Girl gets raided by police looking for bitcoins

[Nagadota]

What a clusterfuck for this poor girl/woman. Obviously the larger amount caught their eye. This is why I never change back to fiat. That's obviously how they can steal your money. Good luck getting your hands on my bitcoins.

Don't present her like she's just an innocent Bitcoin owner who suddenly got raided by the police.  She's clearly a serious criminal (or let's just say a criminal who has a lot of money - clearly she's a complete idiot for doing a transaction over $10,000 without declaring it one way or another).  Do your research before posting.

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[Juggy777]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/68nh7q/knock_knock_police_you_have_bitcoins/

I think this deserves it's own thread, and it shows how much we need Confidential Transactions, CoinJoin, Schnorr sigs, Mimblewimble, and whatever else we can do to improve fungibility of bitcoin.

The fear of ending up in trouble due owning BTC that may have been connected to criminal activity in the past is a very reasonable concern.

How do we solve this? Tone Vays already said that he is pretty scared to sell his BTC because he doesn't know if he is going to end up having problems.

First of all her English is really the problem out here and that's lead op to believe it all happened because of Bitcoins. It is evident that she did some transactions of euros now that exactly is that she's silent on. Then she blames the immigrants. She's very nicely dumped the blame on Bitcoins and and I am sure she's lying, she's only trying to gain support by using the name of Bitcoins. I don't believe in her story that bitcoin caused it.

[dissident]

Girl using bitcoin.  You know damn well this is fake news!

For the rest of us swinging dicks, try buying Dash or something.   There hasn't been a news article yet where the pigs have confiscated a shitcoin.  Like 99.99% of the population,  I'm sure they don't even know such things exist.

There are no girls with bitcoin, unless their boyfriends gave it to them.

[TreeAcid]

Was she hot?

[leopard2]

transferring over 12500 without filling in that harmless statistical form, is a misdemeanor, this story doesn't make sense

and btc transfers do certainly not fall under the limit, this is only a central bank statistical tool...

unless they were using the misdemeanor charge for a search warrant, which would not be a suprise, in Germany a search warrant can be obtained for almost no reason at all. Trouble is that many countries, Germany included, evidence found via illegally obtained search warrants, CAN be used in court, so it is a very popular tool

In US that evidence would be worthless  

[Dude.Lebowski]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/68nh7q/knock_knock_police_you_have_bitcoins/

I think this deserves it's own thread, and it shows how much we need Confidential Transactions, CoinJoin, Schnorr sigs, Mimblewimble, and whatever else we can do to improve fungibility of bitcoin.

The fear of ending up in trouble due owning BTC that may have been connected to criminal activity in the past is a very reasonable concern.

How do we solve this? Tone Vays already said that he is pretty scared to sell his BTC because he doesn't know if he is going to end up having problems.

We already have Monero.

[coszy]

transferring over 12500 without filling in that harmless statistical form, is a misdemeanor, this story doesn't make sense

and btc transfers do certainly not fall under the limit, this is only a central bank statistical tool...

unless they were using the misdemeanor charge for a search warrant, which would not be a suprise, in Germany a search warrant can be obtained for almost no reason at all. Trouble is that many countries, Germany included, evidence found via illegally obtained search warrants, CAN be used in court, so it is a very popular tool

In US that evidence would be worthless  

Bitcoin will always attract both users and authorities who will look for opportunities to punish the Bitcoin user. And note that this is only in countries where Bitcoin is not legal.

[QuestionAuthority]

Wow, this thread turned into the male chauvinist pig thread pretty quickly.

You guys need to release some tension. You should all go home and beat your wives.

[dissident]

Wow, this thread turned into the male chauvinist pig thread pretty quickly.

You guys need to release some tension. You should all go home and beat your wives.

sarcasm is your friend.

[olushakes]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/68nh7q/knock_knock_police_you_have_bitcoins/

I think this deserves it's own thread, and it shows how much we need Confidential Transactions, CoinJoin, Schnorr sigs, Mimblewimble, and whatever else we can do to improve fungibility of bitcoin.

The fear of ending up in trouble due owning BTC that may have been connected to criminal activity in the past is a very reasonable concern.

How do we solve this? Tone Vays already said that he is pretty scared to sell his BTC because he doesn't know if he is going to end up having problems.

I believe its the responsibility of the police to keep everyone safe to the best of their ability so far its within the ambits of the law. The reason the police would have raided to the best of my knowledge would not have related to bitcoin because only an insane individual will expect to raid and get to see a bag full of bitcoin to be constificated because bitcoin is an electronic money. So if they raided I am sure they have other reasons but bitcoin is only mentioned to attract sympathy.

[maku]

Before y'all start talking about how the state robbed someone of their Bitcoins, do some research.
You can obviously tell, just by reading the first comment, that something's fishy here:


OP is basically a drug drealer and police had every right to do what they did.

Then in this case it is totally different. This girl doesn't need to cry if she is related to drug activities ect. The one who can cry are the families victims of people like her selling death with drugs because a member family using drugs, or died because of drugs, ect

At first I was terrified that Police is hunting law abiding citizens without reason. But this additional info that this girl was dealing with drugs sheds more light into this matter.
Another stupid move was transferring €12.000 or some equally ridiculous high amount at once, and she probably did it many times before.
On more example that dealing with bitcoins is relatively safe, but dealing with 3rd party bitcoin services not so much.

