Trumps Travel Ban? (Round 2)

[joebrook]

Trump may have a made a mistake by doing things openly.

He could have ordered an unofficial travel ban as well. Visas for Syrians or Somalis have only been delivered on a case-by-case basis for years. Trump could have discreetly ordered to make the scanning process even more rigorous, actually blocking all demands, and nobody would have noticed.

Why should he do something like that? He is the president of the United States, and he is having the liberty to change and modify the policies regarding immigration. It is the judges who are overstepping their jurisdiction.

This is correct, but Trump must wait until Gorsuch is confirmed for the Supreme Court, and then go with a broad question to them:

Can circuit court judges trump an executive order of Trump?

If the question is not posed broadly, then these renegade judges can go time and time again, over ruling a President.

With Gorsuch confirmed and the Court then 5-4 instead of 4-4 as is current, then a decision can be rendered that solves this matter once and for all.

Notice they have largely left the challenges alone. After Gorush makes it in, suddenly, it will get appealed to the highest court in the land. I'm curious to see what else gets pushed to the court once makes it in (its pretty much inevitable at this point).

... and now that he is in, voila! Travel ban reinstated, but partially. I really don't get this; it's like they actually want chaos to ensue. Suspending review but letting it be actionable?

Notice we haven't had a terror attack on US soil recently (well, Islamic terror at least). This tells me two things. One, since this occurred while we didn't have the ban in place, I have to wonder how effective it will be. And two, now that this topic (it's perceived globally as a 'Muslim Ban) is at the forefront of global consciousness, will that illusion of safety falter?

And on the topic of shit that finally made it through the pipeline, that Christian cake thing might see the light of day.

And we all know it's a waste, because the cake is quite obviously a lie

Hehehe this is democracy at work here, Trump has received a huge boost in the travel ban and am loving it, now these liberal judges won't be able to interfere in what in my opinion is great for the country as a whole.

[squatz1]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Probably going to be something that's gonna set a precedence with the federal courts and executive actions of this order as well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/us/politics/supreme-court-trump-travel-ban-case.html - Here's the NY Times article.

[GreenBits]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Probably going to be something that's gonna set a precedence with the federal courts and executive actions of this order as well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/us/politics/supreme-court-trump-travel-ban-case.html - Here's the NY Times article.

Lord I hope not. When we get the next Democratic POTUS in office, I hope judicial oversight has not degraded to the point that he would be able to ram silly shit down the pipe without any challenge, like say, a firearm ban, or revocation of current gun laws, in the name of national security. Just like when Dems used the nuclear option, and the Rebups came right behind them and did it again for Trump's confirmations. What goes around comes around, and I want to see the separation of power as deliniated as it can possibly be. We are breaking the system fighting each other, the parties I mean.

Two more things, I thought this was fucking hilarious

Second, the timetable suggested by the Supreme Court means that the October hearing may never happen. Here’s why. If the travel ban goes into (partial) effect in three days, as specified by Mr Trump’s clarification on June 14th, it will run its course in 90 days, expiring on September 27th, 2017. That’s five days before the justices take their seats for their next term. There is no need to judge the legality or constitutionality of a ban that has expired.

It's gonna run its course before they take it up again if he writes a new one, we will restart this process anew.

Also,

Justice Clarence Thomas, joined by Justices Samuel Alito and Neil Gorsuch, wrote separately to say they would have revived Mr Trump’s travel ban in full. The “compromise will burden executive officials with the task of deciding—on peril of contempt— whether individuals from the six affected nations who wish to enter the United States have a sufficient connection to a person or entity in this country”, they wrote, and will invite “a flood of litigation”. And, Justice Thomas added, the very judges that blocked Mr Trump’s travel ban would probably be the ones considering whether a potential traveler has a “bona fide” reason for being excused from it.

I'm sure the judges that blocked the ban aren't going to enforce it in this circumstance. 'Bonafide'.

[millionaireshs]

Maybe travel ban concerns with their security it promotes racism on the other hand. It is justifiable for president trump to implement this rule but it is not for the affected people in this situation.

[Palmerson]

I see that gradually, the hype around the Trump subside. Probably the President's opponents realized that to organize impeachment proceedings will be very difficult to hold. Now all their efforts are aimed at discrediting Trump without consequences for him, and it makes no sense. Americans will still have to pay for their choice all 4 years.

