Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[vapourminer]

@infofront, make a poll please OGnasty or PAASHAAS
Would be nice to see who people following the most in a way of thinking for a near-mid term period.

Maybe a 3th option not to agree with any of them.

4th option:  sit back with drink and spliff

[philipma1957]

80k by tomorrow

Business cycle printed three months in a row over 50, means the expansion cycle is coming.

Bitcoin always follows.

$126k was not the cycle top in fact it was the first peak of the multi year Bitcoin super cycle.

$1 million BTC is just the baseline.

I respect all opinions and thoughts

But I do like the big difference between you and OGnasty
I’m leaning more towards this post … but still every outcome can happen

I’m ok and just riding the waves as how they come.

But let’s go PAASHAAS

Btw a new poll would suit this argument

@infofront, make a poll please OGnasty or PAASHAAS
Would be nice to see who people following the most in a way of thinking for a near-mid term period.

Maybe a 3th option not to agree with any of them.

well for me with a measly 1.73 coins pushing to grow to 2 coins

which one should I pick to believe.

Hint it is not OG

here's why I am 69 and 1.73x40k=69.2 K

while 1.73x1,000,000=1,730,000

I rather get the 1.7 million plus easy pick for me.

As that is a life changing number for me. Even if I pay 600k in taxes on it.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation
Chartbuddy thanks talkimg.com

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation
Chartbuddy thanks talkimg.com

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation
Chartbuddy thanks talkimg.com

[Hueristic]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Totally agree, the goal post keeps on changing, create a precedence and the oligarch decide whose coins are confiscated, country, government, court and the list will go on.

~
Difficult choices and that's why we all need to decide were we stand and hash it out now years before it becomes imperative.

A decade from now what will a coin be worth?  

Those coins going liquid will tank the value now, imagine when the value it upwards of a cool mil.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Hackability destroys immutability, what part of that do you not understand

[goldkingcoiner]

@infofront, make a poll please OGnasty or PAASHAAS
Would be nice to see who people following the most in a way of thinking for a near-mid term period.

Maybe a 3th option not to agree with any of them.

4th option:  sit back with drink and spliff

How is this not the first option? 

[philipma1957]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Totally agree, the goal post keeps on changing, create a precedence and the oligarch decide whose coins are confiscated, country, government, court and the list will go on.

~
Difficult choices and that's why we all need to decide were we stand and hash it out now years before it becomes imperative.

A decade from now what will a coin be worth?  

Those coins going liquid will tank the value now, imagine when the value it upwards of a cool mil.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Hackability destroys immutability, what part of that do you not understand

Which is why freezing all old addresses is wrong.

We need to know if they are hackable.

Of course we don't need to  have all of them hacked if indeed they are hackable.

So 2009 to 2012 all 50 coin blocks they have not been touch = how many of the 210,000 blocks were not touched.

10,000 of them 20,000 of them 30,000 of them

Let's get a list and see how many of them were never withdrawn.

Then we can argue what to do about them.

Personally I would not freeze all of them.

But maybe I would freeze 90% of them.

Then see what happens to the untouched ones.

I really want to know how many old school with full blocks are around and let's see if some say 10% get hacked.

[philipma1957]

we did go over 79k which is nice.

still hoping for that 80k number

[Gachapin]

100k by end of May.


quite some selling at 79k. Some are doing their best to get rid of their coins for cheap.

[OutOfMemory]

100k by end of May.


quite some selling at 79k. Some are doing their best to get rid of their coins for cheap.

$100k by end of May seems overly bullish. There are some key resistance levels to get over, but i'm really not the one to complain about a rising price.

~
Difficult choices and that's why we all need to decide were we stand and hash it out now years before it becomes imperative.

A decade from now what will a coin be worth?  

Those coins going liquid will tank the value now, imagine when the value it upwards of a cool mil.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Seconded. If you ever worry about the (monetary) worth of Bitcoin, you didn't get the idea of it. Just because Satoshi advised to hodl Bitcoin and that it will go up in price by itself (yeah, i did put it quite simple here but i think you get what i mean), doesn't mean that this is the sole purpose of Bitcoin. It's just a (convenient) side-effect of a deflational asset.
Thinking of Bitcoin as a technology instead of an asset brought me through all those cycle bear markets without sweating. Sure, it's nice to zoom out and see my net worth going up only, but fiat richness is really not the meaning of (my) life.

[Lucius]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Who is behind this proposal anyway? Are there any sincere intentions to save all these coins from evil hackers, or are those who propose it on the payroll of some very bad and greedy people who have realized that there is a buried treasure that no one has yet claimed?

Be that as it may, it is bad to play with such things, because I do not see a scenario in which everything can end positively.

[Hueristic]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Who is behind this proposal anyway? Are there any sincere intentions to save all these coins from evil hackers, or are those who propose it on the payroll of some very bad and greedy people who have realized that there is a buried treasure that no one has yet claimed?

Be that as it may, it is bad to play with such things, because I do not see a scenario in which everything can end positively.

It's a damned if we do damned if we don't choice.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Hackability destroys immutability, what part of that do you not understand

Which is why freezing all old addresses is wrong.

We need to know if they are hackable.

Of course we don't need to  have all of them hacked if indeed they are hackable.

So 2009 to 2012 all 50 coin blocks they have not been touch = how many of the 210,000 blocks were not touched.

