[FACTS] ANON Coins = Illegal

[dinofelis]

@Dino
You are always coming across with YOUR BEHAVIOR as a contrarian.

I wouldn't even know what you mean by that.  I have a very logical stance, and of course, anything going against that logic in a discussion will be challenged by me.  If you call that "contrarian", that only means you are logically challenged (which is somehow starting to occur with me).

The logical contradiction I see is that you are clearly a fan of crypto (otherwise, "why are you here ?"), but you seem to be obfuscated by the very nature of crypto (namely, doing away with central power = state and hence central law).  I'm just extremely curious how you can keep up with that dichotomy.  Maybe I'm missing something, and I'd like to find out how you can escape that visible contradiction.  That's all.

You are always stretching things to suit YOUR AGENDA.

If you call "stretching things", going to the full logical extend of a certain position, then I will take that as a compliment.  I fail to see how people cannot go to the full logical extend of their positions (unless they are con artists).

Now, concerning my "agenda", I think I'm quite clear about that: I think I follow the "agenda" of crypto, that is, do away with centralized power (a.k.a. the state).  There's nothing "hidden" about that, is there ? 

You are always positioning yourself to defend YOUR MOTIVATIONS (Monero "Speculating") with verbal gymnastics while simultaneously accusing others of having an "Agenda".

It depends what you call "an agenda".  If you mean by that, some hidden motivations to lure someone into something that is in his disadvantage, then for sure I don't have an agenda.  If you mean by that, having a clear position, then I don't know how to be much clearer about my position.   

But it is very strange that you think that *I* am accusing others to have an agenda, while YOU are the guy not wanting to tell why he's here (in clear contradiction with what one might think are the main reasons to be here).  YOU are the guy insinuating that I have other accounts, that I'm pumping my "investments" and so on.  So the one accusing others of having an agenda, while not being clear himself, is YOU, not me.

For example on another topic you posted you *could* do trading somewhere besides Poloniex..

The *I* there was of course an abstract I, used in a gedanken experiment.  More and more elements seem to point to you being logically challenged.

On a topic asking if it's a danger having all the ANON COINS mostly on one Exchange (Polo who tracks you with your Picture ID)
What is that ? Seriously what the fuck is that bloody bullshit ?
Then you have the bloody audacity to try and swarm all over me and my topics pointing the finger at me ?

Uh, yes, because you were making silly claims there.  I totally debunked your statement of "danger" there.  You couldn't come up with a decent scenario where the "central exchange wanting your ID" was the culprit of someone getting in jail because of using monero on a freedom market.  You had to resort to scenarios where the use of monero wasn't relevant, or where we had to do with a terrorist and large amounts of money.

They made Monero to circumvent Anti-Money-Laundering Laws.

Not only.  But for sure, I already said that it is a good thing to circumvent AML laws.  Those are bad laws, threading on the economic liberty of people.  Those are like those anti-homosexuals laws of the UK.  And that's the goal of crypto in general.  So what's wrong with that ?

[billybobmaryjoe]

Europe is worse. Is making anything encrypted illegal. This will be interesting, no?

This is not the case yet.  But there will be a world-wide fight by the state-maffias to try to keep their citizens as their slaves, and they start to see the eminent danger that cryptography in general presents for their power.  Cryptography is an ultimate freedom tool, and states don't like freedom (states being based upon slavery).  We'll see how this turns out.  Freedom won the first crypto war, but the second one will be harder, with much more stupid people than 30 years ago.

UK Bans End-to-End Encryption, Mandates Government Authority Over Encrypted Technologies

https://cointelegraph.com/news/uk-bans-end-to-end-encryption-mandates-government-authority-over-encrypted-technologies

[dinofelis]

Europe is worse. Is making anything encrypted illegal. This will be interesting, no?

This is not the case yet.  But there will be a world-wide fight by the state-maffias to try to keep their citizens as their slaves, and they start to see the eminent danger that cryptography in general presents for their power.  Cryptography is an ultimate freedom tool, and states don't like freedom (states being based upon slavery).  We'll see how this turns out.  Freedom won the first crypto war, but the second one will be harder, with much more stupid people than 30 years ago.

UK Bans End-to-End Encryption, Mandates Government Authority Over Encrypted Technologies

https://cointelegraph.com/news/uk-bans-end-to-end-encryption-mandates-government-authority-over-encrypted-technologies

Well, and we simply will not care.  That's a civil duty.  One cannot stop you from doing maths on a computer with your own free software, can one.

[Spoetnik]

Dino you have said before stuff like the purpose of crypto is to be a rebel and break laws etc.
Who said that ? Satoshi ?
I have no idea where all that bullshit came from.. but it took off like it was the official mantra of the Altcoin world (used primarily to cover greedy profit schemes nothing more)
You SAY you don't want laws because of ideology.
You actually don't want laws people because you think it interferes with your Poloniex ROI's.

