Greed will catch up with you.

[Timon2010]

In the end, is anyone using BTC for anything other than speculating?

We also do buy stuff with bitcoin. Look in different threads and you'll see.

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[Luckybit]

I don't get it..a lot of the new comers into Bitcoin are treating Bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme.

I've seen posts here (and other places) going on about how they're going to take out huge, huge loans to buy Bitcoin.

Why? Simply so they can hold, hold, hold, and resell at a higher price....

I also know a couple people personally that are buying to resell...One of them has 2.7 mill invested. He's going to dump as soon as his investment reaches 25%. I know someone else that doesn't even have a job and she put all assets into Bitcoin.

I feel like nowadays every newcomer is acquiring Bitcoins to get rich. They aren't here for anything else. This is a giant greed bubble IMO. Nothing else.

This isn't about currency revolution... It's all about investment/greed speculation now. It isn't about screwing over the banks or government or evolving anything, It's now about buying in and selling at higher prices and selling for a nice paper money increase.

Greedy speculators will be the death of Bitcoin.. If hacks and the government don't kill it first. This whole thing is becoming a joke really due to human greed.
You Idiots taking out a second mortgage on your house and living off ramen (I know several of you personally (4)) I will give you no sympathy when this greed raged currency crashes.

I will keep using Bitcoin if it = 1 cent or 100 bucks, It doesn't matter to me.

You people expecting an infinite price increase so they can sell out and retire, I will be here to laugh at you when it falls through the floor because of speculative greed.

I think the difference isn't about greed. Everyone expects to get something in return for their investment either their time or their money. The difference is some people understand what Bitcoin is and why it is and some people don't. If you work via the Internet already, and have made money online before, then you are in an excellent position to understand the value of Bitcoin. It's the best form of payment the Internet can offer and if you produce content and currently get paid pennies on the dollar then Bitcoin will be good for you.

[Luckybit]

In the end, is anyone using BTC for anything other than speculating?

I think that if BTC survives after the bursting of this bubble, then it will truly become an alternative global currency.

If it doesn't- another digital currency will come along and pick up on the lessons learned.

I'd love to sell my content for Bitcoin. I'm just waiting for the infrastructure to allow micropayments via Bitcoin instead of dollars and then I'm all in.

[BitcoinAshley]

Yes, it's cool, just make vast stereotypes about "all the new people coming into bitcoin" based on a few forum posts you've seen from people hoping to get rich quick.

Just make assumptions about everyone's motives, assume that no one cares about the fundamentals or the revolutionary aspects of bitcoin or its potential to take on the crony banksters -

Good luck with that brah ;-) I'm going to go to another thread now.

[ZephramC]

Yes, it's cool, just make vast stereotypes about "all the new people coming into bitcoin" based on a few forum posts you've seen from people hoping to get rich quick.

Just make assumptions about everyone's motives, assume that no one cares about the fundamentals or the revolutionary aspects of bitcoin or its potential to take on the crony banksters -

Good luck with that brah ;-) I'm going to go to another thread now.

Exactly. There is a great variety among new adopters.

[befuddled]

I will keep using Bitcoin if it = 1 cent or 100 bucks, It doesn't matter to me.

Regarding using bitcoin as a transactional currecncy; the simple fact is, in order for it to function in a widespread way for a significant fraction of the population, it has to have a much larger valuation than it presently does. The monetary base is on the order of trillions of US dollars. There's simply no way for a fraction of the transactions (business and personal) that occur in the world to take place unless bitcoin has a market cap on the same order of magnitude. So even if there was no one speculating in a get-rich-quick-fashion, the price would still first have to follow a trajectory to much higher $/BTC. It's conceivable BTC is doing that that now substantially on the back of people who want to do money transfers from and to places with capital controls or financial repression. Or it could be that some small fraction of the world is choosing to diversify a small fraction of their savings into this new asset class, not in a speculative manner, but merely for risk management. Are you so sure that's not what's happening, more so than speculation?

Now as for why people don't choose to spend their bitcoins: if one has dollars, and one has bitcoins, and can purchase a good with either one, Gresham's law (or something much like it) will always push people to spend the one that can be debased or seized (a la Cyprus) by the central bankers or sovereigns. Seems natural and expected to me that people don't choose to spend their bitcoins if they don't have to, and thus there's not much consumption transacted in it. I suspect bitcoin is resistant to circulation for the same reason 60% silver US coins don't circulate at face value.

I know some people are buying and holding bitcoins not in a speculative manner, but merely as a means of saving in a currency that can't be inflated away (or inflated away beyond the increase in coins that's already built into the system). I was taught that saving for the future was virtuous. "Hoarding", near as near as I can tell, is merely a pejorative way of saying "saving". If dollars or whatever your favored vehicle for saving, in your judgement, is a good, no one is calling you "Idiot" for doing so. OK some people might. Not me at least. Please allow others to have a different opinion on the matter of whether saving in bitcoin is idiocy.

