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Author Topic: Roger Ver holds around 300k bitcoins worth $750 Million and wants the fork  (Read 6721 times)
TaunSew
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July 16, 2017, 10:45:39 AM
 #21

Roger Ver at some point will probably be arrested and thrown into prison for tax evasion.  If it is true he has 300,000 Bitcoins then he's on the hook for some $120+ million in back taxes to the IRS and penalties / interest from when he left USA in 2014.  I'm not sure about the IRS penalties but they could very well seize everything he owns due to the obvious massive conspiracy to commit tax fraud.  The token amount he gave them years ago was nowhere close to his owed amount.

Actually this is also the guy who is also a convicted terrorist too, for mailing explosives in the mail.  So it's practically a step backwards to commit something petty (by comparison to terrorism) like tax fraud.
 

Surprised Japan let him in and the various agencies aren't bothering him yet.   I guess Roger Ver avoiding drugs has kept him out of the spotlight or maybe he's giving people envelopes full of cash?

But arguably Roger Ver's rambling and trying to assert an authority image has hurt Bitcoin more than help it (especially the white legal side.  The criminal black side probably loves Roger Ver's libertarian rambles).

There ain't no Revolution like a NEMolution.  The only solution is Bitcoin's dissolution! NEM!
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July 16, 2017, 11:32:58 AM
 #22

If I own a large number of Bitcoins, and Bitcoin.com,  that means I'm financially motivated to do everything I can to improve the value of those assets.
This is unlike Adam Back, the CEO of Blockstream, who by his own admission, and despite having known about Bitcoin for about 5 years due to being contacted by Satoshi himself in 2008, he didn't own a single Bitcoin himself in April of 2013.  I doubt he has many bitcoins now either.

all this talk and drama aside, to be honest sometimes you two camps seem more like two kids pulling at a doll that each wants to play with alone.
the fear is that you are going to tear this doll apart in the end and each go play with some new dolls.

you can see the "tear" starting already...














 

 

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July 16, 2017, 11:39:37 AM
 #23

It is funny that I see this about Roger Ver. I looked him up a few times when I first saw his name. He is called Bitcoin Jesus,,, or maybe he calls himself this. And now he is against Bitcoin. What does this say? He "invested" into Bitcoin, and now he has a lot of money he wants to kill it?

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July 16, 2017, 11:57:35 AM
 #24

Yes everyone (ish) has greedy desires but there is no guarantee for this Roger Ver bloke that he will actually benefit after any fork takes place and yes it makes him a whale if he has 300k bitcoin but here is the thing, even if he wants change there is no guarantee he will benefit from it
agreed he can benefit after the hardfork if the price increases alot not only him it will also benifit us who use bitcoin and those who hold bitcoins and those people who want higher price of bitcoin , 300k btc is huge i wonder if he would sell it at once

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July 16, 2017, 12:10:08 PM
 #25

Such a large Bitocin Whale inevitably is going to look after his own interests. Most Whales and Elites always take advantage in a crisis. If Bitcoin forkes and all the little fish run amok and panic, what will the big whales do? Scoop up all the cheap coins and won;t even say thank you very much. They will all grow an even larger bag of Bitcoin.

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July 16, 2017, 12:15:52 PM
 #26

How can you be sure he has that much? I think he's heavily invested in altcoins, and probably lowered a lot his position in Bitcoin, otherwise he would not be bringing so much risk to his own investment.
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July 16, 2017, 12:58:47 PM
 #27

Stop and think for a moment.
If I own a large number of Bitcoins, and Bitcoin.com,  that means I'm financially motivated to do everything I can to improve the value of those assets.
This is unlike Adam Back, the CEO of Blockstream, who by his own admission, and despite having known about Bitcoin for about 5 years due to being contacted by Satoshi himself in 2008, he didn't own a single Bitcoin himself in April of 2013.  I doubt he has many bitcoins now either.

Compare that with someone like myself who spent nearly every penny I had buying Bitcoin as soon as I learned about them in 2011.
Adam Back can run circles around me when it comes to the underlying mathematics of Bitcoin,  but he has demonstrated by his own actions that he has absolutely no clue why Bitcoin came to be used as money, and to this day he still doesn't understand why Bitcoin is money. Sadly, his firm has done an incredible amount of harm to Bitcoin's adoption rate and has caused Bitcoin's market share to plummet from around 90% to less than 50% today.

Bitcoin is the only coin in the world to ever have had full blocks.
If we want to experiment with the effects of full blocks on a system,  it is incredibly reckless to do it on Bitcoin, yet that is exactly what Adam and his ilk have done.  If we want to experiment with full blocks, do it on an alt coin!

Very interesting comments from you. Thanks for the input.

So you said you spent every penny you had buying up bitcoin in 2011. They might be around 333 bitcoin per $100 back then (give or take a few), so how many do you still hold and how many was the maximum you held before you (or if you) sold them?

