Who else is sick of these BTM fees.

[CHRISBIN702]

$2,800 for a $2,550 Bitcoin??? $3,100 for a $ 2,800 Bitcoin???

Come on now. This is getting out of control. On top of that, we ( the customer of the machine) are the ones paying outrageous mining fees.

I'm in Las Vegas, Nevada. I do know that the machine prices are set by the owner of the machine. It's basically a giant hardwallet. I don't know what it's like anywhere else in the world regarding these machines and the fees set by the owners of them. But I do know that here in Las Vegas, it's a slap in the face.

 I'm not Just talking about buying Bitcoin either. It's the same for selling. $220 seems to be the average markup/markdown on 1 BTC.

I have been building a small network of buyers and sellers. But sometimes I find myself needing to sell some BTC for Cash and can't wait around for a buyer. So I'm forced to use these machines. Reluctantly every time.
 
Let me know what you think about this issue and let me know if it's the same around the world.

It's so bad that my wife and I have been gathering funds and partners to start our own BTM service so we can charge half price or less to force these thieves out of town or to lower their own fees. We've done the math. The profit will be there even with a $50 dollar markup on every coin.

Anyways. I'm all ears.

[monsanto]

Interesting. How does something like localbitcoins in your area stack up to the BTM experience? I haven't used localbitcoins (or a BTM) but I guess I was under the mistaken impression localbitcoins was a smooth enough experience that people wouldn't be willing to pay that kind of premium for a BTM.

Also, what kind of identification/KYC/AML are people using, if any? I remember reading about BTMs using palm print readers.

[ranreichman]

Those are very high fees. In Israel it's about 5%. Of course much less when people pass it in cash in person but that's a whole other issue.

[Kakmakr]

You will get companies who will exploit their customers, if they have a monopoly in a certain area. What type of machine is this and have you contacted any other machine manufacturers and suppliers to find out if they can offer some competition in your area? Satoshi wanted Bitcoin to be a Peer2Peer cash alternative payment option, not a platform for companies to exploit people, like the banks are doing all these years. ^sad^ 

[CHRISBIN702]

Interesting. How does something like localbitcoins in your area stack up to the BTM experience? I haven't used localbitcoins (or a BTM) but I guess I was under the mistaken impression localbitcoins was a smooth enough experience that people wouldn't be willing to pay that kind of premium for a BTM.

Also, what kind of identification/KYC/AML are people using, if any? I remember reading about BTMs using palm print readers.

The localBitcoin in my area is pretty weak actually. I have met a few people through LocalBitcoin that are usually willing to trade but they are rarely ready at the same time as me. I find that when it comes to buying or selling, Market value deals are beginning to feel like a profit relative to the only other options.

[BitcoinSupremo]

In Europe we use mainly Bitstamp and Kraken. Although the fees are high I feel very confident and secure when buying from bitstamp , in fact is my favorite website where to buy bitcoins. They piss you off in the beginning with their extended verification procedure but once you pass that it is great for buying bitcoin. Fees of course are cheaper than the machines in L.V .

[CHRISBIN702]

You will get companies who will exploit their customers, if they have a monopoly in a certain area. What type of machine is this and have you contacted any other machine manufacturers and suppliers to find out if they can offer some competition in your area? Satoshi wanted Bitcoin to be a Peer2Peer cash alternative payment option, not a platform for companies to exploit people, like the banks are doing all these years. ^sad^ 

The types of machines I've used that are nearest to me are a few Coinsource machines which I have mixed feeling about. I can't decide if I hate them or absolutely despise them.
And the one I find myself using most often is a BitPay machine. I actually know the owner of this one. He seems like a good guy. takes care of his business and will answer any calls on his personal cell regarding his machine. Still, way too pricey. Definitely exploiting the lack of machines here.

[freedomno1]

I guess if you know the owner and have a large enough amount of money to transact you could ask them to trade it to you at a lower rate than the machines similar to local Bitcoins at a lower rate. Otherwise your pretty much stuck between waiting for it to process via exchanges, loading up a card like Xapo to debit your BTC balance or using the machine for quick conversion.

[pinkflower]

I have no experience in using a BTM but does it require KYC/AML to use them? If no, then thats the price you pay for your anonymity. If I was a criminal trying to cash out thousands worth in BTC from a BTM with no KYC/AML docs needed then I wouldnt mind paying for the premium.

[mk4]

At first I was also excited when BTM's started showing up. But I just realized immediately that they provide the same price increases (200-250 USD). The sad part is they claim that they have "2% cuts". But they din't indicate the enormous addition in their prices.

