Advice on Mining Farm Buildout

[gwestcot]

its not even the cost of installing it, i am adding 600 amp service to my gargage
single phase but they still need a separate transformer forcthat much. load they install it for free
but you need a city permit for the tansformer and that can be denied or take months to aprove
I had them go ahead with the permit request a d they chaarged me $300 for the permit said it it was approved
 there would be no further charges

Well that is for a home installation so the process is likely different than in a commercial location. But trust me the install is far more expensive the further from a line it is or depending on if you want it above ground or below ground. That being said, I am not doing this until the end of the year so I can see my tax liabilities before building out a space. I need 480V 3 phase because of the CRAC unit and the 4 fan condenser. A lot of people forgo this altogether and use ambient air to cool their place but I would prefer a dedicated cooling source. I think I am starting out with 30 nvidia rigs but it all depends on how much the landscape changes and how much money I have at the end of the year for startup.

[btcgolong]

Hello everyone! I am now attempting to move from home mining into a 1250 sq ft warehouse. I will increase my mining from 5 to 20 6x GTX 1070 zcash mining rigs. The rigs are rack mountable and will be installed in 42U racks. I am also going to have 3 phase 480V service installed at the maximum amount of amperage allowable by the power company. I have read up quite a bit on data center infrastructure which seems to be similar to a mining operation. I will have raised floors with the cooling initially being done by a single 30 ton Liebert downflow CRAC Unit. Additionally, I will be using a hot aisle cold aisle setup to maintain air flow efficiency. My main issue is in my lack of knowledge with power distribution. Unlike a data center, I do not initially care about redundancy and backup power because of cost considerations so a single flow of electricity is fine by me for my first setup. My main question has to do with how the large 225+ kvA PDU's are installed. Do they wire into a main distribution panel or do they feed directly into a service line? My single line was hard to plan because I lack the knowledge. It was supposed to go service line-->panel-->PDU's (480V to 208V/120V)-->Vertical metered PDU's-->Mining Rigs. I will also have all my wiring, patch cables and electrical conduit run through cable trays above the racks. If you have any information that could help me with power distribution or the overall design of my medium sized farm then I would be very thankful! Have a great day!    

I'm going to talk to my electrician friend about your issue. But I also want to ask you a question, how long of a lease are you signing? Do you have any concerns about the loss of profitability and being locked in a lease?

I am presently not concerned at all about the long term viability because profitability could go down 2 to 3 times and it would still be fine. I have seen warehouse space in my local area that has a 1 year lease so that is not a problem as well. The main issue with being locked into a long term lease is that you may outgrow your space and need to move but are unable to do so. The main thing is getting the utility company to install the proper transformer and line to supply 480V 3 phase. I will say that from my research it is a lot cheaper if there is a pole that is within 80 feet of your warehouse.

Got a question, why so much AC, are you in an extremely hot climate (Texas)? The Liebert cooling system looks awesome, I guess it can get pretty hot in 1250 sq ft (with 120 cards going), does your warehouse have high ceilings?

The few warehouse's I've rented had 20-30 ft ceiling, but it still got pretty damn hot (no central air or heat) in summer...

[gwestcot]

I live in Florida so yes it is extremely hot. The warehouses I have looked at have 20 ft ceilings. I might actually be able to pull off 30 GTX 1070 rigs with 6 GPU's per rig because of the increased profitability of my current mining at home. I mainly want to buy liebert CRAC units for sustainability and I have noticed an increased hash rate when I have dedicated air conditioning in my home. I have 30 GPU's and with another rig about to be built this would make 36 GPU's in a spare bedroom at my house. I bought a 14400 BTU space air conditioner and also closed many of the vents around my house to concentrate the home air conditioner to only the living room, master bedroom, and my mining room. I have noticed by doing this that my card temps are in the 40's and 50's and I get 5-10% more hashrate than before. (50's are open air rigs and the 40's are my rack mountable ones) To me dedicated air conditioning is worth it as it only, after more careful study, adds anywhere from 15-25% of the electricity consumption. The only thing I am contemplating is putting in raised flooring and going with a downflow unit or forgoing the raised flooring and going with an upflow unit. One provides better cooling efficiency and the other is vastly cheaper as far as startup. Raised flooring for the space I am looking at would easily cost around 15k. I will tell you that I can actually run a maximum of 300 or so rigs in that space as long as I can get a transformer and a new service line to provide enough amperage at 480V 3 phase. I will need 4 of those 30 ton Liebert CRAC units to reach maximum capacity. I worked it out in AutoCAD and there is of course room to spare for the PDU's as well.  

