Bitcoins and Bankers

[X-ray]

Bitcoin and banks serve entriely different functions and ideally can benefit from each others continued existence.

No, bitcoin is trying to provide the functionality which are being offered by banks so far and under some totally different circumstances. In near future you cannot expect these both to exist. More probably, banks may get vanished as bitcoin's concepts are ensuring more power to individual rather than just depending on government or simply banks

That's very unlikely (and still less in the near future)

Banks are required to process fiat payments, and they will exist as long as there is fiat still around. And I'd rather say that it is Bitcoin which is going to vanish sooner. And it may happen not in some abstract "near" future but in the nearest future when Bitcoin gets split into several conflicting and competing chains. Aside from that, Bitcoin simply can't scale up to replace fiat in any meaningful degree, at least, now. Things may change in some distant future but it should first survive the future which I just mentioned (i.e. the coming chain split)

And the technology of bitcoin (blockchain) will be useful for banks to improve their service in the near future. They need to improve, because in 2018 PSD2 will force them to share some of their data with fintech companies. Fintech companies are good in  specialized part of the banking sector (e.g. instant payment, small payments, parking fees, etc.). If PSD2 will come into force, fintech companies can start the development of their systems based on existing financial data and they don't need to gather data thru their app from a limited source.

So..........you could store coins in your Bitcoin wallet, something that can be done at a bank, but that is the same function as a wallet, thus why they are called wallets in Bitcoin, not banks.  A bank provides a secure storage, that is what the online wallet are doing, not Bitcoin.  A personal Bitcoin wallet has to be keep safe by the user.

If you are a bitcoin user then you don't need banks anymore because banks is not that profitable to put our money and it is not safe to put or give trust to them to control our money because unlike in bitcoin that we have the private keys and full control but in bank it is not that same and banks is just giving the half of access and they can freeze your account anytime they want because they have the control on their behalf.

Just realize dude, You will never cashout your bitcoin without use the bank service. Bitcoin still pegged with the banker's service. To make the bitcoin will be available for the real usage. I mean our real life. That's my point.

[matuson]

Bitcoin and banks serve entriely different functions and ideally can benefit from each others continued existence.

No, bitcoin is trying to provide the functionality which are being offered by banks so far and under some totally different circumstances. In near future you cannot expect these both to exist. More probably, banks may get vanished as bitcoin's concepts are ensuring more power to individual rather than just depending on government or simply banks.

What banking functions is Bitcoin trying to accomplish exactly?  Banks, in themselves do no more than store funds, with a possible interest rate, and provide loans.  All other functions that one may be performing at a bank building are actually the function of third party services, like the ACH.  In fact, most of the margin providing the credit lines and loans is backed and processed by the alternate houses since the faster internet speeds and networking protocols.

Now to create a Bank which will give out loans in bitcoins is impossible. What idiot would agree to take out a loan in bitcoins? If the price keeps going up then you will never be able to repay. The Bank will also go bankrupt.

[olubams]

Hello All,

I'm new to crypto but not new to the banking/gov game.

What are you thoughts on the bankers/gov potentially controlling Bitcoin behind the scenes putting on a show oh how they are concerned about it? 

They can print the fiat to buy bitcoins.
Its the electronic money/world currency they are so thirsty for.
The NSA has supposedly a back door to all our devices.

I think if bitcoin is the new banker currency it will explode higher as 7.5 billion people vs 21 million bitcoins means $$$$ to the early holders.
If Bitcoin is the alternative to the bankers/gov then it will explode higher as well due to the high percentage of people who want to be free from them.

Anyone who has attempted to not use the dollar Ghadaffi (gold Dinar) - Saddam (oil for Euros)  have met a swift end. 

Why are they not stopping (possible jail threats) it when they have shown they will go to extreme measures to stop competition.

Either way I see it going higher i'm just trying to get my head around why it has not been stopped. 

Thoughts?

