Open AI Gambling Bot/Discussion

[michkima]

So Recently Elon Musk announced the Open AI as we know, If you don't know about "Open AI" just google it, It is basically a bot which learns from visual input and becomes a master at doing whatever it is trained on(Given enought time), It can master any Atari game and can even predict stock prices by given it the proper data, so i was wondering what if somebody trains it on Poker or Dice game? It will be the perfect player, far better than the human and could probably make websites go bankrupt, as there is no defeating to an AI. From what i am seeing the future will be AI's Playing against each other. The person who will have a better AI player will win the most bets, Let me know what do you think about it.


Also If anybody in their spare time can train it on Poker or a simple Head Tail game, Do share your results it will be interesting to see.

It seems you are still a newbie at gambling to even think like this. Gambling can never be learned by an AI, even if it does it cannot counteract the effects of randomness. Can an AI predict the future? If it can then it would win the dice games. If there was a fixed strategy in gambling, then there would have been super rich people from just gambling and all the casinos will go down.

I disagree with that. Indeed gambling is a random event, for example dice is random if it is truly dice. The problem is a computer can never ever pick a random number. It doesn't have that ability since it has no consciousness. So what it does is "simulate randomness." It uses plenty of variables and with the slightest amount of change the outcomes would be so different from one another.

That said, if this Open AI would learn how the computer generates random numbers, then it can predict the outcomes of the game.

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[moooonu]

That AI bot will work someday but it's not the time. Bot will only work when it see any pattern and in probably there is no pattern even once in 1m rolls can come in first 10k. So it can win upto a point but can't win always.

[lite]

I think ai can be trained to play only skill based games, would be interesting to see how they play against us(humans)and against other ai. in luck games, it's ai vs true randomness, who do you think will win?

[michkima]

I think ai can be trained to play only skill based games, would be interesting to see how they play against us(humans)and against other ai. in luck games, it's ai vs true randomness, who do you think will win?

The AI will beat anyone on any game if it is that smart. Remember that the chess computer back when computers are still in its infancy defeated a lot of chess masters. Likely the bot will be able to beat humans in poker. Also remember, the computer can make a damn good poker face. Then it can also read our facial reactions even on poker face.

[Thekool1s]

So Recently Elon Musk announced the Open AI as we know, If you don't know about "Open AI" just google it, It is basically a bot which learns from visual input and becomes a master at doing whatever it is trained on(Given enought time), It can master any Atari game and can even predict stock prices by given it the proper data, so i was wondering what if somebody trains it on Poker or Dice game? It will be the perfect player, far better than the human and could probably make websites go bankrupt, as there is no defeating to an AI. From what i am seeing the future will be AI's Playing against each other. The person who will have a better AI player will win the most bets, Let me know what do you think about it.


Also If anybody in their spare time can train it on Poker or a simple Head Tail game, Do share your results it will be interesting to see.

It seems you are still a newbie at gambling to even think like this. Gambling can never be learned by an AI, even if it does it cannot counteract the effects of randomness. Can an AI predict the future? If it can then it would win the dice games. If there was a fixed strategy in gambling, then there would have been super rich people from just gambling and all the casinos will go down.

I disagree with that. Indeed gambling is a random event, for example dice is random if it is truly dice. The problem is a computer can never ever pick a random number. It doesn't have that ability since it has no consciousness. So what it does is "simulate randomness." It uses plenty of variables and with the slightest amount of change the outcomes would be so different from one another.

That said, if this Open AI would learn how the computer generates random numbers, then it can predict the outcomes of the game.

Exactly! Thank you for sharing this, This is what i was trying to explain earlier, The Computer randomness is "Fake" it isn't true randomness, which can be exploited by a well trained AI.

I think ai can be trained to play only skill based games, would be interesting to see how they play against us(humans)and against other ai. in luck games, it's ai vs true randomness, who do you think will win?

The AI will beat anyone on any game if it is that smart. Remember that the chess computer back when computers are still in its infancy defeated a lot of chess masters. Likely the bot will be able to beat humans in poker. Also remember, the computer can make a damn good poker face. Then it can also read our facial reactions even on poker face.

