates with him.

Those buying ETH at $12 are taking a risk. The carnage may not be over yet.

He is probably letting more fools go long (to maximize the lesson he is trying to teach them) before he renews his 2000 BTC shorts and attacks anew.

[patronis]

ETH will resurge, mark my words its a good time to buy in the upcoming days because it will rise again to its peaks

[laugh2btc]

ETH will resurge, mark my words its a good time to buy in the upcoming days because it will rise again to its peaks

It will fall under 10$. Mark my words

[Bit_Happy]

ETH will resurge, mark my words its a good time to buy in the upcoming days because it will rise again to its peaks

It will fall under 10$. Mark my words

ETH could easily go under $0.25 (less than 25 cents), and I am not attempting to buy cheap crap.

[angaper]

An interesting reflection. But I have always wondered if all this technical specification are really taken into account by speculators. Unfortunately this interesting digital economy has become a speculative market where sometimes it is more important your financial ability rather than your technical knowledge.

And that is why I think we will still have lots of ethereum lovers and enthusiasts for long.

[tuapoma]

With ethereum and DAO we can see that only mass advertising is already able to encourage crowds without knowledge invest crazily. But I never liked ether, working with a coin with an endless inflation is a scheduled disaster.

..."INTHEOREUM

ULTRA-CENTRALIZED TURING INCOMPLETE ARBITRARY TRUST APPLICATION ECONOMY

BASED ON BOBCHAIN TECHNOLOGY"... 

[1btcdream]

ETH will resurge, mark my words its a good time to buy in the upcoming days because it will rise again to its peaks

It will fall under 10$. Mark my words

ETH could easily go under $0.25 (less than 25 cents), and I am not attempting to buy cheap crap.

Then I will buy loads of ETH if that ever happens.

[iamnotback]

ETH could easily go under $0.25 (less than 25 cents), and I am not attempting to buy cheap crap.

Then I will buy loads of ETH if that ever happens.

[Karolus]

The people who bought bitcoin at $800, or $900, or $1,000 might beg to differ that bitcoin is not risky. So would the people who experienced bitcoin drop from $1,000 in 2014 to $200 in 2015. Whether or not that volatility is a "systemic risk," some people lose plenty in the bitcoin lottery.

I didnt said its not risky, i said that it probably doesnt have big impending systemic risk in it.

Price volatility =/= shitty code that could crash the price to 0.

It's not "bitcoin lottery", it's called a market.

Yes, one can describe a lottery as a market: a market for luck. No currency typically has the huge volatility that bitcoin has. That volatility is one reason only an extremely tiny minority regards bitcoin as a currency.

[Spoetnik]

The people who bought bitcoin at $800, or $900, or $1,000 might beg to differ that bitcoin is not risky. So would the people who experienced bitcoin drop from $1,000 in 2014 to $200 in 2015. Whether or not that volatility is a "systemic risk," some people lose plenty in the bitcoin lottery.

I didnt said its not risky, i said that it probably doesnt have big impending systemic risk in it.

Price volatility =/= shitty code that could crash the price to 0.

It's not "bitcoin lottery", it's called a market.

Yes, one can describe a lottery as a market: a market for luck. No currency typically has the huge volatility that bitcoin has. That volatility is one reason only an extremely tiny minority regards bitcoin as a currency.

Actually "Newbie" the WORLD regards it as a "Currency"
And that is who matters.. not crypto nerd investard blow hards on 'The Talk.

[dste123]

ETH will resurge, mark my words its a good time to buy in the upcoming days because it will rise again to its peaks

It will fall under 10$. Mark my words

ETH could easily go under $0.25 (less than 25 cents), and I am not attempting to buy cheap crap.

Then I will buy loads of ETH if that ever happens.

Ditto...would definitely buy up ETH if it dropped that low.

[iamnotback]

Interesting https://medium.com/@gitguild/not-too-late-for-humans-to-save-ethereum-2f42f5fdfb75#.72e3lnkzs

Anyone know more about the author's background? Any LinkedIn? I am curious because he said he works for DASH.

I was in the midst of writing a similar post (here is the post), but with somewhat different conclusions.

So Ira Miller appears to now be a key coder for Dash?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzgUGU_RMGI#t=480

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Coinapult

Appearently the Dash dev-team was thinking about this a lot more in depth then any of us could have guessed :

https://dashtalk.org/threads/prioritization-of-fiat-gateways.8457/

Fiat access ramps development will be prioritized by the core team over PR and advertising during the next few months

...