I challenge your assertion that crypto was always intended to be about breaking laws and fighting the man.
Nope.. it's about making a crypto-currency that gets adopted and USED.
Whether or not it breaks laws is a secondary point to me.
What is first ? ADOPTION.

Now tell me is deliberately doing a variety of things to break the law going to aid adoption ?
Of course not..
You need the govt's approval to go hand & hand with the existing financial world.
If the two worlds are separate and can never reach each other unless there is arrests then you will not have any adoption.. nor snazzy little Poloniex coin prices to FAP over either.

Don't feed me childish little crypto-rebel teen angst ideology that crypto is about sticking it to the man.
Grow the fuck up.
It's about being realistic and getting results.. not chanting one day while picking a fucking god damn war with the US govt like an idiot.

You Monero tard's were oh so proud of your recent Dark Market adoption news you spammed this forum about remember ?

Oh yeah ? Google says..

Firms must comply with the Bank Secrecy Act and its implementing regulations ("Anti-Money Laundering rules"). The purpose of the AML rules is to help detect and report suspicious activity including the predicate offenses to money laundering and terrorist financing, such as securities fraud and market manipulation.

So uhhh kids.. little children.. you know better huh ?

[xstayfrosty1980]

Europe is worse. Is making anything encrypted illegal. This will be interesting, no?

This is not the case yet.  But there will be a world-wide fight by the state-maffias to try to keep their citizens as their slaves, and they start to see the eminent danger that cryptography in general presents for their power.  Cryptography is an ultimate freedom tool, and states don't like freedom (states being based upon slavery).  We'll see how this turns out.  Freedom won the first crypto war, but the second one will be harder, with much more stupid people than 30 years ago.

UK Bans End-to-End Encryption, Mandates Government Authority Over Encrypted Technologies

https://cointelegraph.com/news/uk-bans-end-to-end-encryption-mandates-government-authority-over-encrypted-technologies

Well, and we simply will not care.  That's a civil duty.  One cannot stop you from doing maths on a computer with your own free software, can one.

The point is this is the begininng and it will escalate to includ crypt

[generalizethis]

Europe is worse. Is making anything encrypted illegal. This will be interesting, no?

This is not the case yet.  But there will be a world-wide fight by the state-maffias to try to keep their citizens as their slaves, and they start to see the eminent danger that cryptography in general presents for their power.  Cryptography is an ultimate freedom tool, and states don't like freedom (states being based upon slavery).  We'll see how this turns out.  Freedom won the first crypto war, but the second one will be harder, with much more stupid people than 30 years ago.

UK Bans End-to-End Encryption, Mandates Government Authority Over Encrypted Technologies

https://cointelegraph.com/news/uk-bans-end-to-end-encryption-mandates-government-authority-over-encrypted-technologies

Well, and we simply will not care.  That's a civil duty.  One cannot stop you from doing maths on a computer with your own free software, can one.

The point is this is the begininng and it will escalate to includ crypt

Will it? I'd speculate (and that's all you and the OP are doing as I can't find a law that states, or even infers cryptocurrencies are illegal) that some states will combat other states by encouraging anon cryptocurrencies--I'm sure someone in the CIA has figured out that cc's are a good way to drain Chinese wealth into western hands--and if they haven't, gamblers will figure it out for themselves--though their motive is just to gamble they can keep all their winnings.

[dinofelis]

Dino you have said before stuff like the purpose of crypto is to be a rebel and break laws etc.
Who said that ? Satoshi ?
I have no idea where all that bullshit came from.. but it took off like it was the official mantra of the Altcoin world (used primarily to cover greedy profit schemes nothing more)
You SAY you don't want laws because of ideology.
You actually don't want laws people because you think it interferes with your Poloniex ROI's.

I have no ROI, I don't even have an account on Polo and I don't speculate or trade.  Your insinuating this all the time is getting ridiculous.  In my opinion, crypto is NOT to rip off others in a zero-sum ponzi game, but is a tool to take back freedom.  You are insinuating me having an agenda because probably it is YOURS, and you don't want to admit it.  This is why you don't answer my question of why are you interested in crypto, I suppose.

I challenge your assertion that crypto was always intended to be about breaking laws and fighting the man.
Nope.. it's about making a crypto-currency that gets adopted and USED.

And why would you want that ?  Fiat is already adopted and used.  Why go through the hassle of crypto ?   What does it bring you more, if you want to "abide by the law and respect the state's wishes " ?