Along with being well trained at poker, imagine being well trained on facial expression too, That would be the dream Bot for sure!


As for many people, You have missed out my update! Quoting it again here!

Update: Well its about time, Saw this page being advertised on Facebook, These people are funding people to code the Best AI for poker. They have already given out a 3d printer to one of the winners. Well the things are about to get interesting. Future of gambling is in AI's hand. Would love to hear Your thoughts on this.

Facebook Page Link: https://www.facebook.com/AIGamingCom/
website link: http://beta.aigaming.com

[lite]

Just read this article.
https://www.wired.com/2017/01/mystery-ai-just-crushed-best-human-players-poker/

There's already ai bot that can beat anyone in poker!

[Thekool1s]

Just read this article.
https://www.wired.com/2017/01/mystery-ai-just-crushed-best-human-players-poker/

There's already ai bot that can beat anyone in poker!

Thank you for sharing this, didn't know about this article, it is an interesting read and the results are amazing! 1.7 million dollars in winning that's huge, plus the way AI reacted to their moves was totally impressive! The future of gambling is now in ai's hands for sure! Don't know about how casinos will react to this, i think they may just ban the AI players which i think will be a loss for technology but if they don't, we will lose another beautiful game.

[michkima]

So Recently Elon Musk announced the Open AI as we know, If you don't know about "Open AI" just google it, It is basically a bot which learns from visual input and becomes a master at doing whatever it is trained on(Given enought time), It can master any Atari game and can even predict stock prices by given it the proper data, so i was wondering what if somebody trains it on Poker or Dice game? It will be the perfect player, far better than the human and could probably make websites go bankrupt, as there is no defeating to an AI. From what i am seeing the future will be AI's Playing against each other. The person who will have a better AI player will win the most bets, Let me know what do you think about it.


Also If anybody in their spare time can train it on Poker or a simple Head Tail game, Do share your results it will be interesting to see.

It seems you are still a newbie at gambling to even think like this. Gambling can never be learned by an AI, even if it does it cannot counteract the effects of randomness. Can an AI predict the future? If it can then it would win the dice games. If there was a fixed strategy in gambling, then there would have been super rich people from just gambling and all the casinos will go down.

I disagree with that. Indeed gambling is a random event, for example dice is random if it is truly dice. The problem is a computer can never ever pick a random number. It doesn't have that ability since it has no consciousness. So what it does is "simulate randomness." It uses plenty of variables and with the slightest amount of change the outcomes would be so different from one another.

That said, if this Open AI would learn how the computer generates random numbers, then it can predict the outcomes of the game.

Exactly! Thank you for sharing this, This is what i was trying to explain earlier, The Computer randomness is "Fake" it isn't true randomness, which can be exploited by a well trained AI.

I think ai can be trained to play only skill based games, would be interesting to see how they play against us(humans)and against other ai. in luck games, it's ai vs true randomness, who do you think will win?

The AI will beat anyone on any game if it is that smart. Remember that the chess computer back when computers are still in its infancy defeated a lot of chess masters. Likely the bot will be able to beat humans in poker. Also remember, the computer can make a damn good poker face. Then it can also read our facial reactions even on poker face.

Along with being well trained at poker, imagine being well trained on facial expression too, That would be the dream Bot for sure!


As for many people, You have missed out my update! Quoting it again here!

Update: Well its about time, Saw this page being advertised on Facebook, These people are funding people to code the Best AI for poker. They have already given out a 3d printer to one of the winners. Well the things are about to get interesting. Future of gambling is in AI's hand. Would love to hear Your thoughts on this.

Facebook Page Link: https://www.facebook.com/AIGamingCom/
website link: http://beta.aigaming.com

I think even half of the people that gambles, tried gambling, or think about gambling know that the randomness of the rolls in online gambling are all "not really random." Like what I said, I it is just simulated random since computers can't really think let alone think of a random number.

About your update, I think it would happen. I think AIs will rule the world and the movies "The Matrix", "The Terminator" and "iRobot" will come true. Just a matter of time. So getting news about a gambling robot, is nothing surprising. And to be honest, there are already poker bots out there. Have you played an offline poker game on your phone? Don't thus games have AIs already? They might be stupid poker players right now, but wait a few years.

