[ANN] Elacoin | Released | Fair Elastic Scrypt Mining | No Premine

[Quartx]

Thanks for the announcement. This should be interesting, I've been waiting for a coin that has a block reward based on difficulty. Hope the launch goes smoothly, it seems with the new coins, the launches are getting worse and worse, we could really use a smooth one

As I understand, the reward is proportional to the hash power? Or is it proportional to the current difficulty?

The difficulty is linearly proportional to the network hashpower, as well as luck / variance, so should be the same?

If difficultly is linearly proportional to network hash power, which means individuals with low hash power wont get anything, individuals with large mining farms will get all the coins, wouldn't that simply suggest that elacoin is bias?

[r3animation]

How high is the initial difficulty set? Probably any estimate you have of how high it will need to be to hit your target two minites between blocks is likely to turn out to be too low, so maybe discuss that ahead of time, it is kind of suspicious actually that you didn't even mention initial difficulty yet made vague noises about no pre-mine / early-miner type benefits (which blocks coming out much faster than the target time certainly are...)

-MarkM-

The block reward is based on the difficulty, you know. It is the same as Litecoin. Early adapters will not accumulate a mass amount of coins, as the block reward will be many factors of what they are getting during the launch.

This is why Elacoin is the most fair cryptocurrency - to everyone, the launching adapters, and to the users who come months into the cycle.

How many times do people have to do that spew of orphans before it is clear that Litecoin was already too low difficulty even years ago when it launched, before GPUs could mine Scrypt? Nowadays GPUs can do Scrypt and huge numbers of Mhashes jump each launch.

So put the difficulty reasonable so people mine actual blocks instead of 99% orphans.

Low difficulty also trashed anyone who has any latency, a 200 ping which is only 1/5 of a second is normally not a problem for miners, but when you deliberately pre-plan to squeeze block time below a second it trashes even such perfectly normal (for many people) ping times.

The blocks should average at least your target two minutes right from the start, so it can actually BE fair. Many people take more than two minute just to compile the code, then another two minutes to get running. Some take two minutes just to download the code. So that is already three blocks missed even without scumbags deliberately screwing them out of 60+ blocks per minute by deliberately using insanely low difficulty.

-MarkM-

Hi MarkM,

Thank you for your feedback. The initial block reward is 1, which is very small compared to what it will be with a higher difficulty. While there will be a high amount of blocks produced at the start, the coins produced are very small to compensate for the low difficulty.

But not for the inability of the blocks to propagate fast enough, aka the insane orphan rate. No matter how much hashing power someone has you (or your cronies or whoever) simply snap up each block long before anyone else can even receiver the one you built it on.

-MarkM-

I've been thinking about that too but as long as there are miners and they come in big numbers with a decent amount of hashing power, there isn't any way around it. Or at least I couldn't think of a solution. Have you thought of any?

[Passion_ltc]

Can you give a more specific time? Not anyone has the time to press F5 every 10 seconds..

[Voyager]

Thanks for the announcement. This should be interesting, I've been waiting for a coin that has a block reward based on difficulty. Hope the launch goes smoothly, it seems with the new coins, the launches are getting worse and worse, we could really use a smooth one

As I understand, the reward is proportional to the hash power? Or is it proportional to the current difficulty?

Can't you read between the lines? Its the same scumbags doing the same "litecoins scammed before GPU mining was possible so we are going to scam too but 100's of times more because we have not only GPUs now but also hundreds of times as much Ghashes than litecoin had".

-MarkM-

I understand that all future launches will follow the same disaster as long as starting difficulties are 0, it sucks that all the launches are nothing but latency races now. This one surely won't be different at launch, there will still be just as many orphans. What I am interested to see is how the low starting reward works out. There have been several coins (BitBar, Mincoin) that started with a high reward that dropped quickly, so most of the coins in existence were mined right away when latency was the tie breaker, by the time mining was working right, the reward was nearly nothing. If the reward started low, shouldn't the result be that there aren't many coins mined total until the difficulty gets up to a reasonable level?

It could all be avoided with a higher starting difficulty though, like you've said many times.

[super3]

I like this one. Will someone donate some Elacoin on launch for a faucet? I can have it running maybe an hour after the source is released.

[ymer]

Can you make difficulty >0 ?

