Anyone else think "long term" hodlers are idiots?

[NEYolks]

Depends really. I've done quite well out of holding. I do think about cashing out but probably not for a while yet and I buy stuff with bitcoin occasionally. I have things like capitol gains to consider too, if the price doesn't crash disastrously and I cash out slowly over the next few years. That seems like the best option to me and that's if bitcoin doesn't keep growing, and it might.

[imapessimist]

I think you need to sell some of your Bitcoin if the price goes up substantially.  Because if you wait long enough you take the chance it might crash.   No point in hoarding Bitcoin if you're sitting on a profit.  Keep some and sell some.  And if the price goes down then buy back at a lower price. 

[Carlsen]

I think long term holders (like me), are necessary.
The coins they buy are not circulating anymore, and that increases the price of the rest of the coins.
Without long term holders I do not think we would see the price we have today.
I suppose the average long term holder does not own many coins, but there are a lot of hodlers out there. Together they cover many coins.
So their role is very important.

[sjefdeklerk]

I do think they are idiots. BTC failed as a payment system, LN is a joke, it's highly unlikely BTC will survive, that's why SMART people like Warren Buffet say they'd buy 5 year put options on BTC because it's highly unlikely BTC will survive 5 year.

Some say "yeah but it functions as storage for value, just like gold", that's also just a dumb argument, once people will admit BTC failed as payment system they'll start fleeing out of it as well. I just don't see ANY logical case to make for BTC. So yeah, I think they're idiots.

[henriquelb]

It is ironic since this thread has been created when bitcoin was less than $2000 if i am not wrong.. and now it is more than x6 times of what it was before. So if you were holding that, you could easily made a x6 of that.. What a dumbass.

[Denker]

I do think they are idiots. BTC failed as a payment system, LN is a joke, it's highly unlikely BTC will survive, that's why SMART people like Warren Buffet say they'd buy 5 year put options on BTC because it's highly unlikely BTC will survive 5 year.

Some say "yeah but it functions as storage for value, just like gold", that's also just a dumb argument, once people will admit BTC failed as payment system they'll start fleeing out of it as well. I just don't see ANY logical case to make for BTC. So yeah, I think they're idiots.

Not sure if you're serious or not.
BTC is far away from being a failed experiment. And LN will prove you soooo wrong!  
Furthermore BTC already exists since 9 years and gets attacked on a daily basis what makes it more and more resilient on a daily basis. The next 5 years will be a no brainer.

And hodlers believe in Bitcoin because they did as much research as possible and are convinced of its' potential and therefore decided it's worth a long term investment.Nothing wrong about that.
Guys who bought the top in 2013 are still smiling.

[sjefdeklerk]

BTC is far away from being a failed experiment.

Even the "North American Bitcoin Conference" in Miami didn't accept bitcoin anymore because of the high cost! How's that not a failed experiment ? Among top 500 online retailers BTC acceptance went down from 5 in 2016 to 3 in 2017. A huge experiment in the city of Arnhem in the Netherlands, where over 100 retailers accepted BTC, was stopped because bitcoin payments were too expensive and nodoby cared for it anyway and there are tons of more examples. It's scaling down big time because it has failed. It's too expensive and too slow.

And LN will prove you soooo wrong!  

How so ? It's a horrible system for reasons I've laid out several time here on this forum, like: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2768140.msg28291679#msg28291679 . It's a joke.

And hodlers believe in Bitcoin because they did as much research as possible

Most hodlers know pretty much 0 about LN or how it works. All they know is 'instant payment' and 'very low fees'. They don't know about the horrible details.

[wxxyrqa]

I do think they are idiots. BTC failed as a payment system, LN is a joke, it's highly unlikely BTC will survive, that's why SMART people like Warren Buffet say they'd buy 5 year put options on BTC because it's highly unlikely BTC will survive 5 year.

Some say "yeah but it functions as storage for value, just like gold", that's also just a dumb argument, once people will admit BTC failed as payment system they'll start fleeing out of it as well. I just don't see ANY logical case to make for BTC. So yeah, I think they're idiots.

Judging by the above, the next five years should not be expected from Bitcoin great prospects? Is it realistic? If you pay attention to many of the hears that experts said, then Bitcoin already in this he must fly to the skies.

[ohlawdy]

Lots of arrogance in your post , long term hodlers of bitcoin or pretty much every top 10 altcoin made big gains without doing anything .
To dumb to daytrade is also a assumption , some people have a life outside of crypto and can't afford to spend all their time looking at charts and ta's or don't want to because it is boring af.
But good luck with your trading bro , if you are as good as you think try trading stocks you will see how good you are.

