Alt shilling increase when Bitcoin is under attack

[Kprawn]

Have you noticed how the shilling for certain Alt coins increase, with every "attack" on Bitcoin over the years? Someone has found the perfect

method to make a lot of money out of these attacks. It is subtle, but it is there.... So the theory is.... Buy a certain Alt coin and then introduce

some threat to Bitcoin and start shilling for a Alt coin..... The price of BTC goes down and the price of the Alt coins goes up. { depending on what

coin is being shilled }

The people who bought cheap Alt coins before the shilling started... starts to sell slowly at the peak and start to buy cheaper Bitcoins again.

Rinse & repeat with different Alt coins. 

Can someone draw the Alt coin stats for the different time periods when these attacks occurred?

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[HabBear]

I believe there is a correlation but I don't agree with your causation. I don't think alt coin holders are creating attacks. The reason? Because we never hear about the the bad news for bitcoin immediately before the drop. There's a drop in bitcoin and then the people speculate why and some of that speculation is always about which alt coin has increased. I think the drop happens, people get out and immediately put their money into another coin...so as to never have it idle or in fiat.

Maybe I'm wrong. Do you have any real examples to prove your point?

[franky1]

core cry when the price moves up and down and try making it sound important
meanwhile exchange move from $935 ⇘ $933 by a user with just $302(324mbtc)
meanwhile exchange move from $933 ⇗ $935 by a user with just $50(54mbtc)

(note trades measured in mBTC (0.001btc)

less than $302(324mbtc) to drop the price from $935 to $933⇘
yep $302 to make the market cap change by $32,470,200.00

then ~$50(54mbtc) to ramp the price from $933 to $935⇗
yep $50 to make the market cap change by 32,470,200.00

price movements are not a sign of any "community consensus".. but due to low funds being used and also the high increments per orderline causing the volatility($1 gap per increment)... making it easy to make the market volatile without needing large community/whales

[Kprawn]

I believe there is a correlation but I don't agree with your causation. I don't think alt coin holders are creating attacks. The reason? Because we never hear about the the bad news for bitcoin immediately before the drop. There's a drop in bitcoin and then the people speculate why and some of that speculation is always about which alt coin has increased. I think the drop happens, people get out and immediately put their money into another coin...so as to never have it idle or in fiat.

Maybe I'm wrong. Do you have any real examples to prove your point?

Nope this is just a casual observation over the years. The spike in the Alt coins might just be people hedging their investments in calm waters,

when things are rough on the BTC side, but the shilling seems to increase during these times. People are not just hedging, they are hunting

quick profits with every "attack" and then return back to Bitcoin. We will see this again after this "BU attack" has passed.  

Someone has definitely seen this pattern and they are cashing in on the opportunity to make some extra profit.  

[BrewMaster]

apparently that strategy works for these shitcoins, they have no basis to increase their demand other than spamvertising with constant spamming the boards.

we all have to learn to read between the lines as its said.
whenever the altcoin shilling starts that means an altcoin pump has begun and when the shilling goes to the highest levels that means the pumpers are getting desperate and that is a good sign for us to exit their markets by dumping before the pumper shills dump themselves.

[OneUnderBridge]

I don't think that the migration from bitcoin to the altcoins, and vice versa, is a collusive effort. It's a natural event that can be logically evaluated from a game theory perspective. Yes, there may be a certain amount of "shilling" a certain project based on the circumstances under debate, but that's natural.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Haven't exactly noticed a pattern, but I've definitely noticed there's more 'shilling' (your term) of shitcoins lately.  I'm almost ready to put the whole altcoin section on ignore for a while.  There's just too many garbage threads.

[HabBear]

Any previous examples that look suspicous to you?

If it's just seeking the safety of an alt coin, there's nothing suspicious going on, no attack based on the premise that one person or a group of people just want to pump an alt coin. Obviously the BU attack isn't based (technically) on an alt coin pump.

I believe there is a correlation but I don't agree with your causation. I don't think alt coin holders are creating attacks. The reason? Because we never hear about the the bad news for bitcoin immediately before the drop. There's a drop in bitcoin and then the people speculate why and some of that speculation is always about which alt coin has increased. I think the drop happens, people get out and immediately put their money into another coin...so as to never have it idle or in fiat.

Maybe I'm wrong. Do you have any real examples to prove your point?

Nope this is just a casual observation over the years. The spike in the Alt coins might just be people hedging their investments in calm waters,

when things are rough on the BTC side, but the shilling seems to increase during these times. People are not just hedging, they are hunting

quick profits with every "attack" and then return back to Bitcoin. We will see this again after this "BU attack" has passed.  

Someone has definitely seen this pattern and they are cashing in on the opportunity to make some extra profit.  

Which coins are "shit"?

Haven't exactly noticed a pattern, but I've definitely noticed there's more 'shilling' (your term) of shitcoins lately.  I'm almost ready to put the whole altcoin section on ignore for a while.  There's just too many garbage threads.

[Chris!]

