[?] Lealana: Isolated incident of coin duplicates

[JUPITYR]

I hate to jump into this but miffman's comments are essentially that the same hologram with identical public and private keys were created twice...right?  

I read that as he simply made an error when printing and printed it twice.  Not realizing it they were placed on two sets of coins.

That is VERY different than keeping private keys.  Can someone help me connect the dots to why there is discussion of him keeping private keys?

The coins were produced several months apart.  So if it was a double-printing error, then that means the private keys were printed and sitting around for several months before being assigned to another coin.  I think most here feel that private keys are produced as needed and not created, printed and stored for months on end.

At the end of the day, I just want to hear a reasonable and satisfactory answer to how this happened.  Holders of funds in Lealana coins coins deserve a better answer than the one that was provided so far by Smoothie.  Simply saying that it was a mistake and that he didn't want this error to be made public leads to more question and uncertainty. 

[1714858960]

1714858960

[1714858960]

1714858960

[1714858960]

1714858960

[dumbchump]

I hate to jump into this but miffman's comments are essentially that the same hologram with identical public and private keys were created twice...right?  

I read that as he simply made an error when printing and printed it twice.  Not realizing it they were placed on two sets of coins.

That is VERY different than keeping private keys.  Can someone help me connect the dots to why there is discussion of him keeping private keys?

The coins were produced several months apart.  So if it was a double-printing error, then that means the private keys were printed and sitting around for several months before being assigned to another coin.  I think most here feel that private keys are produced as needed and not created, printed and stored for months on end.

At the end of the day, I just want to hear a reasonable and satisfactory answer to how this happened.  Holders of funds in Lealana coins coins deserve a better answer than the one that was provided so far by Smoothie.  Simply saying that it was a mistake and that he didn't want this error to be made public leads to more question and uncertainty. 

I thought the public and private keys are created at the same time....like when I create a paper wallet...maybe I don't understand the process.  I too would appreciate a clearer response as I have quite a few Lealana coins.

[Quickseller]

The coins were produced several months apart. 

Sold, not produced.

[krogothmanhattan]

((((I thought the public and private keys are created at the same time....like when I create a paper wallet...maybe I don't understand the process.  I too would appreciate a clearer response as I have quite a few Lealana coins.))))

    When you create a paper wallet the Public and Private keys are  created at the same time. No reason why this process with coins would be any different.

[JUPITYR]

The coins were produced several months apart. 

Sold, not produced.

And you know that for a fact? 

[Quickseller]

The coins were produced several months apart. 

Sold, not produced.

And you know that for a fact? 

I know they were sold months apart, yes, as per what was said in the OP (some of the coins were funded months ago). I have not seen anything that indicates the coins were produced months apart.

[JUPITYR]

I think it is important at this juncture to make a very clear distinction about the key issue of this thread.  

Many of you have weighed in either vouching for Smoothie or giving him a vote of confidence/benefit of the doubt based upon your personal experiences with him over the years.   All of that is great and well founded.  For what it's worth, I don't think anyone weighing in here asking for a better answer from Smoothie is implying that he is a bad guy or having done anything underhanded.  They just want a more clear and reasonable answer as to how 2 of his coins, sold several months apart, would ever contain the same private key, because there is a tremendous amount of money at stake in the answer.

From his own comments, Smoothie said that he didn't want this issue to come to light.  I don't think he did himself any favors in stating that, but I think he was just concerned that this issue would create a level of uncertainty about the integrity of the private keys and funds loaded to his coins.  So fine, but the cat is now out of the bag and the issue is before us.  So it needs to be answered.

The longer this goes on without a clear explanation from Smoothie, the more doubt and uncertainty will creep in.  He owes it to everyone who has bought, or holds one of his coins to provide a satisfactory answer, and fast.

[hybridsole]

It seems the main sticking point is why the coins were funded several months apart.  I recall having a discussion with smoothie where he indicated that, unlike many coin makers, he doesn't distribute his coins in any particular sequence.  The serial #'s are sold more or less at random (other than for special auction sales of specific serial #'s).

If smoothie had accidentally made duplicate coins, the randomness of choosing coins can explain why several months may pass between him selling (and funding at the point of sale) one coin and another coin with a sequential serial #.   Obviously this is not a definitive answer, and it would be preferable to get the explanation from the man himself. But having dealt with Lealana multiple times, there's nothing about this particular incident that causes me to think it's anything more than a minor production error.  If smoothie does not want to reveal the details of his production process for security and/or privacy reasons, I can understand that.

However, as collectors we should also never put too many eggs in one basket.  No matter how much faith or trust you have in a particular manufacturer of coins, you should never store a disproportionate amount of coins on any private keys you did not generate yourself, just as you shouldn't store a significant amount on an exchange or web wallet where you do not own the private keys. 