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July 16, 2017, 01:42:45 PM
 #28

Compare that with someone like myself who spent nearly every penny I had buying Bitcoin as soon as I learned about them in 2011.
Adam Back can run circles around me when it comes to the underlying mathematics of Bitcoin,  but he has demonstrated by his own actions that he has absolutely no clue why Bitcoin came to be used as money, and to this day he still doesn't understand why Bitcoin is money. Sadly, his firm has done an incredible amount of harm to Bitcoin's adoption rate and has caused Bitcoin's market share to plummet from around 90% to less than 50% today.

Bitcoin is the only coin in the world to ever have had full blocks.
If we want to experiment with the effects of full blocks on a system,  it is incredibly reckless to do it on Bitcoin, yet that is exactly what Adam and his ilk have done.  If we want to experiment with full blocks, do it on an alt coin!

But, why are you want to forking the bitcoin? and make another clone of bitcoin will be appearing such as BTU.

All of the altcoin already had the full blocks. I think that ripple can be considered as the fastest altcoin right now, even NEM too.

The problem of bitcoin just related to the actual use.  Huh Huh Huh

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shams
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July 16, 2017, 01:49:37 PM
 #29

If hard fork will happen bitcoin price will be down short term and when it get stable than new investment will start coming back to the crypto world and people will again do trading as normal and than bitcoin price will grow normally and I am sure in long run bitcoin is very strong.

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July 16, 2017, 04:08:03 PM
 #30

How can you be sure he has that much? I think he's heavily invested in altcoins, and probably lowered a lot his position in Bitcoin, otherwise he would not be bringing so much risk to his own investment.

I am not sure about how much he own but at the time of article being released it mentioned he has 300k bitcoins

As highlighted by other posts here, there is a possibility that his stake has been reduced after he has invested in various other alcoin projects but that amount of 300k was in the original article:
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/06/16/bitcoin-imminent-fork-aftermaths/

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July 16, 2017, 04:17:50 PM
 #31

"Bitcoin Unlimited is supported by Roger Ver, a bitcoin entrepreneur that is claimed to own around 300,000 bitcoins, bitcoin.com and a large number of influential bitcoin domains. Ver can influence the popularity of BTU, via using bitcoin.com as a marketing tool, because, to the public, bitcoin.com might seem like an official bitcoin portal." (source: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/06/16/bitcoin-imminent-fork-aftermaths/)

So it seems this Roger Ver bloke wants the fork. He is on his way to having a $billion in bitcoin soon yet it has been said he wants the fork and it is said he is using the websites that people thing are official to push his views. (source: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/06/16/bitcoin-imminent-fork-aftermaths/)

Do you want the fork? Will it be better to stay single track or basically split the coins AND there is also a possibility of another split (source: https://www.deepdotweb.com/2017/06/16/bitcoin-imminent-fork-aftermaths/)

What will happen to bitcoin if the fork goes ahead? How will we benefit or lose out both short term and long term?



I hope the fork happens with time reach.There may  have 2 kinds of bitcoins, one belongs to core, the other one belongs to community.

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July 16, 2017, 05:08:19 PM
 #32

all this talk and drama aside, to be honest sometimes you two camps seem more like two kids pulling at a doll that each wants to play with alone.
the fear is that you are going to tear this doll apart in the end and each go play with some new dolls.

you can see the "tear" starting already...

Aug 1st will be an interesting date in the history of bitcoin. All this is avoidable but at the same time there is a case to make for both camps

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July 16, 2017, 05:19:35 PM
 #33

Lots of alts have had full blocks. ETH was stuffed with ICO mania for days. Roger is wrong and he's paying for it with the rest of us

Forgive my petulance and oft-times, I fear, ill-founded criticisms, and forgive me that I have, by this time, made your eyes and head ache with my long letter. But I cannot forgo hastily the pleasure and pride of thus conversing with you.
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July 16, 2017, 06:19:34 PM
 #34

If he owns 300k bitcoins then that makes him a bitcoin whale however, his push towards the fork means he wants something to change.

Possibly and that something might not be more money. It might be that he wants BTC to remain ideologically aligned to its foundational principles. Personally it has been my observation that there's individuals that are attempting to hijack Bitcoin. This is a +$50billion industry and the new greedy whales are who we need to be wary off not people who were there from the beginning.



I wonder how many people here have read Satoshi's white paper? I suggest go read it and come back and tell me which part of the white paper does Roger disagree with? Can we debate that instead of reading a few tweets from certain individuals and basing your position on that?

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July 16, 2017, 07:41:02 PM
 #35

Lots of alts have had full blocks. ETH was stuffed with ICO mania for days. Roger is wrong and he's paying for it with the rest of us

His name is attached to those that are trying to change the face of bitcoin but exactly what is he (or others wanting the fork) guaranteed of gaining from it? There are no guarantees except uncertainty...