Its good to assume what you have there but the logic behind it is what I am trying to understand because its only the central banks that have the legal backing to print currencies with a lot of regulations and scrutiny on how the amount printed is eventually utilised couple with the adverse economic effect its going to have on the economy when there is excess liquidity in the economy. Aside that, it will mean the government is just trying to make some people rich and these people are random set of people because by buying massive as you alluded means they are pushing the price so high that people they buy from get to be super rich any time soon.

[deisik]

Bitcoin and banks serve entriely different functions and ideally can benefit from each others continued existence.

No, bitcoin is trying to provide the functionality which are being offered by banks so far and under some totally different circumstances. In near future you cannot expect these both to exist. More probably, banks may get vanished as bitcoin's concepts are ensuring more power to individual rather than just depending on government or simply banks.

What banking functions is Bitcoin trying to accomplish exactly?  Banks, in themselves do no more than store funds, with a possible interest rate, and provide loans.  All other functions that one may be performing at a bank building are actually the function of third party services, like the ACH.  In fact, most of the margin providing the credit lines and loans is backed and processed by the alternate houses since the faster internet speeds and networking protocols

You forget to mention one important thing that banks are doing

That is, they are working pretty much like Bitcoin miners, though it is not just about processing payments and confirming transactions. Banks like miners are creating money, the former are creating fiat, while the latter bitcoins. I don't think that this function can be outsourced to some third party services since outsourcing this function would mean essentially transforming such a third party into a fiat bank or Bitcoin miner

[andrei56]

Bankers can not influence the situation with bitcoin. Bankers can take an unlimited amount of Fiat money, but to have access to bitcoin they can't. Besides who wants to borrow in bitcoins if the price can rise to it. Such a loan can result in bankruptcy.

this is really complicated to differentiate between bitcoin and bankers. I think both have a different aspect, bankers are basically involved in the traditional banking and bitcoin is involved with the virtual area, but in the future, bankers also will deal with bitcoin.

Yea, bankers will have to deal with bitcoin in the future but bankers can not change the situation in bitcoins. Bitcoin is anonymous while banks is not, both of them has a different aspect concerning about the volatility in both areas.

Neither bitcoins or banks are anonymous, banks will require lots of information before they even allow you to even open an account, in bitcoin this is not the case but every single transaction is there for everyone to see, in the other hand banks only allow yourself and the authorities to see your transactions.

[GideonGono]

Hello All,

I'm new to crypto but not new to the banking/gov game.

What are you thoughts on the bankers/gov potentially controlling Bitcoin behind the scenes putting on a show oh how they are concerned about it? 

They can print the fiat to buy bitcoins.
Its the electronic money/world currency they are so thirsty for.
The NSA has supposedly a back door to all our devices.

I think if bitcoin is the new banker currency it will explode higher as 7.5 billion people vs 21 million bitcoins means $$$$ to the early holders.
If Bitcoin is the alternative to the bankers/gov then it will explode higher as well due to the high percentage of people who want to be free from them.

Anyone who has attempted to not use the dollar Ghadaffi (gold Dinar) - Saddam (oil for Euros)  have met a swift end. 

Why are they not stopping (possible jail threats) it when they have shown they will go to extreme measures to stop competition.

Either way I see it going higher i'm just trying to get my head around why it has not been stopped. 

Thoughts?

You can't just print fiats if you want to. Printing a lot would really put the entire currency circulating in a particular country into chaos and it is by the law. Those very rich people really doesn't show much enthusiasm regarding Bitcoin since they are very rich they don't really need the help of it to sustain themselves nor have time to get to know with Bitcoin.

But if Bitcoin would grow even more and gain a lot of momentum for them to pick an interest in it then they will think twice and might as well accept it as a payment.

There's nothing much with Bankers really.

[Bamselk]

Bitcoin and banks serve entriely different functions and ideally can benefit from each others continued existence.

No, bitcoin is trying to provide the functionality which are being offered by banks so far and under some totally different circumstances. In near future you cannot expect these both to exist. More probably, banks may get vanished as bitcoin's concepts are ensuring more power to individual rather than just depending on government or simply banks.