The core team sees a need to strengthen direct FIAT access ramps to Dash in order to move into our next growth phase. We need to nurture the development of a rich ecosystem of user oriented applications.
Different user oriented applications are being created for Dash, like crypto ATMs, point of sale solutions, payment gateways, etc.  Nevertheless we are currently missing one fundamental layer - all these user applications need more liquid and better FIAT – DASH exchange services to clear on, including fixed price broker services, instant FIAT exchange, bid/ask FIAT exchanges, etc.

...

Coinapult Integration

As part of this project, Dash will be integrated to Coinapult. Coinapult is a Bitcoin wallet service provider. Coinapult offers online consumer and B2B services to a global market. It was founded in 2012 by Ira Miller and Erik Voorhees and was the first to offer bitcoin e-wallet services by email and SMS. In 2014, Coinapult was first to market with Locks, a service to help mitigate the price volatility of Bitcoin.
Ira Miller sold Coinapult in 2015 and remains an external advisor and provider of backend tools. Current CEO of Coinapult Gabriel Sukenik is leading the company to new frontiers, they recently integrated with Mycelium to offer Bitcoin locking services directly from the Mycelium app.
Coinapult will be integrating Dash to all of their existing services which include fully convertible USD accounts for DASH. Dash will be the first crypto-currency, other than Bitcoin, to be added to this service.
More partners are expected to join this consortium over time. For example, Mycelium is already integrated with Coinapult. With Dash’s being added to Coinapult too, that brings us one step closer to convertible to USD mobile accounts.

[regexlove]

a) All blockchain software is evolving, just like bitcoin may needs to change block-size soon. Any blockchain could come up with the future option to only require most nodes to verify history for a minimum of x years, while other full 'archive nodes' get extra reward.

Evolving into what? Bitcoin wont change the blocksize because its the only variable that gives it stability.

oh, so you also think it is part of "bitcoin's character/brand" to stop growing once a limit of transactions per second is reached?

c) Wreckless? Prove it.  On Github about  2200 Bitcoin Bugs were documented to be fixed and  1300 for Ethereum.  Few other crypto economy projects have 150-500 bugs fixed while most are below 150 - so is TheDAO! (only 37 yet)

Just because bugs werent detected that deosnt mean they arent there. There are most likely many more hundreds of 0 day bugs in it waiting to be discovered.

Could be true about most software.
- I said if number of bugs fixed on github and market-cap were correlated, then the ETH dump would be unnecessary.
Again, what happened was only a TheDAO bug.  Which should remind people, that the code should still have been in a beta/test phase, considering that it is both new and that the huge amount of money is a higher 'incentive' for hackers than other projects, holding much less money still.

g) Centralized, how exactly? More than Ripple?
h) They are not deciding it nor are they able to.
They are only taking their responsibility to inform the public about the options that the public has. And these are obvious options that could apply to many other Blockchains (Crypto currencies) too and at any time.
i) not even the bitcoinXT propsal killed bitcoin, did it?

Dont compare it to ripple. I`m pretty sure they called to action all nodes and exchanges to tell them what to do.

I was ironic, trying to say none of your points justify the title of the thread.
-
If the community can collectively decide to fork or anything, that will be a great
prove of spontaneous decentral governance/correction,
it will simply undo the theft but noway change the decentralized nature.

Fork or hard fork are not bad words but rather general. To declare it to be deadly to ETH, that developers even mentioned the obvious options,
is more of an attempt to confuse in favor of the FUD, dump&pump in the context of these days.

The positive part of 'distributed' is 'democratic'!
The fear is 'zombie robots immune to correction'!
A community able to clearly decide something will be a vital-sign!

Now they might not obey them ,but still its a command & control currency.

BitcoinXT had barely any legitimacy, the ETH devs obviously have a lot in ETH.

Prove it!

j) It was a temporary idea during evaluating the incident.  They made sure to cancel this request within 2 hours, since it was not necessary.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/4oif2x/dao_attack_exchanges_please_pause_eth_and_dao/
Exchanges did not or hardly react on this.

Ok so it was temporary, i can accept that, so i will remove this point from the OP.

Still not the best course of action in my opinion, but at least it was short lived.

I understand the urgency and the heat of action, but still this was a command & control approach.

Thanks, you may also want to correct your calculation of blockchain size. 89kb is not the "average blocksize" but the maximum. https://etherchain.org/statistics/basic

k) There are more possible solution and mild ones. This is mainly about a TheDAO bugh - the only thing serious is that the subject of discussion also hold ~4.5% of Ethereums market capitalization = ~3 month worth of Ethereum's mining production = inflation  
(- Still  Rather tiny compared to the speed Etherum was rising in the last two years despite inflation.)

It was the trust that was broken, the trust in devs, the trust in their skills and the trust in their decentralization promises. That causes more damage than just the missing ethereum.