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July 16, 2017, 07:50:50 PM
 #36

he's invested in so much shit over the years he won't have anywhere near that many coins any more.

i really don't understand what he's trying to achieve but it's time he went off to play with his dash. he has nothing to offer.

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July 16, 2017, 08:02:32 PM
 #37

Lots of alts have had full blocks. ETH was stuffed with ICO mania for days. Roger is wrong and he's paying for it with the rest of us

His name is attached to those that are trying to change the face of bitcoin but exactly what is he (or others wanting the fork) guaranteed of gaining from it? There are no guarantees except uncertainty...

He's a salesman. He'll sell firecrackers to the highest bidder. I don't think he cares who loses fingers. Because principles

Forgive my petulance and oft-times, I fear, ill-founded criticisms, and forgive me that I have, by this time, made your eyes and head ache with my long letter. But I cannot forgo hastily the pleasure and pride of thus conversing with you.
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July 16, 2017, 08:35:48 PM
 #38

Well this is going all over the place in a hurry.
I agree when he said he has a motivation to make what he has valuable.
That makes perfect sense.

I also am curious about the tax evasion comments.
I am not an expert on Taxes or worse American Tax laws.
But from what i have gathered so far is both CAN/USA have guidelines saying you must declare trading profits.
So if he bought his BTC long ago and simply held them how does he owe taxes on it ?
I think they call it capital gains.
If you send BTC to Poloniex then trade all year long and end up with 100k profit then yeah you would have to pay tax on that.
But f you simply bought or mined BTC etc long ago and never did anything with them how is it you owe ?
Is that because he let the country and doing so creates a tax penalty of sorts or what ?

I am not for or against anyone.
I also am not for or against a fork on BTC.
All i know is it needs to be fixed.. it's gotten pretty bad and damn near unusable as a currency.
and THAT is what i stand up to defend here all the time.

I have $100 in BTC and i don't care about profits.
I just want to see it succeed.

And you all keep saying what if he dumped later.. what like he wouldn't have when it hit 3k each ?

@Mr Ver.
What do you think of Craig Wright and his "I'm Satoshi" drama that pops up occasionally ?
He seems to have Vlad2Vlad convinced i think.. you know Vlad.. Mr IXC  Cheesy

FUD first & ask questions later™
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July 16, 2017, 08:37:52 PM
 #39

He's a salesman. He'll sell firecrackers to the highest bidder. I don't think he cares who loses fingers. Because principles

Sounds like a bloke who would put personal gain beyond anything else.

So I take it a given that anything he does or instigates with regards to a fork is based purely on what he thinks will be best for him in the short or long run rather than him thinking what is best for the bitcoin community and the evolution of bitcoin.

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July 17, 2017, 05:48:34 AM
 #40

So much FUD in one post!
Roger Ver at some point will probably be arrested and thrown into prison for tax evasion.  If it is true he has 300,000 Bitcoins then he's on the hook for some $120+ million in back taxes to the IRS and penalties / interest from when he left USA in 2014.  I'm not sure about the IRS penalties but they could very well seize everything he owns due to the obvious massive conspiracy to commit tax fraud.  The token amount he gave them years ago was nowhere close to his owed amount.
Have you seen my tax returns? I spent close to $1M USD just on lawyers and tax accountants alone to help me file everything exactly perfectly.
I've paid the IRS millions upon millions of dollars and I've never had a "tax problem" with the IRS ever, despite having been audited numerous times.

Actually this is also the guy who is also a convicted terrorist too, for mailing explosives in the mail.  So it's practically a step backwards to commit something petty (by comparison to terrorism) like tax fraud.
My crime was "Dealing in Explosives WITHOUT A LICENSE".  I sold store bought fire crackers on ebay,  and my crime was doing it without the right government paperwork.  It was a politically motivated prosecution. Even while I was in prison,  the company I bought the fireworks from, and the manufacturer  were still selling them without a license.  Details here.
 

Surprised Japan let him in and the various agencies aren't bothering him yet.   I guess Roger Ver avoiding drugs has kept him out of the spotlight or maybe he's giving people envelopes full of cash?
Maybe it is because Japan is a freer country than the USA,  and every convenience store in the country sells fireworks in the summer time.  Try finding that in the land of the free.

But arguably Roger Ver's rambling and trying to assert an authority image has hurt Bitcoin more than help it (especially the white legal side.  The criminal black side probably loves Roger Ver's libertarian rambles).
I've arguably done more to help the legal side of Bitcoin adoption than anyone else in the world.  Go and read this book for the details. Calling my thoughts "libertarian rambles" doesn't make them any less true.  Taxation is theft.  The draft is kidnapping and slavery.  War is mass murder funded by theft.  I refuse to condone any of those things.

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