[CjMapope]

Your crazy imo haha

1070's ? dude your like a YEAR too late to build a farm with those lol, you are gonna be lucky to ROI probably before they start bring in like 1$ a day each

Plus all that wasted space, did you not consider DENSITY LONG TERM?  

New mining specific cards are coming out that are gonna DUST your whole farm if you have 1070's, did you consider THAT?

Im just getting RID of my old 1070 for POWERFUL cards, 1080, 1080ti, and stacking my coins for the new mining specific card + volta and vega

Like you literally picked the worse time to choose 1070, o and in 2 months or less they will be 1/2 price

[btcgolong]

Your crazy imo haha

1070's ? dude your like a YEAR too late to build a farm with those lol, you are gonna be lucky to ROI probably before they start bring in like 1$ a day each

Plus all that wasted space, did you not consider DENSITY LONG TERM?  

New mining specific cards are coming out that are gonna DUST your whole farm if you have 1070's, did you consider THAT?

Im just getting RID of my old 1070 for POWERFUL cards, 1080, 1080ti, and stacking my coins for the new mining specific card + volta and vega

Like you literally picked the worse time to choose 1070, o and in 2 months or less they will be 1/2 price

I've read about those cards, one article said they will not be available at the consumer level...isn't that rigging the game?


Another thing to think about is ETH switching to POS someday (this year?)


So you are saying he should go with 1080ti?  It's performance/watts vs price (and availability). I few sites (could be wrong) say the 1080 is only 18-20% faster...does that sound right?

[CjMapope]

Your crazy imo haha

1070's ? dude your like a YEAR too late to build a farm with those lol, you are gonna be lucky to ROI probably before they start bring in like 1$ a day each

Plus all that wasted space, did you not consider DENSITY LONG TERM?  

New mining specific cards are coming out that are gonna DUST your whole farm if you have 1070's, did you consider THAT?

Im just getting RID of my old 1070 for POWERFUL cards, 1080, 1080ti, and stacking my coins for the new mining specific card + volta and vega

Like you literally picked the worse time to choose 1070, o and in 2 months or less they will be 1/2 price

I've read about those cards, one article said they will not be available at the consumer level...isn't that rigging the game?


Another thing to think about is ETH switching to POS someday (this year?)


So you are saying he should go with 1080ti?  It's performance/watts vs price (and availability). I few sites (could be wrong) say the 1080 is only 18-20% faster...does that sound right?

Well there's ALWAYS something to mine, it's just WHEN ETH goes PoS (who knows when but COULD be 6 months from now) there's gonna be literally 1,000,000 hungry GPUs needing shit to mine, so those with 1070 (and 470/480) are gonna get SLAYED in profitability imo
IF we can GET tho miner cards, well thats to be seen, yes

There is hope tho!  New coins all the time and Nvidia can handle ANY algo like a champ unlike AMD, but to build a farm on that hope of new coins is SCARY to say the least.
Also, 1070 is at the  "end of its price point", it WILL go down soon 30 days even

1080 at 20% more powerful, and only 10-15% more price? seems logical to me! think RESALE as well
1080ti will NOT win in price for performance, but in 2 years it will still be profitable AND still resell well (if you get the good brands/models)
PLUS, ROI extends pretty fast when you have to buy WHOLE NEW RIGS every 5 cards just to keep up with 1080ti buyers :/
DENSITY

only my 2 satoshi's of course  i own 1070's as well

[btcgolong]

Not to hijack this thread, but this is sort of relevant, when did Nvidia beat AMD for mining (power and flexibility)?

So long term (counting out the mining only cards that are coming), you are recommending the 1080ti for most (all?) PoW altcoins, correct?


Im in the process of building a rig as we speak.

[cashen]

Great video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-_9F8R_PFU

Does anyone know what remote desktop he is using?

[btcgolong]

Someone asked in the comments, it's: Remote Desktop Manager



https://remotedesktopmanager.com/

[gwestcot]

Your crazy imo haha

1070's ? dude your like a YEAR too late to build a farm with those lol, you are gonna be lucky to ROI probably before they start bring in like 1$ a day each

Plus all that wasted space, did you not consider DENSITY LONG TERM?  

New mining specific cards are coming out that are gonna DUST your whole farm if you have 1070's, did you consider THAT?