What banking functions is Bitcoin trying to accomplish exactly?  Banks, in themselves do no more than store funds, with a possible interest rate, and provide loans.  All other functions that one may be performing at a bank building are actually the function of third party services, like the ACH.  In fact, most of the margin providing the credit lines and loans is backed and processed by the alternate houses since the faster internet speeds and networking protocols

You forget to mention one important thing that banks are doing

That is, they are working pretty much like Bitcoin miners, though it is not just about processing payments and confirming transactions. Banks like miners are creating money, the former are creating fiat, while the latter bitcoins. I don't think that this function can be outsourced to some third party services since outsourcing this function would mean essentially transforming such a third party into a fiat bank or Bitcoin miner

They're not very much like Bitcoin miners, particularly.  Banks just create fiat money, while miners are rewarded with Bitcoin for providing a service to the network.  Banks serve little purpose except for being leeches.

[asriloni]

Bankers can not influence the situation with bitcoin. Bankers can take an unlimited amount of Fiat money, but to have access to bitcoin they can't. Besides who wants to borrow in bitcoins if the price can rise to it. Such a loan can result in bankruptcy.

this is really complicated to differentiate between bitcoin and bankers. I think both have a different aspect, bankers are basically involved in the traditional banking and bitcoin is involved with the virtual area, but in the future, bankers also will deal with bitcoin.

Yea, bankers will have to deal with bitcoin in the future but bankers can not change the situation in bitcoins. Bitcoin is anonymous while banks is not, both of them has a different aspect concerning about the volatility in both areas.

Neither bitcoins or banks are anonymous, banks will require lots of information before they even allow you to even open an account, in bitcoin this is not the case but every single transaction is there for everyone to see, in the other hand banks only allow yourself and the authorities to see your transactions.

But the bitcoin will need the bank to make a gate for the fiat to get into the bitcoin. I think all of the bitcoin users are need bank to do that. The verification of your id to prevent the money laundering and criminalities.
Every bank around the world will do that.

[minizi99]

The banking system has already outlived itself. The time will come and it will collapse. And this is normal development of events. We have already found an alternative that will replace banks. And this alternative is bitcoin

[deisik]

Bitcoin and banks serve entriely different functions and ideally can benefit from each others continued existence.

No, bitcoin is trying to provide the functionality which are being offered by banks so far and under some totally different circumstances. In near future you cannot expect these both to exist. More probably, banks may get vanished as bitcoin's concepts are ensuring more power to individual rather than just depending on government or simply banks.

What banking functions is Bitcoin trying to accomplish exactly?  Banks, in themselves do no more than store funds, with a possible interest rate, and provide loans.  All other functions that one may be performing at a bank building are actually the function of third party services, like the ACH.  In fact, most of the margin providing the credit lines and loans is backed and processed by the alternate houses since the faster internet speeds and networking protocols

You forget to mention one important thing that banks are doing

That is, they are working pretty much like Bitcoin miners, though it is not just about processing payments and confirming transactions. Banks like miners are creating money, the former are creating fiat, while the latter bitcoins. I don't think that this function can be outsourced to some third party services since outsourcing this function would mean essentially transforming such a third party into a fiat bank or Bitcoin miner

They're not very much like Bitcoin miners, particularly.  Banks just create fiat money, while miners are rewarded with Bitcoin for providing a service to the network.  Banks serve little purpose except for being leeches.

This is no more than your massively biased opinion

And there can be other opinions, less biased and more plausible. For example, I don't consider the current generation of miners as something very useful to Bitcoin. To me, they are a lot more nefarious than banks. There are thousands of banks out there, and there is real competition between them unlike Bitcoin mining where we have half a dozen major miners and insanely high fees as well as incredibly long confirmation times as a result of heavy monopolization of this market. Now try to persuade me (or anyone, for that matter) that the service they provide to the network is the best there can be

[ethereumhunter]

Bankers can not influence the situation with bitcoin. Bankers can take an unlimited amount of Fiat money, but to have access to bitcoin they can't. Besides who wants to borrow in bitcoins if the price can rise to it. Such a loan can result in bankruptcy.

this is really complicated to differentiate between bitcoin and bankers. I think both have a different aspect, bankers are basically involved in the traditional banking and bitcoin is involved with the virtual area, but in the future, bankers also will deal with bitcoin.