You see, the very foundation of crypto is decentralisation and trustlessness, because no authority is accepted and everything is based upon consensus.  The fundamental cornerstone of the state is that it is the final authority that decides about anything (even if that decision making process has some democratic elements build into it in some states) and will use coercion and violence to make you follow its rules.  These two things don't go together.  

There is absolutely no reason to go through all the hassle and difficulty of trustlessness and decentralisation, if you have a final authority that can and will decide.  As such, if you *accept* the final authority of the state, there simply isn't any reason to invent crypto.  If you don't understand this, you have missed the whole point of crypto.

The entire reason of crypto is to have financial and economic freedom from any central authority (including of course the state).    Now, crypto isn't necessarily something that is *against* the state, but it is independent of it. In as much as the laws of the state comply to the way crypto works, the state is not the enemy of crypto.  And not the other way around.  It is the laws that have to comply to crypto, and not crypto that has to comply to the laws, because crypto is fundamentally an element of freedom.

It turns out that the state doesn't want you to have financial and economic freedom.  AML laws are exactly that.  Tax laws are exactly that: the denial of your financial and economic freedom.  The whole fiat system is set up and is manoeuvered in order to do away with your *possibility* to obtain your financial and economic freedom.
As such crypto has something to offer, it is a way to fight the laws that take away your financial and economic freedom.  It is the only thing it has to offer.  So if you want to make crypto comply to the freedom-killing laws on the financial and economic level, then crypto has nothing left that you didn't already have with fiat.

What is first ? ADOPTION.

Why do you want people to adopt it ? What do you think they will gain from it ?

Now tell me is deliberately doing a variety of things to break the law going to aid adoption ?
Of course not..
You need the govt's approval to go hand & hand with the existing financial world.
If the two worlds are separate and can never reach each other unless there is arrests then you will not have any adoption.. nor snazzy little Poloniex coin prices to FAP over either.

But my question to you is: why on earth would you want people to use crypto, if it is to abide by the same laws as they already do with fiat  Why would YOU want to use crypto and not fiat ?  What's wrong with fiat, *apart from the fact that using fiat doesn't allow you to enjoy your economic and financial freedoms, which are against the laws taking those freedoms away* ?

It's about being realistic and getting results.. not chanting one day while picking a fucking god damn war with the US govt like an idiot.

What result do you want to obtain ?  Adoption ?  But again, why would you want crypto to "get adopted" ?  What good does it bring to the world, if it has to sacrifice its only utility, namely giving freedom back to people that was taken away from them ?

Firms must comply with the Bank Secrecy Act and its implementing regulations ("Anti-Money Laundering rules"). The purpose of the AML rules is to help detect and report suspicious activity including the predicate offenses tomoney laundering and terrorist financing, such as securities fraud and market manipulation.

That's the kind of freedom that has been taken away, and you can perfectly comply to those laws with fiat.  Why does one need crypto if it is to do the same as with fiat ?

So my question stands: why would you want crypto to get adopted, and why are YOU interested in crypto ?

I can only think of one single reason: because you want to reap in the value increase you hope to obtain, in other words, you hope to find greater fools that will pay more for your crypto than you paid for it.  You want to rip off later users of crypto who will pay more for a coin than you did.  The point is, that this is in fact the MAIN MOTIVATION of people in crypto, but if that's the main motivation, it is simply a greater-fool game, which will end the day you run out of greater fools.   You call that greater fool game "investment".

Once most people on earth have paid their million dollars for their milli bitcoin, what are they going to do with it ?  Once you have "full adoption" of bitcoin, and now the state knows, even much more that with fiat, where every satoshi is hiding, what are people going to do with it ?  There's no hope for "investment" and ROI any more: everyone has now his milli bitcoin.  The blocks on the chain are full.  It costs a fortune to do a transaction.  Your "goal" has been reached: full adoption.  Now what ?  What did this bring to the world that fiat didn't do ?  How are you going to convince the last non-adopter to buy his milli bitcoin ?  What can he hope to achieve with that ?  

You have no conceptual justification of why people should prefer crypto over fiat *if the goal is to be totally law abiding to laws that take away your financial and economic freedom*.   You are probably perfectly OK with the fact that you will pay your due taxes on the money you reap off future adopters of crypto because there's still enough room for greater fools, but you forget to tell them that what they have is entirely useless, if it can't do anything about the liberticide laws they undergo already with fiat, and the stuff they have is much much more difficult and risky to use than good old fiat.

If I don't mind the state to know all about my financial doings, if I abide by the law, if I want to pay all my taxes, and I'm happy that way, I really, really don't see the point of crypto (apart as a ripping-off tool in a zero-sum game where you don't even need true crypto, as IOU on exchanges are good enough).