10,000 of them 20,000 of them 30,000 of them

Let's get a list and see how many of them were never withdrawn.

Then we can argue what to do about them.

Personally I would not freeze all of them.

But maybe I would freeze 90% of them.

Then see what happens to the untouched ones.

I really want to know how many old school with full blocks are around and let's see if some say 10% get hacked.

We will never know when they are hackable before they are hacked thats the problem.

And once they are hackable with QC they are gone, poof, it will take no time at all.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation
Chartbuddy thanks talkimg.com

[OutOfMemory]

And once they are hackable with QC they are gone, poof, it will take no time at all.

World-usable QC is a wet dream of the same category as (real) AI.
Just my uhm... opinion  

[Hueristic]

And once they are hackable with QC they are gone, poof, it will take no time at all.

World-usable QC is a wet dream of the same category as (real) AI.
Just my uhm... opinion  

Even without QC, classical will eventually get to the point, it is inevitable.

AFA AI, the definition really is fuzzy, originating thought is the definition afaik. But even without that, the models are insanely intelligent and only act to follow their instructions with zero concern of the side effects which make them extremely dangerous and we have retarded leaders that will put them in charge of infrastructure and weapon systems, that is inevitable as well.

Here is the thing, I have zero doubt that all QC developing corporation have instructions to notify the Fed as soon as they have the capabilities under national security heading. Once that happens the Fed will move all those coins for "safe keeping" and then will pass a law or announce it is part of the bitcoin treasury. And no they don't manipulate markets, we all know that.

[philipma1957]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Who is behind this proposal anyway? Are there any sincere intentions to save all these coins from evil hackers, or are those who propose it on the payroll of some very bad and greedy people who have realized that there is a buried treasure that no one has yet claimed?

Be that as it may, it is bad to play with such things, because I do not see a scenario in which everything can end positively.

It's a damned if we do damned if we don't choice.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Hackability destroys immutability, what part of that do you not understand

Which is why freezing all old addresses is wrong.

We need to know if they are hackable.

Of course we don't need to  have all of them hacked if indeed they are hackable.

So 2009 to 2012 all 50 coin blocks they have not been touch = how many of the 210,000 blocks were not touched.

10,000 of them 20,000 of them 30,000 of them

Let's get a list and see how many of them were never withdrawn.

Then we can argue what to do about them.

Personally I would not freeze all of them.

But maybe I would freeze 90% of them.

Then see what happens to the untouched ones.

I really want to know how many old school with full blocks are around and let's see if some say 10% get hacked.

We will never know when they are hackable before they are hacked thats the problem.

And once they are hackable with QC they are gone, poof, it will take no time at all.

Right which is why I would freeze 90% of the old untouched blocks.

I still would only leave some unfrozen.

But listing all untouched 2009-2012

And all 2012-2017

 ie all 50 coin and 25 coin untouched blocks listed to see just how many are around.

So let's get the list.

It would be 210,000 +210,000 = 420,000 blocks a max of 15,750,000 coins

Minus the moved ones . Let's get the numbers for that.

[Hueristic]

The thing with BIP-361 is, when we start freezing/seizing addresses and coins ... when will we stop? And who decides?

If it happens once, it will happen again, to a neighborhood near you. Remember Craig S. Wright?

Press the button and someone you don't know will die. And then someone else will press the same button, and they will not know you. Remember that?

Who is behind this proposal anyway? Are there any sincere intentions to save all these coins from evil hackers, or are those who propose it on the payroll of some very bad and greedy people who have realized that there is a buried treasure that no one has yet claimed?

Be that as it may, it is bad to play with such things, because I do not see a scenario in which everything can end positively.

It's a damned if we do damned if we don't choice.

It does not matter what the valuation will be at a given point of time, BTCitcoin is created to be an immutable asset and it should stay that way irrespective of what the economist think.

Hackability destroys immutability, what part of that do you not understand

Which is why freezing all old addresses is wrong.

We need to know if they are hackable.

Of course we don't need to  have all of them hacked if indeed they are hackable.

So 2009 to 2012 all 50 coin blocks they have not been touch = how many of the 210,000 blocks were not touched.

10,000 of them 20,000 of them 30,000 of them

Let's get a list and see how many of them were never withdrawn.

Then we can argue what to do about them.

Personally I would not freeze all of them.

But maybe I would freeze 90% of them.

Then see what happens to the untouched ones.

I really want to know how many old school with full blocks are around and let's see if some say 10% get hacked.

We will never know when they are hackable before they are hacked thats the problem.

And once they are hackable with QC they are gone, poof, it will take no time at all.

Right which is why I would freeze 90% of the old untouched blocks.

I still would only leave some unfrozen.

Freezing is just like kicking the can down the road and can open arguments to unfreezing them and that will all be played out in court.

You want the government deciding what to do with those coins?

They need to be destroyed and/or moved to emission tail end.

[OgNasty]

Hint it is not OG

We’ll see. If I’m wrong I make millions of dollars and if I’m right I make dozens of Bitcoin. I am fine with either outcome but at this point it is just numbers on a computer screen to me. I’m more interested in helping others avoid making huge mistakes like not taking profits every four years or buying the top of the cycle.

[Richy_T]

Just a thought experiment. What if the freeze went through and shortly after, before any quantum hack was possible, a transaction moving a large quantity of Satoshi's coins was published?

(I don't mean the mechanical outcome which is obvious, I mean more about what would follow in the community).