[krogothmanhattan]

Jupityr and Hybridsole...Very well said. Both have excellent points. We should hear from Smoothie to say the least. And you are right, not to place all coins in one basket. The safest place would be your own paper wallet in a safe 

[FFrankie]

Guess the community doesn't care about this

[wheelz1200]

Guess the community doesn't care about this

I do still waiting.  Explanation would be nice with the amount of exposure in btc/LTC/xmr on the lealanas

[FFrankie]

Guess the community doesn't care about this

I do still waiting.  Explanation would be nice with the amount of exposure in btc/LTC/xmr on the lealanas

Why does the explanation matter? He won't admit to keeping private keys even if he did and I doubt he would be able to prove any other explanation he says

[owlcatz]

Guess the community doesn't care about this

I do still waiting.  Explanation would be nice with the amount of exposure in btc/LTC/xmr on the lealanas

Why does the explanation matter? He won't admit to keeping private keys even if he did and I doubt he would be able to prove any other explanation he says

I think we are all beating a dead horse here. Smoothie is not a criminal, he's a downright honest human - Yes, maybe he made a mistake or two handling hundreds if not thousands of complicated orders.

Personally, I don't care about this. There has never been ANY reason whatsoever to think he is keeping private keys. I truly believe this was a one-off mistake - maybe he had replaced his printer and had to re-use his old one, who the f knows. I personally don't care, I know his name and address in real life, so ...  not going to lose any sleep over it. I mean, sure, I would like to hear an explanation as well, but again, I think we should just move on and chalk it up to "Smoothie made 1 "known" mistake over 4 years coin making/creating.

I'm going to remove this from my watchlist as well, it's a waste of time. Either he doesnt' feel any need to reply for whatever reason, but I'm 100% sure he's not keeping private keys. He's got plenty of money, he doesn't need to steal from the very people here who helped make him a lot of money.

/over and out here

[wheelz1200]

Guess the community doesn't care about this

I do still waiting.  Explanation would be nice with the amount of exposure in btc/LTC/xmr on the lealanas

Why does the explanation matter? He won't admit to keeping private keys even if he did and I doubt he would be able to prove any other explanation he says

Are you arguing with yourself now

What exactly are you looking for.  Smoothie to say something or not?  And dont take this as implying, i am just wondering what happened.

[JUPITYR]

Given that Smoothie has elected to remain silent on this very important topic for many weeks now, I believe he has no intention of posting any responses in the future.

What that says for his ability to conduct business on this board in the future.....hard to say.  Perhaps he will become the Keyser Soze of the physical crypto world and simply disappear.  We can only hope that the duplicated coin/private key was truly an isolated incident and that he has no other access to any of the private keys he has produced.  Unfortunately I have a feeling that is not the case.  He of course is free to prove otherwise.

[Hhampuz]

I am baffled at the respons from valued members of this community in this thread.

I won't take sides and I won't point fingers but the silence from smoothie is worrying. Not for the fact that he'd run away with money, but for the piece of mind for his customers.

Why some of you think all of this is fine and you don't care considering smoothie is an honest and hard working guy that'd never be able to do something bad, I don't know why you think that matters.

Anyone can be nice just up until they are no longer nice. Anyone can be honest just up until they are no longer honest. 


I won't make a comment on whether I think smoothie is storing private keys or if smoothie might pull an exit scam as I honestly have no clue or no personal connection on the matter. What I can and will say though is that some of you should not be so eager to defend someone as you might be liable and held accountable under unforeseen circumstances.

And smoothie, You should make an official statement. Keeping this buried raises questions, valid ones at that, on how you operate. I think that the steps minerjones is taking to start a ledger with all public keys from coin manufacturers is a step in the right direction but more needs to be done from the coinmakers themselves. For too long have we all been kept in the dark with a few exceptions.

[FFrankie]

I am baffled at the respons from valued members of this community in this thread.

I won't take sides and I won't point fingers but the silence from smoothie is worrying. Not for the fact that he'd run away with money, but for the piece of mind for his customers.

Why some of you think all of this is fine and you don't care considering smoothie is an honest and hard working guy that'd never be able to do something bad, I don't know why you think that matters.

Anyone can be nice just up until they are no longer nice. Anyone can be honest just up until they are no longer honest. 


I won't make a comment on whether I think smoothie is storing private keys or if smoothie might pull an exit scam as I honestly have no clue or no personal connection on the matter. What I can and will say though is that some of you should not be so eager to defend someone as you might be liable and held accountable under unforeseen circumstances.

And smoothie, You should make an official statement. Keeping this buried raises questions, valid ones at that, on how you operate. I think that the steps minerjones is taking to start a ledger with all public keys from coin manufacturers is a step in the right direction but more needs to be done from the coinmakers themselves. For too long have we all been kept in the dark with a few exceptions.

What ever happened with this?

[owlcatz]

What ever happened with this?

What you are reading, I hope?

[FFrankie]

What ever happened with this?

What you are reading, I hope?

Maybe there was another thread, but I cannot believe the community just let this go away without an official statement

[owlcatz]

Maybe there was another thread, but I cannot believe the community just let this go away without an official statement

no you just missed it I guess?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2011139.msg20061663#msg20061663