The only true value proposition of crypto is to have a tool to take one's financial and economic liberty back.  And given the violence by which states don't like you to have this liberty, it better be a tool that makes those free acts totally opaque.
THAT's crypto.

You see, it is as if you live in a country where it is against the law to go freely somewhere.  There are a lot of places where you aren't allowed to go.  The state wants you to only go at certain places at certain times.  However, the state puts at your disposal busses, trains, and boats, which go where you are allowed to go.  This system works quite smoothly.

And now, people invent bicycles.  Bicycles can travel where you want, when you want.  In fact, the fundamental reason to have a bicycle, is that you aren't obliged any more to use the state's transportation, and you gain your liberty of going where you want, when you want.  It is much less practical: you have to pedal, it doesn't go fast, but at least, you win your freedom of travelling.

And now you come and say: "hey, those free bicycles are against the law !  They are invented to go against the law !  Do you think people will start using bicycles if they can go just anywhere ?  Nobody will use bicycles that way !  You should invent bicycles that can only run on the rails of the state trains, that only go where you are allowed to go !"

My question is: if one should limit the kinds of bicycles to those that can only go where the state trains already brought you, what's the point in using such a bicycle ?  Why not continue to use the state train ?  At least, you don't have to pedal !
Why would you want to have adoption of bicycles that don't bring your freedom back ?

[Spoetnik]

@dinofelis
You said..

I have no ROI, I don't even have an account on Polo and I don't speculate or trade.  Your insinuating this all the time is getting ridiculous.

That is WHY i am here
What comes around goes around bud  

I highly doubt you defend Monero here so 24/7 every day simply because you are a contrarian.
There must be some other reason you are so manic and rabid at quelling and squashing any criticism posted about Monero soon after it's posted here every day.

Since you love verbal gymnastics so much i DO think you possess Monero coins.
Which to me = ROI's
Quite possibly a dev like smooth etc..  i don't know.
Funny how i rarely ever see smooth or smoothie post but i see you non stop.

Use your home IP here like me ?
Or using TOR / VPN etc then saying your "not people" ?

So what is your deal then ?
Do you enjoy just being a contrarian or do my comments just get under your skin or what ?
You really do seem to pop up arguing with me all the time.
Usually the exception routine too.. i say most people are alive and you oh ohh ohh but but but *some* are dead.
And we would not characterize people as dead would we ?

@generalizethis
See the world of File Sharing for your reference.
You see Mr. "Has me on ignore" ...the P2P world is full of crimes (Google it)

I also don't buy your speech about what Crypto is suppose to be.
I take it in a literal sense..
It's a currency then if it's not used it failed.
My problem with Monero aside from their Shill's shenanigans is the concept + implementation and grandiose claims printed on Hoody's.
Apparently Monero is the world first computer code tech that is bullet proof.
Until you argue with these guys and they say "no one claimed that" LOL

MY PROBLEM is making a currency crippled from it's launch destined toil in niche obscurity
while bag holding shill's bullshit the naive with "one day" (the one day it will get major world wide adoption routine)

My problem is knowing full well that adoption is highly unlikely because of how it works and what it does by design.

[dinofelis]

@dinofelis
You said..

I have no ROI, I don't even have an account on Polo and I don't speculate or trade.  Your insinuating this all the time is getting ridiculous.

That is WHY i am here

So for you, crypto is simply a greater-fool game where you hope to rip off others.  At least that's honest, finally.  Good ponzi, then.
With people like you, there's indeed absolutely no reason to want greater crypto adoption.  Greater crypto adoption simply means more people getting ripped off.  I understand now also perfectly well why you like state and law, which is also a big rip off.    The point is, for your ponzi game, you don't even need crypto.  You only need an exchange with a web site, keeping track of everybody's "tokens".  From the moment that exchanges are fully state-controlled like banks, they cannot cheat, and there's no need any more for a block chain.  Exchange tokens are then just another fiat, with or without block chain.

Now, if you are here essentially to rip off latecomers, why would latecomers join to make you rich (which you call "adoption") ?  What good does that adoption do to people, apart from them pumping money (fiat, that is) into your hands because you were earlier ?  How do you think that this pyramid game will end ?

I highly doubt you defend Monero here so 24/7 every day simply because you are a contrarian.
There must be some other reason you are so manic and rabid at quelling and squashing any criticism posted about Monero soon after it's posted here every day.

There isn't any other reason.  I don't know why you call me a contrarian, while I'm a libertarian.

Since you love verbal gymnastics so much i DO think you possess Monero coins.

Yes, I mined about 6 of them, as I told you.  And I lost another wallet containing about 10 of them.  Although I think that I must still have a backup somewhere.  As for the moment, I cannot spend them on anything, there's no reason to get more of them, no ?