You people expecting an infinite price increase so they can sell out...

Overlooking the impossibility of selling at a non-finite price, I think if the price ever got to anything absurdly high, it would probably be because the fiat currencies had failed and were hyperinflating. Such that the price is not due so much to appreciation in real terms, but merely loss of value of fiat currency for which btc can be traded. The last thing someone does at that point is turn their savings into a hyperinflating currency. So I don't think that would be "selling out of bitcoin" as it would be "buying into dollars".  You can read a lot about what happens in a hyperinflation, and the first thing people in that circumstance do is trade their paychecks for something they think or hope will retain value. In post-Soviet Russia during its hyperinflation people traded their earnings for dollars on the black market. No I'm not saying we are hyperinflating now. Obviously not. At least yet. I was describing a possible scenario that would cause a ludicrous valuation.

I've seen posts here (and other places) going on about how they're going to take out huge, huge loans to buy Bitcoin.

You and I can agree that is pathological. And putting all or most of one's savings in BTC seems foolish to me, too. There are risks.  An asset class with a rising price does attract speculators. We won't stop them doing it. In the dot com bubble in the 90's people bought tech stocks on margin, and were wiped out in the crash. Same thing with real estate in the real estate bubble. I don't see how we can expect human behavior to be different in this case. Those people are putting the noose around their own neck. Yes, if what's happening now is mere chasing of price momentum by get-rich-quick speculators we could have a spectacular crash. And you can crow over their folly when it happens. I for one will not. But I think it's an open question whether bitcoin is indeed merely a bubble at this point, or is it rather just beginning to approach the valuation that it's merits deserve. But whichever it is, I don't see a crash being the end of bitcoin any more than the blow-off and crash in 2011 was.

[Shermo]

Both me and my girlfriend recently invested some of our savings in BTC because currently in the UK you make absolutely nothing on your savings due to how crap the economy is at the moment. Our opinion was if we can make 10% over a year then were happy as that's more than we'd make currently.

I think most likely there are lots of other people in similar positions right now thinking the exact same thing, not necessarily thinking short term, but medium term for investments as they are fed up of the banks making all the profit, taking government bail outs and making nothing on their hard earned savings.

Also, I do use my BTC when I can, I have used them to buy goods online from the few places that currently accept them, it would be nice for adoption to increase over the next year then maybe the money me and my girlfriend invested won't get cashed out but instead used to buy things in BTC instead.

[notig]

Both me and my girlfriend recently invested some of our savings in BTC because currently in the UK you make absolutely nothing on your savings due to how crap the economy is at the moment. Our opinion was if we can make 10% over a year then were happy as that's more than we'd make currently.

I think most likely there are lots of other people in similar positions right now thinking the exact same thing, not necessarily thinking short term, but medium term for investments as they are fed up of the banks making all the profit, taking government bail outs and making nothing on their hard earned savings.

Also, I do use my BTC when I can, I have used them to buy goods online from the few places that currently accept them, it would be nice for adoption to increase over the next year then maybe the money me and my girlfriend invested won't get cashed out but instead used to buy things in BTC instead.

That's why I think bitcoins #1 use will be as a hedge against inflation

[Luckybit]

To all the people complaining about people spending their Bitcoin, new adopters don't have enough Bitcoins to realistically spend their Bitcoins. If you only have 1BTC then spending it isn't going to be on your mind. If you have 1000 BTC like the last generation of adopters then you should be investing and spending. If you have 100 BTC then you should be investing but not spending. If you have 1 BTC you should be saving.

The problem is it's hard to earn new BTC but easy to spend it all away. This can be changed by allowing content to be sold via BTC. Music, movies, writing, stuff like this which a lot of people can do should generate BTC. If it doesn't then you cannot blame the holders of BTC for not spending it. What can a person with 1 BTC buy with 1mBTC?

Right now not enough can be bought with 1BTC so this person would be wise to save and hold until the market increases the value of 1BTC to the point where thousands of products and services can be bought with it, but would anyone realistically spend their last dollar? And do we call that person greedy for not spending it?

[Herodes]

I will keep using Bitcoin if it = 1 cent or 100 bucks, It doesn't matter to me.

Good point and angreed. The golden rule is: Never invest more than you can afford to lose. Obviously, no matter how good things look, breaking this rule can set you up for disaster.

[bassclef]

Both me and my girlfriend recently invested some of our savings in BTC because currently in the UK you make absolutely nothing on your savings due to how crap the economy is at the moment. Our opinion was if we can make 10% over a year then were happy as that's more than we'd make currently.

