Social security is the govs way of saying you are too stupid to save your own $$

[notig]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

[FirstAscent]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

Actually, it's not stupid. I'm sure there are some hundred million or so that are thankful that their parents receive a social security check.

[Mike Christ]

Over half of America's budget goes into Social Security and Welfare.

To contrast, 2% is spent on education, another 2% on advances in medicine and science.  Anyone who finds this agreeable is the end result of a nation whose budget for education is 2%, while socialism, warfare and debt interest make up almost the entirety of the rest.

[notig]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

Actually, it's not stupid. I'm sure there are some hundred million or so that are thankful that their parents receive a social security check.

"thanks govn't for giving me my money back and saving it for me" . Meanwhile the government hopes that you die before you get what you put into it back out.

[FirstAscent]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

Actually, it's not stupid. I'm sure there are some hundred million or so that are thankful that their parents receive a social security check.

"thanks govn't for giving me my money back and saving it for me" . Meanwhile the government hopes that you die before you get what you put into it back out.

When you hit hard times, and draw upon your savings to get by, and then find your savings depleted, I'm sure you'll sing a different tune. The irony, of course, is despite your claim of not being short-sighted about saving your money,  you actually are too short-sighted to anticipate what can really happen.

[myrkul]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

Actually, it's not stupid. I'm sure there are some hundred million or so that are thankful that their parents receive a social security check.

"thanks govn't for giving me my money back and saving it for me" . Meanwhile the government hopes that you die before you get what you put into it back out.

When you hit hard times, and draw upon your savings to get by, and then find your savings depleted, I'm sure you'll sing a different tune. The irony, of course, is despite your claim of not being short-sighted about saving your money,  you actually are too short-sighted to anticipate what can really happen.

And when the Social security system is revealed for the ponzi it is, and the coffers are dry, that tune will come to a grinding, screeching halt.

[notig]

I guess I like the idea of personal responsibility and the freedom that comes with it. What right even does the government have to take some of your money and "save" it for you? If someone is too stupid not to save part of their paycheck then that's their fault.  If people want to develop a form of old people insurance then it should be something that is voluntary. Whoever wants in can get in. But you shouldn't force people.

[saddambitcoin]

when i hit hard times, i'll blow my brains out.  and give my bitcoins to my mom.  fick social security

[dotcom]

The whole idea of social security appalls me. The idea that they take some of our money to save it for us. And in reality they just go and dip into those funds to spend at will. It's stupid.

The only difference between social security and a ponzi scheme is that a ponzi scheme is voluntary.

[FirstAscent]

I guess I like the idea of personal responsibility and the freedom that comes with it. What right even does the government have to take some of your money and "save" it for you? If someone is too stupid not to save part of their paycheck then that's their fault.  If people want to develop a form of old people insurance then it should be something that is voluntary. Whoever wants in can get in. But you shouldn't force people.

Your views and opinions are not very well articulated, nor do they factor in a lot of conditions which you, in your zeal, fail to acknowledge, or more likely, simply are too blind to see. Let me summarize how I see you:

You: "Drrruhh! Can't force me! Uuuunhhh!"

I have news for you. Force is a component of both nature and society. It compels, guides and influences everybody.

Now, regarding Social Security: in order for you to discuss it, you first need to understand it. Start with the fact that Social Security is not the equivalent of a savings plan. At the very least, please, understand that. Once you've done that, you can, should, and will stop equating it to you saving money.

[myrkul]

Yes, Social Security is not a savings plan. It's more like forced insurance. They're stealing your money and giving it to someone else. It requires an ever-expanding base of payers in order to support the payouts. There is another activity which matches that description...

[FirstAscent]

Yes, Social Security is not a savings plan. It's more like forced insurance. They're stealing your money and giving it to someone else. It requires an ever-expanding base of payers in order to support the payouts. There is another activity which matches that description...

At least you're intelligent enough to understand it more closely resembles insurance. It makes more sense to discuss it in that context rather than as savings.

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

[myrkul]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

[dancupid]

$$$ is not the measure of the value of life or intelligence  - if people are living freely on social security without wasting 8 hours a day helping shareholders make a profit doing some pointless repetitive meaningless task wasting their single chance of existence, then they are clearly cleverer than the rest of us.

[FirstAscent]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

[myrkul]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

I suppose they would block up traffic. Well, that's what street cleaning services are for.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

Note your use of the phrase "pretty much." That means "not exactly."