So what is your deal then ?
Do you enjoy just being a contrarian or do my comments just get under your skin or what ?

I enjoy everything that can bring down state and law.  And I do like cryptography.  That's good enough, no ?
I thought that cryptocurrencies were a great tool to help doing so.  But it got spoiled by people like you.  It's going nowhere.

[Spoetnik]

I didn't ask you to continue to derail the conversation about what Crypto should be (good job by the way it's working)
Got off to topic nicely.. well done LOL

NOPE my idea of crypto is ...

Currency.
Adoption.

And if there is problems / barriers to getting them adopted then recognize them and deal with them.
AKA: common sense.

Now back onto the topic

I posted this topic because i see what i pointed out as a barrier to mass adoption and integration within the general public and existing financial world.. how could you not ?

By railing on with idealistic childish little views and ideology that "it shouldn't be that way" ?
By feeding us the ole cliche of how Crypto is suppose to be about "sticking it to the man" ?

Cut the crap people.
All that shit you spew accomplishes one thing.. trading for profits on Poloniex (not adoption)

Stop and think for a second.
All we have is centralized govt controlled and compliant AML based exchanges here RIGHT NOW.
I say well guess what ? Monero for example violates those laws (why exchanges collect your Picture ID and track you etc)
Then you have the fucking audacity to chant the free market little kiddy no laws rabble at me ?
Do you even see the silly hypocrisy people ?

How could any Monero supporter being condoning Poloniex or any other that is US govt complaint crypto-service ?
You are hypocrites.. you spew bulllshit then do the opposite on Polo for profits.
YOU ARE in fact full of shit.
And no picking at me for WHY i am here on & on does not magically change reality either.
The reality being.. a problem with adoption.

I told you all loud & clear daily Regulations were coming etc and here we are with Cryptsy and numerous other adding "Verification" masked tracking etc.
They told me they regularly handed off the users data to the Fed's when requested and then would lie to the customer telling them network problems etc.

And i predicted it people.. i fucking god damn told you !
And all i got 3 years ago was 100% unanimous laughing and trolling in return.
Chat boxes would erupt with laughter and say ohhhhhh they can't do anything..
And we don't need them etc etc.

They are silent now.. and i am saying I TOLD YOU SO
..again

You all have been warned and i am doing you a service here.
I posted on Bitcointalk the SEC's Crypto-Currency Investor Fraud Alert PDF the same day it came out.
I told you about the FBI nailing people on LocalBitcoins.
I told you about Github being US govt compliant.
I told you about Ripple and the FINCEN fines they got.
I told you about Coinbase ratting out KickAssTorrents
I warned you all about GOX far in advance.
I warned you all about Cryptsy and their ratting out people in advance.

@Dino what the fuck were you doing before you showed up here late in 2014 after me defending shitcoins ?
Me ? see the list above son

[Spoetnik]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=160612.msg1698149#msg1698149

Bitcoin: The Digital Kill Switch

by Shelby H. Moore III

March 29, 2013

Bitcoin is the first peer-to-peer (P2P) digital currency and payment system to gain significant interest. This month its marketcap surpassed $1 billion.

P2P currencies promise some differences from credit cards, such as increased privacy, no control by authorities, instant signup, lower fees for the merchant, and no chargebacks (buyer at the mercy of the merchant to issue refund if dispute).

Unlike a credit card which allows the merchant to see your details, making unauthorized charges to your P2P account is impossible, unless you allow someone to get your private key. Note credit cards are adding for example Verified By Visa to provide a similar degree of security.

The government control increased on March 13, when FinCEN ruled that transactions for goods and services paying with P2P currency are not regulated, yet exchange to other currencies is regulated and can't be anonymous. Since most users need to exchange from legal tender to and from P2P currencies, some of the purported privacy has already been lost. Also instant signup has been effectively eliminated for many, as now many new users must "practically give a DNA sample" to become verified by exchange providers— however this tsuris may not exist in all jurisdictions.

[dinofelis]

I didn't ask you to continue to derail the conversation about what Crypto should be (good job by the way it's working)
Got off to topic nicely.. well done LOL

NOPE my idea of crypto is ...

Currency.
Adoption.

And if there is problems / barriers to getting them adopted then recognize them and deal with them.
AKA: common sense.

Now back onto the topic

I posted this topic because i see what i pointed out as a barrier to mass adoption and integration within the general public and existing financial world.. how could you not ?