Haven't exactly noticed a pattern, but I've definitely noticed there's more 'shilling' (your term) of shitcoins lately.  I'm almost ready to put the whole altcoin section on ignore for a while.  There's just too many garbage threads.

You haven't ignored the whole altcoin section of the forum yet?! I did it years ago and now I look like this:

[Dart18]

But that is still not perfect right? You could be wrong at some point and lose money.

[manselr]

Smart whales are using the Buggy Unlimited FUD to cause massive pumps in the market. Who will be the next coin to go %1000+? I dont know but I sure hope im holding some of that shit.

[OneUnderBridge]

Smart whales are using the Buggy Unlimited FUD to cause massive pumps in the market. Who will be the next coin to go %1000+? I dont know but I sure hope im holding some of that shit.

^^^^^ 
Me too!  And, I probably am holding some of that dung-da-dung!

[Yakamoto]

I believe there is a correlation but I don't agree with your causation. I don't think alt coin holders are creating attacks. The reason? Because we never hear about the the bad news for bitcoin immediately before the drop. There's a drop in bitcoin and then the people speculate why and some of that speculation is always about which alt coin has increased. I think the drop happens, people get out and immediately put their money into another coin...so as to never have it idle or in fiat.

Maybe I'm wrong. Do you have any real examples to prove your point?

The thing is, it is incredibly difficult to prove something like this beyond showing a correlation between changes in Bitcoin's value and an uptick in the amount of coins that are being shilled during the downturn period. On some other websites, shilling programs are made known through leaked documents or connections between people that tie in together. Something like Bitcointalk doesn't have networks being formed against it, and most of the time generic alt holders will attack to try and pump their investment.

There is a high chance that shills show up, but it's next to completely unprovable beyond correlations.

[unamis76]

This has definitely happen at some points in history. It happened with LTC and now with ETH, when there's something less good with BTC people tend to start talking about other coins... It's not something you can just show a post and prove it exists. It's something generalised and that is somehow discreet. Lauda posted an interesting thread a while back that has a small paragraph regarding this.

[SONG GEET]

This days, there is no need to have any attack on bitcoin network to create panic on market. Just start fuding about hard fork and network split, many people will start selling their bitcoin immediately being panic.

Short alt during bitcoin pump like right now.
Long alt when bitcoin price will be at peak/ATH or when there is fud/attack on bitcoin network.

[Sundark]

Do you have any particular examples of that behavior? Shilling for altcoins is as old as altcoin scene, it won't change nor stop.
I wouldn't link this as something used to disrupt bitcoin network, most altcoins communities are not even that prominent to pull off something of this caliber.

[ebliever]

Not everything is a conspiracy. In case you haven't noticed, there has been a very broad-based rise in the entire altcoin market. Some more than others, but scores if not hundreds of coins have grown as bitcoin has deflated since the ETF rejection March 10. (For example, I take note of the market cap of the 100th coin on Coinmarketcap, which gives me a measure of overall altcoin performance. It's almost doubled in that timeframe.)

Let's say I have a position in Altcoin A. If I FUD myself silly against bitcoin, how do I know the response will be to invest in Altcoin A? Why not Altcoins B, C, D... through ZZZ?  Why wouldn't people just exit crypto for fiat entirely?

I hear a lot of moaning and groaning and conspiracy-theorizing around here that seems to regard any support for alts as illegitimate, and any negative mention of bitcoin's prospects as likewise illegitimate. But trying to shut up dissent isn't going to fix any of bitcoin's problems. You can slow down an outbound migration by keeping newbies in the dark for a little while, but it's all just a delaying action if you aren't fixing the issues.

So I would suggest focusing on making the positive case for bitcoin and trying to be constructive as regards the issues. Bitcoin is still the market leader. It still has tremendous price support. Even if nothing is done the transaction bottleneck only throttles bitcoin, it cannot kill it. A future as a niche vehicle for "digital gold" is still a tremendously valuable proposition, and one that can survive a high fee environment. (If some way out of the Core/BU morass can be found that provides offchain solutions ahead of market adoption of the same within Ethereum and so forth, and if simple privacy tools cut into the edge coins like Dash and Monero and ZEC have, so much the better.)

[K128kevin2]

Which coins are "shit"?

Most of them. A lot of them bring nothing new or interesting to the table and exist solely to make their creators a quick buck.

[HabBear]

Which coins are "shit"?

Most of them. A lot of them bring nothing new or interesting to the table and exist solely to make their creators a quick buck.

Ok, so which precious few are solid? Come on...let's add some detail to this conversation.


Oh and to Kprawn...just saw this news: Bitcoin price dives after SEC rejects plans for ETF! Another behind-the-scenes scheme for someone leveraged heavily on some alt coin?

http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-price-dives-after-sec-rejects-plans-for-etf-2017-3

[ErdosnCoffee]

I don't think there is any "global conspiracy"  . Whales make money off of impacting the market with buy/sell walls, what you're described is decentralized and done by unsophisticated groups of pumpers and dumpers taking advantage of the current situation.