Like, I don't blame them that much, since if you look at their point of view, it is a business, and they put up BTM's not really for easier access to bitcoins but they put them up for them to profit. I'm actually fine with that if the increase was just like $50 or something close to that. They're just taking advantage because there are only few accessible BTM's in most places.

They simply need more competition boys and girls.

[Dudeperfect]

We must understand the fact that bitcoin is still in the early phase and we are yet a developing technology. There will be speculators who will try to earn profits from this phase and I see the same thing here. However, in the future we will have more players in the market and the competition will reduce the fees and cost so I am not too much worried about it.

[talkbitcoin]

that is the cost of using an ATM to access to your funds and change it from money to bitcoin or vice versa. although the fees you say sound pretty high. i believe in Switzerland there are kiosks like where you buy train tickets from, which also sell bitcoin at cheap fees.

[xFiber]

I also haven't used a BTM in my country yet but if those fees are the same here I doubt I would use it either. Maybe you should test out localbitcoins.com. Since you reside in the United States there should be a lot of sellers in your area. Or try purse.io, you basically buy stuff on Amazon for others and get paid in bitcoin. The rates aren't near market rate but better than those from the BTM.

[CHRISBIN702]

At first I was also excited when BTM's started showing up. But I just realized immediately that they provide the same price increases (200-250 USD). The sad part is they claim that they have "2% cuts". But they din't indicate the enormous addition in their prices.

Like, I don't blame them that much, since if you look at their point of view, it is a business, and they put up BTM's not really for easier access to bitcoins but they put them up for them to profit. I'm actually fine with that if the increase was just like $50 or something close to that. They're just taking advantage because there are only few accessible BTM's in most places.

They simply need more competition boys and girls.

Agreed. I will be giving them competition as soon as I am financially available to. I can't wait to be the one that brings fairness back to BTC buying/selling in Vegas.

[Gaaara]

At first I was also excited when BTM's started showing up. But I just realized immediately that they provide the same price increases (200-250 USD). The sad part is they claim that they have "2% cuts". But they din't indicate the enormous addition in their prices.

Like, I don't blame them that much, since if you look at their point of view, it is a business, and they put up BTM's not really for easier access to bitcoins but they put them up for them to profit. I'm actually fine with that if the increase was just like $50 or something close to that. They're just taking advantage because there are only few accessible BTM's in most places.

They simply need more competition boys and girls.

Agreed. I will be giving them competition as soon as I am financially available to. I can't wait to be the one that brings fairness back to BTC buying/selling in Vegas.

That was a good idea, to have them a competition to equalize the system that they control themselves. Good luck for your plan I hope for your success.

By the way I just wanna share, in our country we don't have any BTM's but instead we can withdraw our money from ATM's you can pay the total of the money you want to withdraw using bitcoin and guess what it doesn't have any fee its completely free. Its a online wallet and exchange site as well but only features btc, you might wanna take this idea because as I can see they were so successful right now and have so many parters with large companies.

[Gotottack]

Then why not just buy from localbitcoins? That's always an option better than BTM. For sure there are far better rates there than that machine. They charge that much since they have to pay for the machine's cost and the cost of maintaining it, which is no laughing matter as they don't really profit that much since bitcoins are still a niche and the number of users is not that significant to share the burden of running the machines.

[CHRISBIN702]

At first I was also excited when BTM's started showing up. But I just realized immediately that they provide the same price increases (200-250 USD). The sad part is they claim that they have "2% cuts". But they din't indicate the enormous addition in their prices.

Like, I don't blame them that much, since if you look at their point of view, it is a business, and they put up BTM's not really for easier access to bitcoins but they put them up for them to profit. I'm actually fine with that if the increase was just like $50 or something close to that. They're just taking advantage because there are only few accessible BTM's in most places.

They simply need more competition boys and girls.

Agreed. I will be giving them competition as soon as I am financially available to. I can't wait to be the one that brings fairness back to BTC buying/selling in Vegas.

That was a good idea, to have them a competition to equalize the system that they control themselves. Good luck for your plan I hope for your success.

By the way I just wanna share, in our country we don't have any BTM's but instead we can withdraw our money from ATM's you can pay the total of the money you want to withdraw using bitcoin and guess what it doesn't have any fee its completely free. Its a online wallet and exchange site as well but only features btc, you might wanna take this idea because as I can see they were so successful right now and have so many parters with large companies.