Yes, but you see, you put the cart before the horse.  I agree with you that crypto adoption would be great, but that is because I think that crypto is defending a cause: getting back economic and financial freedom.  If it isn't for that, I don't see the reason to switch from fiat to crypto.  Fiat is very good.  It works.  Of course, it has "problems" but these problems are exactly the lack of economic and financial freedom.  Why does it take some hassle to get money to another country ?  Why does it take some steps to send money to someone ?  Exactly because of compliance with all the laws that take away your economic and financial freedom.  So if you think that it is all right that these laws are there, and you want to comply, then you can hardly do better than fiat.    In that case, crypto is clumsy, will always give compliance problems (exactly what you're shouting about as OP) and SHOULDN'T BE ADOPTED.  People can only get troubles with it.  It is more difficult to use, it has a lot of technical issues, it will, in the end, cost more, there's a much bigger risk, and eventually, it will be extremely difficult to comply to the law with that stuff, while with fiat, all that is a piece of cake.

But, yes, I want crypto adoption, because I don't want to comply to all those liberty stealing laws.  But then you shouldn't whine about that.  If adoption is not possible because of that, then so be it.  But killing the only raison d'être of crypto *in order for it to hope to get it adopted* is ridiculous.  Crypto, without the fight for freedom, is silly, and shouldn't be adopted.  If adoption is not possible with its fight for freedom, then it should (and will) disappear.  

Stop and think for a second.
All we have is centralized govt controlled and compliant AML based exchanges here RIGHT NOW.

... and serve exactly no purpose.  Fiat is better at that.

I say well guess what ? Monero for example violates those laws

But that's the sole raison for crypto to exist.  Hell, if you want an "exchange" that collects your ID, that is fully compliant, why don't you use a bank ?  It is much safer, it is much more practical, it works much better.

I don't want crypto to be "adopted by the general public and the financial world".  I want crypto to be the currency that is used by an underground economy that grows, and that eats away at the "official" economy until that last one collapses, as all its forces end up being drawn towards the underground economy, and only parasites remain.  That collapse should than also induce the fall of states.  However, that underground economy must be protected from the greedy state which will not allow it.  Dark markets are an essential part of it.  I see it more like the "resistance" in Europe during WWII, which had its underground network of activities and so on, but it will be more difficult now, with the prying eyes of the evil state looking everywhere.

How could any Monero supporter being condoning Poloniex or any other that is US govt complaint crypto-service ?

Well, because it helps when the economic circle is not closed and fiat-in and fiat-out is at a certain point still needed.  At least, monero has the advantage that Polo can't track it.   It must not be so very illegal, if a compliant exchange allows you to buy some, no ?  

And no picking at me for WHY i am here on & on does not magically change reality either.
The reality being.. a problem with adoption.

Before you desire adoption, there must be a reason to want adoption.  This is what you seem to forget.  There's no point for crypto to get adoption, if it is to be compliant.  That's the whole point.

You all have been warned and i am doing you a service here.
I posted on Bitcointalk the SEC's Crypto-Currency Investor Fraud Alert PDF the same day it came out.
I told you about the FBI nailing people on LocalBitcoins.
I told you about Github being US govt compliant.
I told you about Ripple and the FINCEN fines they got.
I told you about Coinbase ratting out KickAssTorrents
I warned you all about GOX far in advance.
I warned you all about Cryptsy and their ratting out people in advance.

A fight will of course make casualties.  If you don't want to fight, don't come to the war (and don't adopt crypto).
You are essentially saying that there's no point for crypto.  So why do you want crypto adoption if that's your stance ?

[Spoetnik]

Enjoy your fight then and send me a post card from jail and don't be surprised when Monero is getting it's ass kicked all over by the US authorities one day and that in turn decimates your Poloniex coin prices you all covet so much.. it will be fun watching you all scramble trying to dump first when it's too late and the insiders / whales and exchange staff etc already beat you to it.. and don't be surprised to hear "Network Problems" and not even be able to dump at all.
And recall what i just said about Cryptsy

Dino you and all the rest of you are FULL OF SHIT !

What is the point in doing it with regulations and compliance ?
You tell me you are doing it right now.
What in the hell do think using a compliant exchange means ?
You have the fucking nerve to spew this teen rebel bullshit at me then dog-pile over to Polo or Cryptsy or Coinbase.

What's the point ?

..the point is to talk a whole lot of bullshit then do the opposite of your little freedom speeches.

Want to support an Anon coin then i sure fucking hell better not find out you are registered at Poloniex like a fucking lippy little hypocrite.

Cut the fucking crap and grow up people.
From one end of crypto to the other regulations / law are already here !
Claim your Poloniex profits with taxation ? Ripple got fined by FINCEN ?

Sorry children it's a little bit too late to spew the "freedom" bullshit LOL
And if you do then back up your mouth.. stop using govt complaint exchanges like a two faced lying little back stabbing cancer to crypto rat.
Stop violating the principles top pad your wallets then say the opposite on Bitcointalk.
Fuck off with your lies and games and bullshit scammy greedy little profiteers.
I don't want to hear it..