In fact, it's actually the opposite. I refuse to force others to accept the burden. That places the burden on the people who failed to plan by default. No force needed. All is actually needed is to refuse force.

[FirstAscent]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

I suppose they would block up traffic. Well, that's what street cleaning services are for.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

Note your use of the phrase "pretty much." That means "not exactly."

In fact, it's actually the opposite. I refuse to force others to accept the burden. That places the burden on the people who failed to plan by default. No force needed. All is actually needed is to refuse force.

You were doing so well with regard to comprehension. Now you're regressing. Go back and reread my post(s).

[myrkul]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

I suppose they would block up traffic. Well, that's what street cleaning services are for.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

Note your use of the phrase "pretty much." That means "not exactly."

In fact, it's actually the opposite. I refuse to force others to accept the burden. That places the burden on the people who failed to plan by default. No force needed. All is actually needed is to refuse force.

You were doing so well with regard to comprehension. Now you're regressing. Go back and reread my post(s).

I understood what you were saying perfectly. You're just wrong.

Refusing to pay for someone else's retirement is not the same as using force against them.

Please remember that, as an insurance/Ponzi scheme, one's SSI is not paid for with one's own money. It's paid for with other people's money, which is taken from them by force. If it were my own money coming back to me, that would make it a savings account.

If we stop using force, that will shift the burden back to the retirees.

[FirstAscent]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

I suppose they would block up traffic. Well, that's what street cleaning services are for.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

Note your use of the phrase "pretty much." That means "not exactly."

In fact, it's actually the opposite. I refuse to force others to accept the burden. That places the burden on the people who failed to plan by default. No force needed. All is actually needed is to refuse force.

You were doing so well with regard to comprehension. Now you're regressing. Go back and reread my post(s).

I understood what you were saying perfectly. You're just wrong.

Refusing to pay for someone else's retirement is not the same as using force against them.

Please remember that, as an insurance/Ponzi scheme, one's SSI is not paid for with one's own money. It's paid for with other people's money, which is taken from them by force. If it were my own money coming back to me, that would make it a savings account.

If we stop using force, that will shift the burden back to the retirees.

Force aside, let's review how insurance works: other people's misfortune is paid for by all insurance subscribers. Do you understand that? I assume you do. If you don't, go study the principles of insurance.

Once you've done that, we can move on to force. As you know, buying automobile insurance is forced. I know you disagree with that concept, but it's reality. Can you think of other ways in which society forces things? I think you can. Please enumerate some.

[myrkul]

Now, regarding the forcing, auto insurance is forced as well. A good foundation for discussion would be why insurance is forced in the first place.

A better foundation would be discussing why anything is forced. If it's important and necessary, people will do it themselves. And if they do not, the consequences should be on them, not the rest of us.

Old people on the street are consequences on society, not just the individual.

I suppose they would block up traffic. Well, that's what street cleaning services are for.

You say the consequences should be on them. Note your use of the word 'should'. That word pretty much sounds like a demand. A demand is pretty much the suggestion of force. Now we're back to square one. Forcing. You seem to be in agreement with me actually. In order to put the burden on them, we should force them to pay over their lifetime.

Note your use of the phrase "pretty much." That means "not exactly."

In fact, it's actually the opposite. I refuse to force others to accept the burden. That places the burden on the people who failed to plan by default. No force needed. All is actually needed is to refuse force.

You were doing so well with regard to comprehension. Now you're regressing. Go back and reread my post(s).

I understood what you were saying perfectly. You're just wrong.

Refusing to pay for someone else's retirement is not the same as using force against them.

Please remember that, as an insurance/Ponzi scheme, one's SSI is not paid for with one's own money. It's paid for with other people's money, which is taken from them by force. If it were my own money coming back to me, that would make it a savings account.

If we stop using force, that will shift the burden back to the retirees.

Force aside, let's review how insurance works: other people's misfortune is paid for by all insurance subscribers. Do you understand that? I assume you do. If you don't, go study the principles of insurance.

Yes, I understand that. As long as it's voluntary, I've no problem with it.
 

Once you've done that, we can move on to force. As you know, buying automobile insurance is forced. I know you disagree with that concept, but it's reality. Can you think of other ways in which society forces things? I think you can. Please enumerate some.

Do your own homework.