[aesma]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

[Spendulus]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Probably going to be something that's gonna set a precedence with the federal courts and executive actions of this order as well.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/26/us/politics/supreme-court-trump-travel-ban-case.html - Here's the NY Times article.

After being bitch slapped like that, if liberal district court judges try something similar again they could easily be impeached.

[Spendulus]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

[Sithara007]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Surprising to see the extreme-left judges such as Darth Vader Ginsburg not expressing dissent with the ruling. Leftist judges have always interpreted the constitution to suit their own views, and have repeatedly over-reached their boundaries.

[Spendulus]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Surprising to see the extreme-left judges such as Darth Vader Ginsburg not expressing dissent with the ruling. Leftist judges have always interpreted the constitution to suit their own views, and have repeatedly over-reached their boundaries.

Apparently they reached a hard limit to the boundaries this time around.

District court judges telling POTUS what he can and cannot do?

There's quite obviously a serious problem there.

[aesma]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

[aesma]

And the Supreme Court has no brought it back under an unanimous decision of the justices, they also came out and said that the federal courts under them had been overreaching their boundaries and shouldn't have done this. So I would be considering this a big win for the GOP and Trump in general.

Surprising to see the extreme-left judges such as Darth Vader Ginsburg not expressing dissent with the ruling. Leftist judges have always interpreted the constitution to suit their own views, and have repeatedly over-reached their boundaries.

Apparently they reached a hard limit to the boundaries this time around.

District court judges telling POTUS what he can and cannot do?

There's quite obviously a serious problem there.

Trump has no idea what he can or cannot do, should and shouldn't do, etc. In fact he has no idea about what he's doing at any time. He's like a small child or a pet.

[Xester]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

So to wrap it all, US is behind all these crises.  I am near to believe that the US is behind every terrorist.  That they funded them to gain control on the Middle East countries because these countries are rich in oil.  If they have control with it then maybe they would be really the super country in the world.  They stir up these countries because they cannot handle it.  Besides, according to what I have read, US have many debts.

[Spendulus]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

So to wrap it all, US is behind all these crises.  I am near to believe that the US is behind every terrorist.  That they funded them to gain control on the Middle East countries because these countries are rich in oil.  ....

Besides, look at what the US Fracking industry has done. Driven the price of oil down below $50 a barrel. Created energy independence for the USA.

[whaawh]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

So to wrap it all, US is behind all these crises.  I am near to believe that the US is behind every terrorist.  That they funded them to gain control on the Middle East countries because these countries are rich in oil.  ....

Besides, look at what the US Fracking industry has done. Driven the price of oil down below $50 a barrel. Created energy independence for the USA.

That these oil tycoons themselves regulate prices in the market in hand practically, and no one else will be able to influence oil. But nevertheless, I noticed that Despite the fact that oil is cheaper, gasoline and other fuels are still rising in price. I do not know why such a trend persists and to whom it is profitable.

[Spendulus]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

So to wrap it all, US is behind all these crises.  I am near to believe that the US is behind every terrorist.  That they funded them to gain control on the Middle East countries because these countries are rich in oil.  ....

Besides, look at what the US Fracking industry has done. Driven the price of oil down below $50 a barrel. Created energy independence for the USA.

That these oil tycoons themselves regulate prices in the market in hand practically, and no one else will be able to influence oil. But nevertheless, I noticed that Despite the fact that oil is cheaper, gasoline and other fuels are still rising in price. I do not know why such a trend persists and to whom it is profitable.

Doesn't the result of small businessmen in the USA, fracking, and driving world oil prices down below $50, breaking the back of OPEC oil price rigging, mean something?

Doesn't it mean the US is not behind secret deals and politics in the Middle East?

[joebrook]

Five months in and Trump still hasn't figured out "what's going on" ? In fact he has caused a crisis in the Middle East that could cause a regional war (another one) by playing buddies with Saudi Arabia, the main people responsible for radical Islam's existence !

He's caused a crisis? Bull.

Hillary Clinton caused a crisis. Obama caused several crises.

Trump got the ME leaders together quite nicely recently.