[cellard]

Before y'all start talking about how the state robbed someone of their Bitcoins, do some research.
You can obviously tell, just by reading the first comment, that something's fishy here:


OP is basically a drug drealer and police had every right to do what they did.

Then in this case it is totally different. This girl doesn't need to cry if she is related to drug activities ect. The one who can cry are the families victims of people like her selling death with drugs because a member family using drugs, or died because of drugs, ect

The police doesn't have a right to do shit (they can I know, but that doesn't mean it's right). Again, anyone can use mixers, and if someone uses a mixer to improve their privacy, you can end up fucked by the police due unlucky coins received after the mixing.

The bottomline is, it's a lottery, anyone could be holding coins that were once used by some criminal, they end up in a exchange, and then you deposit money on a exchange, do your trading, withdraw and you end up raided.

We need improvements in privacy now.

[anonymoustroll420]

The bottomline is, it's a lottery, anyone could be holding coins that were once used by some criminal, they end up in a exchange, and then you deposit money on a exchange, do your trading, withdraw and you end up raided.

Thats not what happened here. Most companies are aware that blockchain analysis is not accurate (except for coinbase)

What happened is she sent/received over 10,000euro to her bank account. In the EU, you are required to report bank transactions over 10,000euro to the tax office. Due to a loophole you are not required to report Bitcoin transactions over 10,000euro, only bank/cash transactions. It is supposedly to prevent money laundering and funding terrorism. She didn't report it. She got raided. The initial raid was just to investigate the unreported transaction(s). Who knows if she'll face charges or not, depends on the evidence the police have.

[coolcoinz]

She fucked up and made a bank transaction over 10,000euro without reporting it to the tax office. You are required to report all transactions over 10,000euro. The only way this is related to Bitcoin is that the transaction was allegedly for buying/selling BTC, but the police raided her because she made bank transactions over 10,000euro without reporting it.

Even drug dealers gotta pay taxes. Did she not learn anything from Al Capone?

I've never heard about such rule. You're not supposed to report large transactions, although the banks can do it without your knowledge. You're expected to report revenue and money transfers aren't revenue. I think this harassment by the authorities must have something to do with anti-terrorist financing.
You aren't breaking any laws by sending or receiving large sums. You can be checked by your tax office, but this looks nothing like the situation described here. Normally the tax office invites you to clarify these transfers by providing paperwork, they don't raid your home and take your stuff!

[anonymoustroll420]

I've never heard about such rule. You're not supposed to report large transactions, although the banks can do it without your knowledge. You're expected to report revenue and money transfers aren't revenue. I think this harassment by the authorities must have something to do with anti-terrorist financing.
You aren't breaking any laws by sending or receiving large sums. You can be checked by your tax office, but this looks nothing like the situation described here. Normally the tax office invites you to clarify these transfers by providing paperwork, they don't raid your home and take your stuff!

I did a bit of research. The regulation in question is this:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32015L0849

In most countries in the EU, the banks automatically report them. In Germany, where the OP lives, you need to report them yourself to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Financial_Supervisory_Authority and fill out a form explaining what the transfer is for. The bank probably notifies them that the transaction happened anyway.

This is different than reporting your income. Thats done for tax purposes, this is done to counter-act money laundering etc.

Seems like the OP made multiple transfers over 10,000euro without reporting any of them. They probably launched some investigation, saw she was a drug dealer and raided her.

[SaShiRaJaVu]

It looks like the girl in picture is doing some real shady business and so is the reason the authorities came knocking ,i was confused reading the entire story about what on earth is happening ,but it looks like she has omitted the crucial area on what the raid is all about. Looking at the comments and her past posting history it looks like she is dealing with drugs and so was the reason she got busted.

[darkangel11]

So, she's using bitcoin as a cover up story to get support from bitcoin community, not to mention the gender argument.
Guys, I'm a girl and a bitcoiner and I was raided by the police because I traded coins! I feel oppressed, they are abusing the law and targeting traders, please help!

[anonymoustroll420]

So, she's using bitcoin as a cover up story to get support from bitcoin community, not to mention the gender argument.
Guys, I'm a girl and a bitcoiner and I was raided by the police because I traded coins! I feel oppressed, they are abusing the law and targeting traders, please help!

[electronicash]

whether OP is a drug dealer or not, still the anonymity should be considered. he should be protected by a technology still revolving the crypto for it could all happen to anyone using bitcoin especially if the bitcoin getting into someone's wallet has history. remember bitcoin isn't an anon coin and can be tracked.

[cellard]

The bottomline is, it's a lottery, anyone could be holding coins that were once used by some criminal, they end up in a exchange, and then you deposit money on a exchange, do your trading, withdraw and you end up raided.

Thats not what happened here. Most companies are aware that blockchain analysis is not accurate (except for coinbase)

What happened is she sent/received over 10,000euro to her bank account. In the EU, you are required to report bank transactions over 10,000euro to the tax office. Due to a loophole you are not required to report Bitcoin transactions over 10,000euro, only bank/cash transactions. It is supposedly to prevent money laundering and funding terrorism. She didn't report it. She got raided. The initial raid was just to investigate the unreported transaction(s). Who knows if she'll face charges or not, depends on the evidence the police have.

And Coinbase happen to be the biggest one.

Please think, in the future, this will be the norm. All major service providers are going to end up like this, it's only a matter of time the government throws endless resources into blockchain analysis linking it all to all possible gateways like exchanges in order to catch everyone that is unlucky to be holding coins that are traced back to criminal activities.

The *only* way to counteract it is to make it impossible by improving bitcoin privacy at its core.