[markm]

How high is the initial difficulty set? Probably any estimate you have of how high it will need to be to hit your target two minites between blocks is likely to turn out to be too low, so maybe discuss that ahead of time, it is kind of suspicious actually that you didn't even mention initial difficulty yet made vague noises about no pre-mine / early-miner type benefits (which blocks coming out much faster than the target time certainly are...)

-MarkM-

The block reward is based on the difficulty, you know. It is the same as Litecoin. Early adapters will not accumulate a mass amount of coins, as the block reward will be many factors of what they are getting during the launch.

This is why Elacoin is the most fair cryptocurrency - to everyone, the launching adapters, and to the users who come months into the cycle.

How many times do people have to do that spew of orphans before it is clear that Litecoin was already too low difficulty even years ago when it launched, before GPUs could mine Scrypt? Nowadays GPUs can do Scrypt and huge numbers of Mhashes jump each launch.

So put the difficulty reasonable so people mine actual blocks instead of 99% orphans.

Low difficulty also trashed anyone who has any latency, a 200 ping which is only 1/5 of a second is normally not a problem for miners, but when you deliberately pre-plan to squeeze block time below a second it trashes even such perfectly normal (for many people) ping times.

The blocks should average at least your target two minutes right from the start, so it can actually BE fair. Many people take more than two minute just to compile the code, then another two minutes to get running. Some take two minutes just to download the code. So that is already three blocks missed even without scumbags deliberately screwing them out of 60+ blocks per minute by deliberately using insanely low difficulty.

-MarkM-

Hi MarkM,

Thank you for your feedback. The initial block reward is 1, which is very small compared to what it will be with a higher difficulty. While there will be a high amount of blocks produced at the start, the coins produced are very small to compensate for the low difficulty.

But not for the inability of the blocks to propagate fast enough, aka the insane orphan rate. No matter how much hashing power someone has you (or your cronies or whoever) simply snap up each block long before anyone else can even receiver the one you built it on.

-MarkM-

I've been thinking about that too but as long as there are miners and they come in big numbers with a decent amount of hashing power, there isn't any way around it. Or at least I couldn't think of a solution. Have you thought of any?

It is trivially simple, just start difficulty way the heck higher than the insane low values all the scams have been using.

Bitcoin was >> 20 so maybe >> 10 might at lest allow a few seconds between blocks instead of multiple blocks per second.

We don't even know because none of these coins actually did any research / teting such as each coin launching with the value shifted a few more bits so that each one would be closer toward being a reasonable value.

By now with this many coins launched if each had increased difficulty more based on the previous one's increase not having been enoguh we'd at least have a decent ballpark figure by now.

Some people have suggested that whatever bitshift corresponds to what litecoin type clients show in getinfo as ten ore more might be enough but that has not been tested yet to see if it too is still much too low.

-MarkM-

[baka]

Increasing reward actually is a good idea, this way those with huge hashrates won't get 10000 coins in a few minutes, even with a low diff at start. Not perfect but heck of a lot better than those coins that start with 500 coins per block.

[wangsw]

where is the source code?

[markm]

Thanks for the announcement. This should be interesting, I've been waiting for a coin that has a block reward based on difficulty. Hope the launch goes smoothly, it seems with the new coins, the launches are getting worse and worse, we could really use a smooth one

As I understand, the reward is proportional to the hash power? Or is it proportional to the current difficulty?

Can't you read between the lines? Its the same scumbags doing the same "litecoins scammed before GPU mining was possible so we are going to scam too but 100's of times more because we have not only GPUs now but also hundreds of times as much Ghashes than litecoin had".

-MarkM-

I understand that all future launches will follow the same disaster as long as starting difficulties are 0, it sucks that all the launches are nothing but latency races now. This one surely won't be different at launch, there will still be just as many orphans. What I am interested to see is how the low starting reward works out. There have been several coins (BitBar, Mincoin) that started with a high reward that dropped quickly, so most of the coins in existence were mined right away when latency was the tie breaker, by the time mining was working right, the reward was nearly nothing. If the reward started low, shouldn't the result be that there aren't many coins mined total until the difficulty gets up to a reasonable level?

No, because there will be compensatingly less blocks.

So when there are ten times as many coins per block, there will be 1/10th as many blocks.