What do you refer to?
Nothing happened these days to change the trust in the Ethereum developer's skills  (nor even potentially changing the decentralization of the whole network as explained above)
I just thought you were afraid of single people having high authority/influence in programming decisions. But now it sounds like arguing it is mandatory for Ethereum to stay alive? There are many people reviewing the open source code.

[RealBitcoin]

Yes, one can describe a lottery as a market: a market for luck. No currency typically has the huge volatility that bitcoin has. That volatility is one reason only an extremely tiny minority regards bitcoin as a currency.

It's a market, period. I suggest you to learn how a market works, it has a very delicate mechanism that adjusts the price.

Yes high volatility is not preferable to investors, but it's preferable to traders. And the more traders join, the less volatile it becomes.

Add then the technical stability of bitcoin, and it can become a full currency in the next years if everything goes fine.

Which cannot be said for ethereum, as it just demonstrated that it's not technically stable, and no advertising can change that.

[RealBitcoin]

oh, so you also think it is part of "bitcoin's character/brand" to stop growing once a limit of transactions per second is reached?

No, I`m saying that the sidechain approach is much more elegant and secure and decentralized, as a scaling option.

Hardfork for bitcoin is not an option, it only leads to centralization and abuse of power.

Could be true about most software.
- I said if number of bugs fixed on github and market-cap were correlated, then the ETH dump would be unnecessary.
Again, what happened was only a TheDAO bug.  Which should remind people, that the code should still have been in a beta/test phase, considering that it is both new and that the huge amount of money is a higher 'incentive' for hackers than other projects, holding much less money still.

Then why it was advertised? Why did they plan to release anything significant until all bugs were fixed?

It's like a car company that tries to sell a car with 3 wheels, and then blames the buyer for buying it.

I was ironic, trying to say none of your points justify the title of the tread.
-
If the community can collectively decide to fork or anything, that will be a great
prove of spontaneous decentral governance/correction,
it will simply undo the theft but noway change the decentralized nature.

Fork or hard fork are not bad words but rather general. To declare it to be deadly to ETH, that developers even mentioned the obvious options,
is more of an attempt to confuse in favor of the FUD, dump&pump these days, in this context. 

The positive part of 'distributed' is 'democratic'!
The fear is 'zombie robots immune to correction'!
A community able to clearly decide something will be a vital-sign!

At this point it doesnt matter what happens, ethereum will end up in bad situation in any outcome. Some outcomes are worse than others but all are bad.

Prove it!

A benevolent dictator is still a dictator.

What do you refer to?
Nothing happened these days to change the trust in their skills or to even change the decentralization of the whole network
I thought you were against single people having with high authority/influence in programming decisions.
Luckly there are many people reviewing the open source code.

Well the bug was a pretty big thing, that probably made many people lose their trust in devs.

You dont start selling a car with 3 wheels, and then advertise it as a wonderful DAO that can change humanity, when they cant even bugtest it properly.

Thanks, you may also want to correct your calculation of blockchain size. 89kb is not the "average blocksize" but the maximum. https://etherchain.org/statistics/basic

The maximum will be hit eventually, and ETH doesnt have elegant scaling solution like sidechains, so it will have to be hardforked.

Which will add even bigger blocksizes, so the blockchain will be very fast very big, and only datacenters can hold it soon.

[regexlove]

So you agree that this is about TheDAO and your thread-title is wrong

I'm just so fed up with FUD - so here is some attempted counter-measure:
https://www.betmoose.com/bet/ethereum-eth-in-usd-one-month-from-now-1960?ref=regexlove
(And about TheDAO: https://www.betmoose.com/bet/price-worth-of-thedao-dao-in-eth-in-1-month-1962?ref=regexlove )


Participate if you dare.  i expect you to set a huge bet on a low price!  (As long as you don't change the title of the topic)

[bazar165g]

I hardly think that ETH game is over may be the blockchain has given us another chance to reinvest in ETH.
MAY BE..MY 2 CENTS.

[BitUsher]

I hardly think that ETH game is over may be the blockchain has given us another chance to reinvest in ETH.
MAY BE..MY 2 CENTS.

Shitcoins usually have a long life . You can still buy paycoin for $ 0.009534 . When we say over we mean interest starts to slowly fade, devs start dropping off and move to other projects , and the price slowly capitulating. Those investing now will be playing a game of hot potato because this project days are numbered.  The writing is on the wall. Ethereum is inherently insecure as we have always warned.



It is getting worse. The DAOAttaker is playing with all the ethereum devs and staying one step ahead.

http://pastebin.com/9MRVDC9h