ACTIONS speak louder than words.. get your ass in gear and quit spewing stupid bullshit here non-stop and back up your mouth.

I am not about the idealism.. i actually like the idea of an anon coin.
But i don't like bullshitters who spew crap for Bitcoin ROI's.
I like practical and realistic solutions.. if anon can be done properly then yeah go for it.
Don't half ass it then make claims that are impossible such as adoption is coming eventually etc.

EDIT:

In other words i don't care about the anon concept it does not bother me.
What bothers me is the massive facade i have outlined in this topic.
Do an ANON coin that does not have these problem(s) and i will have 0 complaints.

[dinofelis]

What is the point in doing it with regulations and compliance ?
You tell me you are doing it right now.
What in the hell do think using a compliant exchange means ?
You have the fucking nerve to spew this teen rebel bullshit at me then dog-pile over to Polo or Cryptsy or Coinbase.

You seem to be rather deaf, because you have a hard time imagining that someone is interested in crypto, visibly.  I don't trade, I don't hold a lot of coins, I only buy coins when I want to use them (that is, spend them on something).  I think it is bad for crypto to "invest" in it: money is not an "investment" but an intermediate good in a commercial exchange.  So there's no dumping to be done if there's no "investment" of course.  My idea of going to an exchange is to buy coins I'll use.  The idea is not to go in the other direction (that is, to sell coins).  If one day I get paid a lot in coins for a thing I do, then it might be necessary to go to an exchange to get some fiat out of it if that's too many coins I can spend on stuff (that is, if there's not enough stuff available to be bought in bitcoin or monero).    THAT, to me, is the use of crypto.

I'm very sad that the price of crypto today is so high, and I'm pretty sad that monero rose to over $10.  When it was about $1, it is true that the market cap was too low because some serious deals in monero would be a significant fraction of the market cap.   But when dark market acceptance was there, my hope was that it would rise to, say, $4.  That would have been enough market cap.   Unfortunately, now, speculators and "investors" like you have fallen onto it, and now the price is almost as ridiculously blown up as bitcoin's.  Bitcoin should be around $40 or something.  That's enough for the actual usage as I spelled out above.  All this stupid gambling, investing, and trading has killed crypto entirely in the above view.  But I keep to it.  I'm not interested in crypto for anything else than its usage as a currency, because anything else is not sustainable.   It can take a long time before that bubble pops, but it will pop, because it is a greater fool game.

So yes, for the few crypto coins I need, I'm obliged to go to a "complying exchange".  Now, with a coin like monero, at least, once I bought them, they can't know what I do with it.  But that's even hypothetical, because for the moment, I don't buy any monero, as I can't spend them.  If I want to buy a computer, or toner for my printer, or whatever, it is way easier to do it with fiat ; the offers on openbazaar are still meager as compared to amazon, and you have to use bitcoin there.

What's the point ?

..the point is to talk a whole lot of bullshit then do the opposite of your little freedom speeches.

Of course not, why would I do that.   I'm asking people to stop trading and "investing".  I would like the price of crypto to go down, so that the greater-fool game it is now in, would stop.  I would like the market cap of crypto to be mainly supported by its usage through Fisher's formula, like the price of fiat is, instead of being "supported" by the hope to find greater fools, that has to stop one day.   It would be great if I woke up tomorrow, and bitcoin was at $80,-, and monero at $2,-.  Then I'd know that this silly game is over, and that crypto is back where it should be: as a currency for a parallel economy.

I say this, not because I'm a kind of monk preaching the good word, but because the current game has no sustainable future.  Complying crypto is silly, fiat is better because it hasn't that burden of trustlessness and decentralisation.  And "investing" in it is nothing else but a greater fool game, of which we all know what happens when one runs out of greater fools.

Now, it is true that there's still 90% of the planet of greater fools available, so if you play it smart, you can win a lot before it crashes, but that's immoral I think.  And risky too, because you could hit the wall much sooner than you think and you might be that greater fool all your peers have been waiting for.

[Spoetnik]

PS:
what am i doing here ?
Posting stories from Coidnesk

No, seriously, why are you interested in crypto ?  Or do you want to warn people NOT to use crypto because it's against the law ?

I know why I'm interested in crypto: because I think law and state are evil, and that one has the civil duty to oppose oppression and the crushing of fundamental rights, and I see in crypto a tool to help in that fight.  Crypto can be to the oppressed economic rights, what the internet has been to the lack of freedom of public expression.  But clearly that's not your PoV.  So what brings you here ?

http://www.coindesk.com/fbi-concerned-about-criminal-use-of-private-cryptocurrency-monero/

Bumped for posterity and another chance to say, I TOLD YOU SO.