Yes this is a great idea. I am actually waiting for my Bitpay card to arrive in the mail. I'm so excited about it. To be able to go to an ATM and Withdraw cash from my BTC balance is the ideal situation. Still, there are many people new to Bitcoin that are turned away by these excessive BTM fees. The Bitcoin economy takes some getting used to and I think these things are hurting it's growth by giving newbies a rude introduction.

Thank you all for your advice.Half of my income is paid in Bitcoin. I've been making Bitcoin transactions for a while now and I am aware of every way under the sun to carry them out. This topic is about the BTM fees and how outrageous they are.

[aTriz]

$2,800 for a $2,550 Bitcoin??? $3,100 for a $ 2,800 Bitcoin???

Come on now. This is getting out of control. On top of that, we ( the customer of the machine) are the ones paying outrageous mining fees.

I'm in Las Vegas, Nevada. I do know that the machine prices are set by the owner of the machine. It's basically a giant hardwallet. I don't know what it's like anywhere else in the world regarding these machines and the fees set by the owners of them. But I do know that here in Las Vegas, it's a slap in the face.

 I'm not Just talking about buying Bitcoin either. It's the same for selling. $220 seems to be the average markup/markdown on 1 BTC.

I have been building a small network of buyers and sellers. But sometimes I find myself needing to sell some BTC for Cash and can't wait around for a buyer. So I'm forced to use these machines. Reluctantly every time.
 
Let me know what you think about this issue and let me know if it's the same around the world.

It's so bad that my wife and I have been gathering funds and partners to start our own BTM service so we can charge half price or less to force these thieves out of town or to lower their own fees. We've done the math. The profit will be there even with a $50 dollar markup on every coin.

Anyways. I'm all ears.

Usually, bitcoin spreads can range anywhere between 0.1% on an exchange such as BTC-e, or 10% on localbitcoins depending on your payment method.

Unfortunately, this is an issue that everyone has when using bitcoin atms worldwide, not just in your specific country/city. And I guess that the owners have to make money too, though the high spreads definitely discourgae any regular buying/selling activities.

The fact that you're trying to offer a cheaper service is great - i commend you.

At first I was also excited when BTM's started showing up. But I just realized immediately that they provide the same price increases (200-250 USD). The sad part is they claim that they have "2% cuts". But they din't indicate the enormous addition in their prices.

Like, I don't blame them that much, since if you look at their point of view, it is a business, and they put up BTM's not really for easier access to bitcoins but they put them up for them to profit. I'm actually fine with that if the increase was just like $50 or something close to that. They're just taking advantage because there are only few accessible BTM's in most places.

They simply need more competition boys and girls.

Agreed. I will be giving them competition as soon as I am financially available to. I can't wait to be the one that brings fairness back to BTC buying/selling in Vegas.

That was a good idea, to have them a competition to equalize the system that they control themselves. Good luck for your plan I hope for your success.

By the way I just wanna share, in our country we don't have any BTM's but instead we can withdraw our money from ATM's you can pay the total of the money you want to withdraw using bitcoin and guess what it doesn't have any fee its completely free. Its a online wallet and exchange site as well but only features btc, you might wanna take this idea because as I can see they were so successful right now and have so many parters with large companies.

Yes this is a great idea. I am actually waiting for my Bitpay card to arrive in the mail. I'm so excited about it. To be able to go to an ATM and Withdraw cash from my BTC balance is the ideal situation. Still, there are many people new to Bitcoin that are turned away by these excessive BTM fees. The Bitcoin economy takes some getting used to and I think these things are hurting it's growth by giving newbies a rude introduction.

Thank you all for your advice.Half of my income is paid in Bitcoin. I've been making Bitcoin transactions for a while now and I am aware of every way under the sun to carry them out. This topic is about the BTM fees and how outrageous they are.

Yeah. If you order a bitcoin debit card, the spreads are much lower. Better yet, if you can accept bank wire, then the spreads are even lower if you are willing to verify your id, though you'd be looking at some wait time.

[hisuka2987]

Honestly, If you aren't using a very bad exchange then the usual fees are small and less than 0.3% in all the exchanges I ever used, Some exchanges are harder or more costly to fund (Bitstamp and BTC-E) and there is a difference in price but merely because of the difficulty or ease of depositing funds, otherwise people would flock to that exchange with the higher price till the price is the same.

[amacl1n]

ATM's are usually following the price of a bitcoinaverage.com like system, where all the exchanges and their prices are listed, correct?

I know they charge an awful %5 or even more fee which is excessive and being overpriced does not help at all.. ATM's are more relaxing to use than peer 2 peer deals but not worth $100's per exchange.