Im just getting RID of my old 1070 for POWERFUL cards, 1080, 1080ti, and stacking my coins for the new mining specific card + volta and vega

Like you literally picked the worse time to choose 1070, o and in 2 months or less they will be 1/2 price

This is ridiculous in regards to them bringing in 1 dollar a day each when a rig of 6 1070's is bringing in 50 dollars a day or so right now. I like the 1080TI's as well and I was contemplating going with 2 1080TI's and 4 1070's per rig but as of now I am not planning for that. These cards ROI in 75 days right now so even if in 6 months these mythical cards come out and come out at a good price point I probably won't care that much. I really don't like the idea of mining specific cards for their lack of resale value... How is that any different than an ASIC? Once the new tech comes out those cards would become worthless. If anything 1070's will still hold some resale value as time goes on. I guess I like building rigs with one PSU and 6 GPU's but the 1080TI requires an 8 pin and a 6 pin so that makes things difficult. At any rate, I think that Nvidia, depending on your needs, can be much better than the AMD cards and they are also a lot less hassle in the long run.  

EDIT: We will also see about ETH going POS but as far as I know there isn't anything formal in the timeline of things to be done but I do know that it is in in the timeline for ETC for 2018. At any rate, 1070's are far better than any AMD card in almost every algo with an exception to Ethash. In reality, even if it takes a step towards POS it will likely be POSW so that it is a gradual process.

[Madychoux]

Your crazy imo haha

1070's ? dude your like a YEAR too late to build a farm with those lol, you are gonna be lucky to ROI probably before they start bring in like 1$ a day each

Plus all that wasted space, did you not consider DENSITY LONG TERM?  

New mining specific cards are coming out that are gonna DUST your whole farm if you have 1070's, did you consider THAT?

Im just getting RID of my old 1070 for POWERFUL cards, 1080, 1080ti, and stacking my coins for the new mining specific card + volta and vega

Like you literally picked the worse time to choose 1070, o and in 2 months or less they will be 1/2 price

I've read about those cards, one article said they will not be available at the consumer level...isn't that rigging the game?


Another thing to think about is ETH switching to POS someday (this year?)


So you are saying he should go with 1080ti?  It's performance/watts vs price (and availability). I few sites (could be wrong) say the 1080 is only 18-20% faster...does that sound right?

Well there's ALWAYS something to mine, it's just WHEN ETH goes PoS (who knows when but COULD be 6 months from now) there's gonna be literally 1,000,000 hungry GPUs needing shit to mine, so those with 1070 (and 470/480) are gonna get SLAYED in profitability imo
IF we can GET tho miner cards, well thats to be seen, yes

There is hope tho!  New coins all the time and Nvidia can handle ANY algo like a champ unlike AMD, but to build a farm on that hope of new coins is SCARY to say the least.
Also, 1070 is at the  "end of its price point", it WILL go down soon 30 days even

1080 at 20% more powerful, and only 10-15% more price? seems logical to me! think RESALE as well
1080ti will NOT win in price for performance, but in 2 years it will still be profitable AND still resell well (if you get the good brands/models)
PLUS, ROI extends pretty fast when you have to buy WHOLE NEW RIGS every 5 cards just to keep up with 1080ti buyers :/
DENSITY

only my 2 satoshi's of course  i own 1070's as well

Totally agree, we should wait for new gens GC and dedicated Mining GC...

[Elektrum_Brad]

Did you ever get your farm up and running?  If you're still monitoring this thread, I can help you with some of your power distribution concerns.  We just went through something similar (warehouse space, new service, etc.) with our Test Farm and could give you some advice.

Brad

[dutchlincoln]

I'm starting a farm too in a 1600 sqft warehouse. I'm installing 2x fans roughly 50cm in diameter for exhaust cooling, with the ability to expand to 4 fans. No raised floors because additional exhaust airflow is simpler, faster, cheaper.

For power, the warehouse I rented has 3 phrase 415v 40A wired to 6x 13A 240v wall sockets. The plan is to use the pre-installed circuit to 80% load, and install distribution boards with sockets on them, like these (but larger with more sockets): http://ssses.in/products/atm-db-panels/

This way I can plug the psu directly in standard UK plug PDU, and into the distribution board. Again, simple, fast, cheap. The money saved will be spent on more vega gpus.

40Amps... 

[dhouse]

...a rig of 6 1070's is bringing in 50 dollars a day or so right now... These cards ROI in 75 days right now

what are you mining??? please tell me

[dhouse]

a single 1070 making $8 a day? Ummmm what

[gwestcot]

a single 1070 making $8 a day? Ummmm what

 definitely not anymore...