..want me to bump some of the other topics where i warned you all ?

Here is one from someone else in case you need more FUD

Monero Illegal Tax Evasion

..morono is in a hell of a lot of trouble

[Longsnowsm]

All of crypto is a grey area and while not illegal today I would bet it will be as all the central banks roll out their own flavor of cooked books blockchain tech.  That being said if you are concerned about the legality then I would say get out of crypto now.  When it does go full out illegal these anon coins may be the last standing in what will surely become black markets. 

I don't want to see it, but that is likely the way it will play out once the Fed and other central banks are done learning from our little blockchain experiment.  So if you are afraid of Monero and other anon coins now I would just steer clear of all cryptos because the water is only going to get more murky for anyone concerned about what govts will do.   

Central banks don't like competition and they will begin targeting anyone who offers an alternative to their fiat.  As they push for cashless society people have few options compounded by negative interest rates as the central banks try to find a way to prop up the international fiat money system.   People will be clamoring for options and if cryptos are around people will flee the sinking ship.  The central banks can't allow that to happen. 

So the timing for making crypto's illegal will probably start to happen as they start to loose grip of the fiat system.  Some are saying they think that is close.  I don't know, but I would say prepare youself.  We are in for a wild ride.   Get out of crypto while you still can if you are afraid of the legalities.

[Spoetnik]

It's simple, ANON Coins violate Anti-Money Laundering Laws in countries like the USA.

http://www.coindesk.com/localbitcoins-users-criminal-charges-florida/

That shows us a couple years back some guys were arrested by the FBI in a parking lot for selling Bitcoin.
Why ?
They sold over $10,000 worth of BTC with out proper ID and info etc.
(Which is why all the exchanges take your ID and have limits like they do)

So what does this mean ?

Your shitty ass little anon coin will never get major adoption.. EVER !

Enjoy being Bag Holders  

Hmm it seems the FBI is investigating the matter.. hmm seems they may agree with me huh ?

I highly urge you all to sign up at Poloniex and hand them your picture ID so you can buy Monero coins so you can then go to AlphaBay to buy Crack and AK47's and Child Porn and maybe support some terrorist or organized crime money laundering.

After all that is what Crypto Coins are for.. sticking it the man right ?

[kiklo]

Monero Dev is hidden, so he will never help the FBI.

Oh Wait, his real name is known to everyone.
I'm Riccardo Spagni of the Monero Core Team, Ask me anything!


Well I am sure he is as tough as nails and would never help the FBI.
Oh Crap , his alt name is "fluffypony" .


You Monero users are so screwed.  
Better print out those public keys so the FBI can see those transactions,
when they arrive at your house, those public viewing keys seem like a real bad idea now don't they.  


 


FYI:
In Riccardo's defense, he did always say the odds are monero would fail.  
https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/are-any-altcoins-currenty-useful-no-says-monero-developer-riccardo-spagni-1458743546/

FYI2:
Be sure to tell the FBI guys to change gloves, so you don't catch an anal disease. 

[Spoetnik]

Monero Dev is hidden, so he will never help the FBI.

Oh Wait, his real name is known to everyone.
I'm Riccardo Spagni of the Monero Core Team, Ask me anything!


Well I am sure he is as tough as nails and would never help the FBI.
Oh Crap , his alt name is "fluffypony" .


You Monero users are so screwed.  
Better print out those public keys so the FBI can see those transactions,
when they arrive at your house, those public viewing keys seem like a real bad idea now don't they.  


 


FYI:
In Riccardo's defense, he did always say the odds are monero would fail.  
https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/are-any-altcoins-currenty-useful-no-says-monero-developer-riccardo-spagni-1458743546/

FYI2:
Be sure to tell the FBI guys to change gloves, so you don't catch an anal disease. 

I am familiar with "Mr. Safe As Houses"

[NEWS] Sputnik Approves Monero !

Dev ? you mean the original Bytecoin one or the community take over one funded by Risto the millionaire ?

[BTCLovingDude]

It's simple, ANON Coins violate Anti-Money Laundering Laws in countries like the USA.

there will always be a non-stop fight between people wanting "privacy" and government wanting to take it from them with their surveillance. and will last forever.
with that said, they can never shut down any cryptocurrency specially the ANON coins. as they can't kill encryption and things like that which prevents them from being nosy

That shows us a couple years back some guys were arrested by the FBI in a parking lot for selling Bitcoin.
Why ?
They sold over $10,000 worth of BTC with out proper ID and info etc.
(Which is why all the exchanges take your ID and have limits like they do)

this is usually happening because of taxes and them doing "business" without paying uncle Sam a share of the profit. aka unlicensed exchange service, specially because of the volume.