But in the beginning, hashing power will hardly count, as there won't be any difficulty, each block wil lbe solved pretty much instantly and its all about latency nothing to do with hashing, and the blocks will be insanely fast so weeks worth will be snapped up in minutes or hours.

-MarkM-

[markm]

Increasing reward actually is a good idea, this way those with huge hashrates won't get 10000 coins in a few minutes, even with a low diff at start. Not perfect but heck of a lot better than those coins that start with 500 coins per block.

Well presumably also when it is difficulty 400 like kitecoin is or is approaching, it will make 400 coins per block so still be shown as more "profitable" than any other coin unless the sheer number of coins eventually makes the price drop from the supply being so inflationary.

There is not no scammy reason not to START the difficulty at "ten" or more though. Likely that stlil won't be enough but at least it might give people a few seconds to get set and go before hundreds of blocks have been mined at 100 or more per second.

-MarkM-

[Milkshake]

Increasing reward actually is a good idea, this way those with huge hashrates won't get 10000 coins in a few minutes, even with a low diff at start. Not perfect but heck of a lot better than those coins that start with 500 coins per block.

Well presumably also when it is difficulty 400 like kitecoin is or is approaching, it will make 400 coins per block so still be shown as more "profitable" than any other coin unless the sheer number of coins eventually makes the price drop from the supply being so inflationary.

There is not no scammy reason not to START the difficulty at "ten" or more though. Likely that stlil won't be enough but at least it might give people a few seconds to get set and go before hundreds of blocks have been mined at 100 or more per second.

-MarkM-

The reason is that I do not have a fast processor (yay for Atom), and it already takes a long time for me to mint the genesis block at the current low difficulty.

I understand your concerns and I will be looking into starting with a much higher difficulty, but it won't be very high for me to not able to mine the genesis block.

Inflation is still controlled with Elacoin.

[markm]

Increasing reward actually is a good idea, this way those with huge hashrates won't get 10000 coins in a few minutes, even with a low diff at start. Not perfect but heck of a lot better than those coins that start with 500 coins per block.

Well presumably also when it is difficulty 400 like kitecoin is or is approaching, it will make 400 coins per block so still be shown as more "profitable" than any other coin unless the sheer number of coins eventually makes the price drop from the supply being so inflationary.

There is not no scammy reason not to START the difficulty at "ten" or more though. Likely that stlil won't be enough but at least it might give people a few seconds to get set and go before hundreds of blocks have been mined at 100 or more per second.

-MarkM-

The reason is that I do not have a fast processor (yay for Atom), and it already takes a long time for me to mint the genesis block at the current low difficulty.

I understand your concerns and I will be looking into starting with a much higher difficulty.

Inflation is still controlled with Elacoin.

As was pointed out long ago now, that is easily fixed since you can just not actually check the difficulty of the genesis block, only check its hash.

-MarkM-

[Milkshake]

Thank you MarkM.


Genesis block will also have a value of 0 so it is the only coin without any premine (literally).

[markm]

Thank you MarkM.


Genesis block will also have a value of 0 so it is the only coin without any premine (literally).

Well supposedly in normal code the coins in the genesis block cannot be spent anyway.

But it used to take me hours to mine testnet genesis blocks, I would just set it running and go to sleep.

What does it matter if it takes even a few days or a week or two, there is no "need" to have it "real soon now".

(Testnet was 1/16 the difficulty of normal net, so it would have taken me 16 or more hours to mine a normal genesis block.)

-MarkM-

[96redformula]

Interested concept.  I like the payout == difficulty aspect, it makes it seem like a fair start for all.

[super3]

Interested concept.  I like the payout == difficulty aspect, it makes it seem like a fair start for all.

Yeah this is what keeps the altcoins going. New cool features like this. We will see how it works in practice.

[Passion_ltc]

Can you give a more specific time? Not anyone has the time to press F5 every 10 seconds..

[Milkshake]

The specific time will be announced soon. Following MarkM's comments, I am remining the genesis block while trolling the forums.

[Devianttwo]

You can go ahead and add my pool link into your site. As long as its scrypt I will be adding it to http://eac.hackshardgaming.net upon release. add me on skype: deviant-fragcorner and let me know the MOMENT it is released and I'll have the pool up within 10 minutes.