Was Iran there ? No, of course. He caused the crisis with Qatar with that "get together" where he sided with the worst of radical islamists, against more moderate (but not good, don't get me wrong) Iran. Now a war with Iran is very possible because of Trump.

So to wrap it all, US is behind all these crises.  I am near to believe that the US is behind every terrorist.  That they funded them to gain control on the Middle East countries because these countries are rich in oil.  ....

Besides, look at what the US Fracking industry has done. Driven the price of oil down below $50 a barrel. Created energy independence for the USA.

The oil industry is gradually becoming irrelevant in the modern world, due to the number of electric cars in the system, the other oil producing countries should just come and reduce production cost, that will cause a small shortage in the international world and drive up the price of oil once again.

[Netnox]

The oil industry is gradually becoming irrelevant in the modern world, due to the number of electric cars in the system, the other oil producing countries should just come and reduce production cost, that will cause a small shortage in the international world and drive up the price of oil once again.

The electric cars are having close to zero impact. Due to their high cost, the electric cars are unaffordable to the vast majority of the vehicle owners. Now coming back to the topic, what has caused the irrelevance of the oil industry (and OPEC in particular) is the expanding role of the American shale oil producers.

[GreenBits]

Also,

Justice Clarence Thomas, joined by Justices Samuel Alito and Neil Gorsuch, wrote separately to say they would have revived Mr Trump’s travel ban in full. The “compromise will burden executive officials with the task of deciding—on peril of contempt— whether individuals from the six affected nations who wish to enter the United States have a sufficient connection to a person or entity in this country”, they wrote, and will invite “a flood of litigation”. And, Justice Thomas added, the very judges that blocked Mr Trump’s travel ban would probably be the ones considering whether a potential traveler has a “bona fide” reason for being excused from it.

I'm sure the judges that blocked the ban aren't going to enforce it in this circumstance. 'Bonafide'.

Lawyers for the Trump administration went back to the Supreme Court again late Friday in the ongoing battle over President Donald Trump's travel ban -- this time asking the justices to resolve the uncertainty created by last month's ruling on which foreign nationals are exempt from the ban.

The Supreme Court decided in June that the travel ban must not apply to those people with a "bona fide connection" to a person or entity in the United States while the case is pending full argument this fall. The justices further explained that for "individuals, a close familial relationship is required."
A federal judge in Hawaii ruled Thursday, however, that the administration's decision to keep out some foreign nationals with close family members (like grandparents) but not others (like spouses) defied common sense, and was not in line with the spirit of the Supreme Court's decision.
Justice Department lawyers argued in Friday night's motion that the justices should now clarify what they meant in June and, in the meantime, place an immediate freeze on the lower court's decision.
"The district court's interpretation of this Court's ... ruling distorts this Court's decision and upends the equitable balance this Court struck," lawyers said in the motion. "And the district court's sweeping interpretation of 'close familial relationship' ... to encompass a wide range of distant relatives -- including cousins, uncles, and siblings-in-law -- effectively eliminates the 'close' requirement and has no basis in this Court's ruling."
Justice Clarence Thomas predicted in June that the Court's "compromise" decision would prove unworkable.

The justices may ask for the state of Hawaii to respond to the Justice Department's motion before issuing a decision on the latest dispute.


In retrospect, I dont think they handed him a win on this. what they did hand him was a political time bomb, the opportunity to drop the ball a third time regarding the travel ban. Mr. Thomas told us this, but we failed to listen I see. at this point, im almost hoping you guys do deliver on healthcare, its been a rough week/month/quarter/whole administration for the guys in the WH. Insert bigly joke.

so, thoughts? you cant really argue the logic on this, although this is clearly obstructionist in nature. they just have a point; how do you fuck over all the grandmas and grandpas in all this? jokes aside, its obviously a close relationship in American society, and we have intergenerational cohabitation in some homes, I lived with my gma for a little while when I was a kid.

[Sithara007]

Doesn't the result of small businessmen in the USA, fracking, and driving world oil prices down below $50, breaking the back of OPEC oil price rigging, mean something?

Doesn't it mean the US is not behind secret deals and politics in the Middle East?

The previous American government encouraged fracking, in order to bring down the crude oil prices, and thereby bankrupting Russia. They thought that Russia will not last for more than one or two years. But even after more than three years, Russia is going strong.