I think most likely there are lots of other people in similar positions right now thinking the exact same thing, not necessarily thinking short term, but medium term for investments as they are fed up of the banks making all the profit, taking government bail outs and making nothing on their hard earned savings.

Also, I do use my BTC when I can, I have used them to buy goods online from the few places that currently accept them, it would be nice for adoption to increase over the next year then maybe the money me and my girlfriend invested won't get cashed out but instead used to buy things in BTC instead.

Same here. My wife and I were just commenting on the prices of food compared to last year. The government seems to blame it on just about everything else when it's obvious inflation is the culprit. Gas prices too.

People are desperate for a solid currency that they can save without its value being stolen through inflation.

[luffy]

the good part is that we don't know the future to anything. anything may happened regarding btc or other altcoins.
personally i love its technology and philosophy over gold and other assets. it can co-exist with fiat as well or replace it, i really don't
care!
i never had much money, i learn to live without it, if btc goes to 4 or 5 figure value i will continue to live exactly the same.
long live internet and its products

[freequant]

This isn't about currency revolution... It's all about investment/greed speculation now. It isn't about screwing over the banks or government or evolving anything, It's now about buying in and selling at higher prices and selling for a nice paper money increase.

It's a transfer of wealth to the Bitcoin community, very good.
By voting with their money, people are transfering the power to us.
Once none of use need to have a day job, we can become entirely dedicated making that revolution happen for good.

[conspirosphere.tk]

I bought the first time at 20USD on the way down, and I held down to 1 and up to now. If it crashes again to 1 or 10 USD I think I would buy quite a lot more, and I expect many here and there would do the same. And that's why it won't happen, unless it crashes due to a new, better and more popular cryptocoin.

[smoothie]

Only a dumbass, like you, would equate bitcoin "dying" to the price falling. Speculation does not equal bitcoin. Bitcoin price equals speculation.

Obviously you are an emotionally driven trader. I hope you go insane trying to catch the dips and end up buying back higher.  

I don't get it..a lot of the new comers into Bitcoin are treating Bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme.

I've seen posts here (and other places) going on about how they're going to take out huge, huge loans to buy Bitcoin.

Why? Simply so they can hold, hold, hold, and resell at a higher price....

I also know a couple people personally that are buying to resell...One of them has 2.7 mill invested. He's going to dump as soon as his investment reaches 25%. I know someone else that doesn't even have a job and she put all assets into Bitcoin.

I feel like nowadays every newcomer is acquiring Bitcoins to get rich. They aren't here for anything else. This is a giant greed bubble IMO. Nothing else.

This isn't about currency revolution... It's all about investment/greed speculation now. It isn't about screwing over the banks or government or evolving anything, It's now about buying in and selling at higher prices and selling for a nice paper money increase.

Greedy speculators will be the death of Bitcoin.. If hacks and the government don't kill it first. This whole thing is becoming a joke really due to human greed.
You Idiots taking out a second mortgage on your house and living off ramen (I know several of you personally (4)) I will give you no sympathy when this greed raged currency crashes.

I will keep using Bitcoin if it = 1 cent or 100 bucks, It doesn't matter to me.

You people expecting an infinite price increase so they can sell out and retire, I will be here to laugh at you when it falls through the floor because of speculative greed.

[Elwar]

I like how people speak of greed as if it is a bad thing.

The more people who put their money into Bitcoin, the more people will start to understand Bitcoin and be willing to use their bitcoins to spend.

Why would you go back to dollars once you understand how Bitcoin works?

[Luckybit]

This isn't about currency revolution... It's all about investment/greed speculation now. It isn't about screwing over the banks or government or evolving anything, It's now about buying in and selling at higher prices and selling for a nice paper money increase.

It's a transfer of wealth to the Bitcoin community, very good.
By voting with their money, people are transfering the power to us.
Once none of use need to have a day job, we can become entirely dedicated making that revolution happen for good.

Your post is the best most accurate post I've read on this thread. You deserve a Bit-tip.

[wachtwoord]

I like how people speak of greed as if it is a bad thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8y6DJAeolo

Words to live by.

[Logik]

I don't think BTCs will became mainstream enough (it's too much of a "geek-thing" imho) to sustain this kind of growth [...]

I agree with your post in general but, you know, many things were once 'geek things' and now they are main stream. The internet itself, smart phones, internet banking and playing games spring to mind. Time has a way of doing that.

IMO the question is if the community and infrastructure can mature enough to sustain the growth. Right now I think some people have an idea that services in the Bitcoin world will either get hacked or try to scam you - and their not wrong!

[Gordonium]

I like how people speak of greed as if it is a bad thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8y6DJAeolo

Words to live by.

Me.