Bitcoin Forum
March 28, 2024, 08:13:38 PM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 26.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4]  All
  Print  
Author Topic: My Visit To Butterfly Labs Today!  (Read 7928 times)
LostDutchman (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 476
Merit: 250



View Profile WWW
May 10, 2013, 12:33:26 AM
 #61

Disclaimer: I am not a BFL customer, and I too have seen the office in person. It's exactly like the op described.

But I'm not as pessimistic as he is... I think they'll be shipping once they figure out how to tool their assembly line properly.

...
They've got to the point where they have managed to acquire a few cast-off experimental chips and a PCB which works for a while before flaming out.  And possibly some mock software which makes things look like they are working.
Wow, this is a pretty pessimistic view. Do you just have no idea whatsoever about how printing circuitboards works?

Several different press outlets have not only got their hands on these things, and gotten bitcoins in their accounts from using them... But they actually have torn them down to see what makes them tick... The unanimous consensus is that they are indeed mining as advertised. This cannot really be argued anymore.

Think of it this way... This is a Jalapeno's motherboard:



We know this is legit because multiple bloggers who existed long before BFL own these now, tore them apart, and even tell us what the different chips on the board do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciwfCqP8AiU

See how the little embedded wires line up on the nanometer scale to get electricity around the silicon pathways in a useful manner? That can only be done by PRINTING... You don't just make a few shotty boards at a time like this, it is way too cost prohibitive.

When you make the printer to make these boards and the ASIC chips themselves, you are spending tons of money, likely millions of dollars, to make a printer that can spit out millions of units.

So since they exist at all, THERE WILL BE more. You can write this fact down, it's a basic law of economics. Even if they refused to make any more, they'd be forced to sell this expensive monster (likely through court-ordered bankruptcy) to some other company that would use it!

The only question now is how competent BFL staff are at running the printing press faster... So far they haven't done a good job, but sooner or later they have got to get their crap together if they want to still own that printing press.

But they ain't shipping product!

It will soon be ONE YEAR since the first orders!

Tell you anything?

"Press outlets".

Yeah, right!

Corporations For Crypto
Protect Your Assets and Reduce Your Tax Liability With A Kansas Corporation!
We Demand Justice From BFL
Transactions must be included in a block to be properly completed. When you send a transaction, it is broadcast to miners. Miners can then optionally include it in their next blocks. Miners will be more inclined to include your transaction if it has a higher transaction fee.
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
1711656818
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1711656818

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1711656818
Reply with quote  #2

1711656818
Report to moderator
🏰 TradeFortress 🏰
Bitcoin Veteran
VIP
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1302
Merit: 1042

👻


View Profile
May 10, 2013, 12:35:41 AM
 #62

Good thing BFL won't be advertising on the forums this week since I'm outbidding them.
BTCLuke
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 526
Merit: 508


My other Avatar is also Scrooge McDuck


View Profile
May 10, 2013, 12:35:54 AM
 #63

But they ain't shipping product!
Technically we know they've shipped a half dozen or so to press outlets.

Using Occam's Razor, the best explanation for their lack of customer shipping to date is simply incompetence.

Incompetence =/= scam.

Luke Parker
Bank Abolitionist
LostDutchman (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 476
Merit: 250



View Profile WWW
May 10, 2013, 12:39:39 AM
 #64

But they ain't shipping product!
Technically we know they've shipped a half dozen or so to press outlets.

Using Occam's Razor, the best explanation for their lack of customer shipping to date is simply incompetence.

Incompetence =/= scam.

I really don't think they started out that way but now as they are up to their collective asses in alligators you may well be correct!

Wink


Corporations For Crypto
Protect Your Assets and Reduce Your Tax Liability With A Kansas Corporation!
We Demand Justice From BFL
tvbcof
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 4564
Merit: 1276


View Profile
May 10, 2013, 01:09:56 AM
 #65


Basically you've been trolled, but...

Disclaimer: I am not a BFL customer, and I too have seen the office in person. It's exactly like the op described.

But I'm not as pessimistic as he is... I think they'll be shipping once they figure out how to tool their assembly line properly.

...
They've got to the point where they have managed to acquire a few cast-off experimental chips and a PCB which works for a while before flaming out.  And possibly some mock software which makes things look like they are working.
Wow, this is a pretty pessimistic view. Do you just have no idea whatsoever about how printing circuitboards works?

I'm not very knowledgeable about many of the aspect to be fair, but...


Several different press outlets have not only got their hands on these things, and gotten bitcoins in their accounts from using them... But they actually have torn them down to see what makes them tick... The unanimous consensus is that they are indeed mining as advertised. This cannot really be argued anymore.

Think of it this way... This is a Jalapeno's motherboard:

  <image snipped for brevity>

We know this is legit because multiple bloggers who existed long before BFL own these now, tore them apart, and even tell us what the different chips on the board do:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciwfCqP8AiU

...little or nothing I saw in that vid had much value. Couple of guys scratching their heads.  One knew how to use a screwdriver.  Yawn.  None of the other analysis I've seen is much more rewarding.

I'll be interested when if finally comes out who did the ASIC fab and what logic technology was employed.

It also would not hurt to have a report from someone who actually hooked up to a pool and got paid out.  I've not heard any such reports, but I barely pay attention.


See how the little embedded wires line up on the nanometer scale to get electricity around the silicon pathways in a useful manner? That can only be done by PRINTING... You don't just make a few shotty boards at a time like this, it is way too cost prohibitive.

When you make the printer to make these boards and the ASIC chips themselves, you are spending tons of money, likely millions of dollars, to make a printer that can spit out millions of units.

So since they exist at all, THERE WILL BE more. You can write this fact down, it's a basic law of economics. Even if they refused to make any more, they'd be forced to sell this expensive monster (likely through court-ordered bankruptcy) to some other company that would use it!

The only question now is how competent BFL staff are at running the printing press faster... So far they haven't done a good job, but sooner or later they have got to get their crap together if they want to still own that printing press.

The board actually seems like a conglomeration of earlier work.  Maybe that is why it sucks more than my workstation's mainboard when it sits at idle?  Frankly it's simply not that impressive of a feat, and if BFL paid millions of dollars for it, I think they got scammed.

One thing that hit me right away when I saw the pic was how the 2 pads with contain (purported) ASIC chips are different in size from the 6 which (it is speculated) would contain more such chips if they were not such hot (in the thermal sense) little bastards?

Seems like a dozen-ish of the 130nm ASICMINER chips like the one I just bought for a tiny USB device achieve about the same perf.  The simplest explanation for BFL taking so long and making so many errors in the year it's taken them to get this far is that they simply have not tried very hard.  They are way way out in front on taking people's money though.  It's all about priorities I guess.


sig spam anywhere and self-moderated threads on the pol&soc board are for losers.
LostDutchman (OP)
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 476
Merit: 250



View Profile WWW
May 10, 2013, 06:04:58 AM
 #66

Someone please tell BCTLuke that it is "shoddy", not "shotty"....that one drives me crazy!

Thanks for looking!

Corporations For Crypto
Protect Your Assets and Reduce Your Tax Liability With A Kansas Corporation!
We Demand Justice From BFL
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4]  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!