Yea, bankers will have to deal with bitcoin in the future but bankers can not change the situation in bitcoins. Bitcoin is anonymous while banks is not, both of them has a different aspect concerning about the volatility in both areas.

Neither bitcoins or banks are anonymous, banks will require lots of information before they even allow you to even open an account, in bitcoin this is not the case but every single transaction is there for everyone to see, in the other hand banks only allow yourself and the authorities to see your transactions.

But the bitcoin will need the bank to make a gate for the fiat to get into the bitcoin. I think all of the bitcoin users are need bank to do that. The verification of your id to prevent the money laundering and criminalities.
Every bank around the world will do that.

i don't think that bitcoin need the bank because if there are any bank for bitcoin, then i am sure the bank will need us to fill our personal information and its not the main purpose from bitcoin. i think if the bank can integrate with bitcoin then it maybe would be good to see that when we are trying to exchange from bitcoin into fiat, we don't need to waiting too long and the amount of money can directly receive in our bank account.

[bitbunnny]

Bankers can not influence the situation with bitcoin. Bankers can take an unlimited amount of Fiat money, but to have access to bitcoin they can't. Besides who wants to borrow in bitcoins if the price can rise to it. Such a loan can result in bankruptcy.

this is really complicated to differentiate between bitcoin and bankers. I think both have a different aspect, bankers are basically involved in the traditional banking and bitcoin is involved with the virtual area, but in the future, bankers also will deal with bitcoin.

Yea, bankers will have to deal with bitcoin in the future but bankers can not change the situation in bitcoins. Bitcoin is anonymous while banks is not, both of them has a different aspect concerning about the volatility in both areas.

Neither bitcoins or banks are anonymous, banks will require lots of information before they even allow you to even open an account, in bitcoin this is not the case but every single transaction is there for everyone to see, in the other hand banks only allow yourself and the authorities to see your transactions.

But the bitcoin will need the bank to make a gate for the fiat to get into the bitcoin. I think all of the bitcoin users are need bank to do that. The verification of your id to prevent the money laundering and criminalities.
Every bank around the world will do that.

i don't think that bitcoin need the bank because if there are any bank for bitcoin, then i am sure the bank will need us to fill our personal information and its not the main purpose from bitcoin. i think if the bank can integrate with bitcoin then it maybe would be good to see that when we are trying to exchange from bitcoin into fiat, we don't need to waiting too long and the amount of money can directly receive in our bank account.

Bank is not the only one that asks about personal information. What about exchangers, you have to give your data and still everyone uses them. I think is not the main point of Bitcoin bank like it's not centralization. I think Bitcoin bank could move Bitcoin related services to another level without bad influence on Bitcoin.

[merchantofzeny]

Hopefully not. Also wouldn't printing more money to buy bitcoins is counterproductive? The more money you print the lower each note's value is. Anyone remember Zimbabwe's 1,000,000,000 note? Now they're just using dollar because all the money they printed is useless that people just use them to light up stuff.

[deisik]

Hopefully not. Also wouldn't printing more money to buy bitcoins is counterproductive? The more money you print the lower each note's value is. Anyone remember Zimbabwe's 1,000,000,000 note? Now they're just using dollar because all the money they printed is useless that people just use them to light up stuff.

This is not set in stone

After the 2007-2008 subprime mortgage crisis the Fed had been running three rounds of what has become known as "quantitative easing". Basically, they just printed dollars in insane amounts (Helicopter Ben and his airplane money), but this didn't boost the inflation rates in the US. How come? Because all this newly printed money didn't enter the real sector and went directly to financial markets inflating stock indices and whatnot. So if government decides to buy up bitcoins, it is only the price of bitcoins which will rise. They will find the way how to prevent the dollars paid for the bitcoins to enter real world and inflate prices

[raven7886]

Bank is not the only one that asks about personal information. What about exchangers, you have to give your data and still everyone uses them. I think is not the main point of Bitcoin bank like it's not centralization. I think Bitcoin bank could move Bitcoin related services to another level without bad influence on Bitcoin.