[shintosai]

Just read this article.
https://www.wired.com/2017/01/mystery-ai-just-crushed-best-human-players-poker/

There's already ai bot that can beat anyone in poker!

Thank you for sharing this, didn't know about this article, it is an interesting read and the results are amazing! 1.7 million dollars in winning that's huge, plus the way AI reacted to their moves was totally impressive! The future of gambling is now in ai's hands for sure! Don't know about how casinos will react to this, i think they may just ban the AI players which i think will be a loss for technology but if they don't, we will lose another beautiful game.

very impressive and i dont have any idea that this really exist thinking that those are just fake one who just wanted to attract investors
but with this article it shows that ai is for real and how the house will change pace about this, will see how they will handle ai bot.

[naidray]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time.

But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

[Thekool1s]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time. But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

Well i have to agree we have created these AI bots, but we don't have the amount of computing power at our hand every single second as compared to a pc. Yes there won't be fun anymore, but a bot making millions for me sounds more fun than me playing and losing my bankroll.

[hatshepsut93]

If you take some simple game like Dice, there' very little attack surface, even for AI. But there's one common thing for any online gambling site - random number generator. Successful attack on casino's random number generator can allow attacker to get edge for his bets, or even predict outcomes with 100% certainty if RNG got completely broken. It's possible to do it even now, but maybe new AI methods can do it even more efficiently, so casino operators should be cautious of this threat.

[el kaka22]

Talking about dice or other games, no any skill or strategy will work so I don't think using AI for this will make any difference. On the other hand yes card games like poker requires some skill and strategy but majority of time luck plays an important role, so even if AI will play poker or other card games than impact might be way lower than what we might speculate.

There is nothing like magic in this world. everything depends upon how far we can observe predict and analyze. In dice or other such games, its not like that the players play around without giving a thought.

Before making even little decisions like , people think whether they realize it or not. Our brain keeps on thinking and making decisions without us realizing most of them. Nothing is purely luck based. May be I am wrong but I believe AI in this field will also get the winner's tag.

[Oilacris]

Talking about dice or other games, no any skill or strategy will work so I don't think using AI for this will make any difference. On the other hand yes card games like poker requires some skill and strategy but majority of time luck plays an important role, so even if AI will play poker or other card games than impact might be way lower than what we might speculate.

There is nothing like magic in this world. everything depends upon how far we can observe predict and analyze. In dice or other such games, its not like that the players play around without giving a thought.

Before making even little decisions like , people think whether they realize it or not. Our brain keeps on thinking and making decisions without us realizing most of them. Nothing is purely luck based. May be I am wrong but I believe AI in this field will also get the winner's tag.

Well its your own point of view and theres nothing wrong with that we cant be sure if AI would really have the chance on making patters on completely random games like dice.I cant think of that you can possible outmatch the house even that open ai gambling bot because hashes are random computing would really be somehow senseless.

[lite]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time. But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

Well i have to agree we have created these AI bots, but we don't have the amount of computing power at our hand every single second as compared to a pc. Yes there won't be fun anymore, but a bot making millions for me sounds more fun than me playing and losing my bankroll.

Yeah! who wouldn't want a bot that makes millions, i would love to have one too lol. but what would happen if ai bot competes with another ai bot(both well/equally trained)? who'll win? winning eventually will come down to luck, right?

[mrcash02]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time. But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

Well i have to agree we have created these AI bots, but we don't have the amount of computing power at our hand every single second as compared to a pc. Yes there won't be fun anymore, but a bot making millions for me sounds more fun than me playing and losing my bankroll.

Yeah! who wouldn't want a bot that makes millions, i would love to have one too lol. but what would happen if ai bot competes with another ai bot(both well/equally trained)? who'll win? winning eventually will come down to luck, right?

Yes, if the two bots playing have the same skills and AI only luck can decide the game result.
They don't have emotions, so none of them will become nervous during the game, what could affect the result.