[kriptotr]

Lots of arrogance in your post , long term hodlers of bitcoin or pretty much every top 10 altcoin made big gains without doing anything .
To dumb to daytrade is also a assumption , some people have a life outside of crypto and can't afford to spend all their time looking at charts and ta's or don't want to because it is boring af.
But good luck with your trading bro , if you are as good as you think try trading stocks you will see how good you are.

Long term people made crazy money last year. We can't say long term holding is representing stupidity. This is how one person can be a smart guy actually. It's a good thing to adopt a project, token or coin.

[YinShuiSiYuan]

People who invested a few years ago earned a lot of money. Holding for a long term gives you big profits. And for how long someone invests depends on the investment strategy.

[Fedor07]

No I'm not , i really think that those who do that are smart becouse if you hold youre Bitcoin for 2 months maybe after that time Bitcoin could rice up a lot and you can make a really nice profit, don't you think ? You just stay at home and watch tv , or maybe do something else , but after three months you will make a few thousand $ or 1 thousand, but its still ok . There are some people who are holding for a few years , well I also think that they are making some nice profit . So no  , I don't think that those who are holding for long term are idiots .

[vanish9]

Including myself, of course.. I am not looking to sell, in fact, everytime that i cashout my monthly wage, i am investing aproximately 30% of that in Bitcoin and in order altcoins. I really believe on it.

People who invested a few years ago earned a lot of money. Holding for a long term gives you big profits. And for how long someone invests depends on the investment strategy.

[cryptocrusher]

I do think they are idiots. BTC failed as a payment system, LN is a joke, it's highly unlikely BTC will survive, that's why SMART people like Warren Buffet say they'd buy 5 year put options on BTC because it's highly unlikely BTC will survive 5 year.

Some say "yeah but it functions as storage for value, just like gold", that's also just a dumb argument, once people will admit BTC failed as payment system they'll start fleeing out of it as well. I just don't see ANY logical case to make for BTC. So yeah, I think they're idiots.

Smart person who is completely anti cryptocurrencies would be a better description. If bitcoin fails as a payment system then you're right in that it will not survive but what is there to suggest that LN is a joke and won't turn bitcoin back in to a viable option? It's also all well and good people like Warren Buffet can say whatever they like, I very much doubt he has any put options.

[sjefdeklerk]

but what is there to suggest that LN is a joke and won't turn bitcoin back in to a viable option?

For example:

* The maximum amount you can pay in a certain route is determined by the guy with the LEAST amount of money in his channel
* Users can defraud each other in a channel, so they have to continually check if somebody is defrauding them.
* Unless you have a direct channel to your target, there is NO guarantee AT ALL that you can pay the person you want to pay.
* Users need to be online 24/7 if they want to be part of a payment route. If a user is offline, this particular route is not possible which of course has huge impact on the possible routes.
* Insane amounts of data are being sent because the network needs to be aware of EVERYBODY's payment channel's state (otherwise it can't discover a route)
* You still have huge fees if you want to wire money into/outside the channel.
* It's not feasible at all for bigger payments. Let's say you have to pay $1500 rent/month, are you going to open a payment channel and deposit 3 years rent in it ? Most people have difficulties enough coughing up the next month. But if you have to wire every payment into the channel, then you could just as well pay on-chain because you're paying that exact same on-chain fee.
* It's also not feasible for very small payments/channels. If you open a $30 channel with your coffeeshop to buy a few cups of coffee per week, then the price of your coffee doubles because of the huge fees to open/close the channel.

[elloco4ever]

People who invested a few years ago earned a lot of money. Holding for a long term gives you big profits. And for how long someone invests depends on the investment strategy.

It definitely depends on the investment strategy as we have different needs and plan so I find it better to invest during the dump and also cash out 50 % of funds when the value is at the peak but if we canNot control our emotions during price dump and then end up panic selling then we are losers.

[littlebill16]

For maximum profits it's clear long term holding isn't best, and indefinite holding will leave you with zero. But holding is a strategy that works for many as you have to remember people have different commitments and goals in crypto.

[matteo96]

this thread from june is very funny to read now

i am still x50 up just holding btc , yeah what an idiot ahabahahahahaha

[Sevvero]

this thread from june is very funny to read now

i am still x50 up just holding btc , yeah what an idiot ahabahahahahaha

This is such an insanely stupid argument. You have still lost ton of profit on paper by "le hodling xD" and not selling it earlier. If you keep hodling through a bear market you are just a delusional person.

[reda]

It good ideas. So hold the bitcoin long time. It any time to increase price. So most of the people hold the coin and wait for the price increase. Bitcoin future digital currency. So it any Time to reach the high values. That the reason people hold the bitcoin. So coming future it help to growth. Most of the country people connect with bitcoin. So people share the information of bitcoin future.