I do not find any necessity of having bitcoin bank as we are already dealing with bitcoin comfortably just with wallets hence there will be no need of having any centralized authority for our bitcoin related stuff.

If you will be needing some bank for the purpose of buying and selling bitcoins, that does not mean you are in need of bitcoin bank. Bitcoin bank must be completely different like it will be in forcing us back to go from decentralisation into centralization.

[Eternu]

I think that in near future, banks will understand how much potential bitcoin have, if they did not already. So after than it will not take long time when banks will start dealing with bitcoin directly. Electronic currency is future, there are so many advantage than with fiat. But as banks always do, they will deal with everything their own way and for their gain only.

[SinLinJim]

I think that in near future, banks will understand how much potential bitcoin have, if they did not already. So after than it will not take long time when banks will start dealing with bitcoin directly. Electronic currency is future, there are so many advantage than with fiat. But as banks always do, they will deal with everything their own way and for their gain only.

Despite a lot of talk about the fact that Bitcoin destroy the banking system, And yet I'm sure that Bitcoin and banks will cooperate well and the reality of the financial system will only become stronger thanks to such cooperation.

[Sled]

I think that in near future, banks will understand how much potential bitcoin have, if they did not already. So after than it will not take long time when banks will start dealing with bitcoin directly. Electronic currency is future, there are so many advantage than with fiat. But as banks always do, they will deal with everything their own way and for their gain only.

Despite a lot of talk about the fact that Bitcoin destroy the banking system, And yet I'm sure that Bitcoin and banks will cooperate well and the reality of the financial system will only become stronger thanks to such cooperation.

If the banks will not have any idea to stop bitcoin from conquering people then bankers will just cooperate with bitcoin and it will just do the same thing like other people which is adopt bitcoin as a currency and enable people to deposit money in their banks with bitcoin and that is the scenario that i see in the future because bitcoin is unstoppable and it is like, you will adopt it or you will adopt it kind of option .

[Sadlife]

Bitcoin will not be controlled or get hack by the Government or NSA  they would need a huge amount of hash power to do that to be able to change bitcoin's algorithm to do that they would had to conduct a 51% network attack. Bitcoin has already destroyed the banking system many people has started to get interested cause of it's decentralized monetary system that is free from oppression, exploitation and tyranny. The bitcoin price price will soar up even more as many institutional investors are getting involve in it and soon the government's monetary system might need to change their rules or else get destroyed by bitcoin.

[bitart]

I think that in near future, banks will understand how much potential bitcoin have, if they did not already. So after than it will not take long time when banks will start dealing with bitcoin directly. Electronic currency is future, there are so many advantage than with fiat. But as banks always do, they will deal with everything their own way and for their gain only.

Despite a lot of talk about the fact that Bitcoin destroy the banking system, And yet I'm sure that Bitcoin and banks will cooperate well and the reality of the financial system will only become stronger thanks to such cooperation.

If the banks will not have any idea to stop bitcoin from conquering people then bankers will just cooperate with bitcoin and it will just do the same thing like other people which is adopt bitcoin as a currency and enable people to deposit money in their banks with bitcoin and that is the scenario that i see in the future because bitcoin is unstoppable and it is like, you will adopt it or you will adopt it kind of option .

Banks are interested in bitcoin. But banks need to be careful, because the basics of the banking system is the trust, banks have. People trust the banks, this is why they put their money into bank accounts and they belive that banks can pay their money back if they need it to spend. So banks need to preserve the gained trust, because without trust the can just finish their business.
And in connection with bictoin, as long as in the Average Joe's mind bitcoin means the currency of the maffia and the terrorists (remember WannaCry?), banks just can't fully adopt bitcoin, because of the negative effect on their trust. It's a long way still...