[Thekool1s]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time. But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

Well i have to agree we have created these AI bots, but we don't have the amount of computing power at our hand every single second as compared to a pc. Yes there won't be fun anymore, but a bot making millions for me sounds more fun than me playing and losing my bankroll.

Yeah! who wouldn't want a bot that makes millions, i would love to have one too lol. but what would happen if ai bot competes with another ai bot(both well/equally trained)? who'll win? winning eventually will come down to luck, right?

Yes, if the two bots playing have the same skills and AI only luck can decide the game result.
They don't have emotions, so none of them will become nervous during the game, what could affect the result.

Wrong, There is no luck with AI, it comes down to how well the AI is trained, AI takes different paths and learns the most effective paths, So when 2 AI will battle off each other, It will come down to which AI has been trained more, Which has more experience, Which has been in more different situations, To simple user it may sound like luck, but it isn't, its machine learning, The Machine which will take the best path for each turn and will win in the end.

[Thekool1s]

Another big news coming in from the dota 2 internationals, OpenAi has officially beaten the top players in the world, in 1v1 matches, it has beaten sumail many other dota 2 players.

The Ai bot was given zero input from the team, it learned from playing against another copy of itself and currently only works in 1v1, you can read more details about it
here:   https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/11/16137388/dota-2-dendi-open-ai-elon-musk

The next big thing is here! AI is the future period!

[mrcash02]

Look at google go ai, there are millions upon millions of moves, the portability of each move is very low and yet it has managed to beat the best of us. I don't think we need a quantum leap for just poker and stock predictions. There are bots which are already predicting the stock prices.

Checkers/chess/go programs brute force calculate every possible move. A question can be raised whether that represents true artificial intelligence. A go program calculates every move then uses an algorithm to estimate which move is the best, not unlike a coin sorter which evaluates each coin size to sort pennies from nickels and dimes.

Over the past 50 years, there hasn't been much evolution in terms of artificial intelligence software. All gains have come from hardware advancing via moore's law to a point where programs can calculate every possible move in checkers/chess/go within a reasonably short time.

There's no doubt computer programs (which probably shouldn't be called artificial intelligence) are very good at evaluating massive numbers of against some preset criteria. It shouldn't be confused with true artificial intelligence though.

We, human have created computers and as far as artificial intelligence bots being used to play games are concerned, there is no doubt that they can calculate all possible moves and select the best option in very short time. But I believe in the strength of human brains which is center of genuine intelligence and where is the fun if bots will be used to play for us ?

Well i have to agree we have created these AI bots, but we don't have the amount of computing power at our hand every single second as compared to a pc. Yes there won't be fun anymore, but a bot making millions for me sounds more fun than me playing and losing my bankroll.

Yeah! who wouldn't want a bot that makes millions, i would love to have one too lol. but what would happen if ai bot competes with another ai bot(both well/equally trained)? who'll win? winning eventually will come down to luck, right?

Yes, if the two bots playing have the same skills and AI only luck can decide the game result.
They don't have emotions, so none of them will become nervous during the game, what could affect the result.

Wrong, There is no luck with AI, it comes down to how well the AI is trained, AI takes different paths and learns the most effective paths, So when 2 AI will battle off each other, It will come down to which AI has been trained more, Which has more experience, Which has been in more different situations, To simple user it may sound like luck, but it isn't, its machine learning, The Machine which will take the best path for each turn and will win in the end.

Didn't you understand the example says about two AIs with the same lvl? It's not a real situation, it's a supposition. Two identical robots playing one against other. Only luck can decide it, depending the sequence of movements each one will make in game.

[Thekool1s]

Didn't you understand the example says about two AIs with the same lvl? It's not a real situation, it's a supposition. Two identical robots playing one against other. Only luck can decide it, depending the sequence of movements each one will make in game.

well its a hypothetical scenario which is unlikely to happen, but i agree if the same AI bot battles off its counterpart, The Luck factor will come in but as i said that is extremely unlikely to happen, You won't be renting your AI bot to your Opponent would you? Even the companies who will sell these bots in the future, will train them differently and then the rest will be on the owner, how he gambles with it and so on.