Capitalism (continued from How do you deal with the thought about taxes)

[ktttn]

The wild animals belonged to no one until the hunter killed it, and the fruits of the pawpaw tree belonged to no one, until someone picked it. It was rudimentary, but it was certainly an example of a belief in the right of private PERSONAL property.

FTFY

Define your difference between "private" and "personal," as I consider them synonyms.

Core problem.
Private is not as quantum entangled. It's a mere claim. Secreted away from dirty fingers and prying eyes.

EDIT: Personal is defined in bitcoin as providers of hashing power. I'm sure someone else can fill that definition in quite nicely.

"Private" does not cause another atom to spin/vibrate the same way as the word "private?"   
"Personal" means "miners?"     
I was using the definition of "private" to mean the opposite of "public" as opposed to "blocked from public view"

If I wanted to butcher what I said, I would have not done such an explosive job.
Skin cells on my shirt.
Some record that claims I own a tree.
The ink from a pen I wrote with.
A silo of grain ten million miles away someone just sold me.
The mining rigs that pay to my address.
The Dollars in my bank.
Half are personal, the other private. Can you not determine which? Of course we can all see which is which.

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The sad fact is that, yes, slavery has historicly been found coincincidntal to capitalsim. It's also been found coincidental to just about every other known form of governance, including those matriachies that certain posters seem so fond of.  Corrolation is not causation.

Of course not.  Just like smoking doesn't cause cancer  Sure, there's some correlation, but causation?  The only difference is in smoking & cancer, the correlation is much weaker than in capitalism & slavery.  Fact Cat agreez.

The point is don't use correlation, use method of how it happens. Smoking wasn't proven to cause cancer because of correlation, it was proven to cause cancer because of the specific methods discovered.

Huh?  Care to discuss the methodology?  I'm all ears!

So, I'll get you started on this:
"Capitalism is the cause of slavery because when people practice capitalism they _______________________, which leads to slavery.

As soon as you finish:
"Smoking causes cancer because __________, _________

I absolutely agree.  That's why armed mugging is so popular  I point a gun at your face & offer you a profitable trade:  Your life for your wallet.  After a quick negotiation, you conclude that it's in your enlightened self interest to part with your wallet & not your brains.  Another deal done

Which is why the richest men in the world have made their wealth by armed mugging. Or, which is why armed muggers are the richest people in the world   I seriously can not face-palm hard enough at this. I mean, if you really believe this, why not go out, invest in a gun, and become a multi-millionaire yourself?

Oh, come on, you can facepalm harder than that!  Try again!  You doing it?  Harder!  Pay attention:  Never said anything about richest men, never said muggers were rich, and i think you can facepalm harder if you tried.  If you don't understand something in the future, don't assume that it's nonsense -- know that you're simply not smart enough to understand it yet.  Oh, and protip:  You can stop facepalming now.

In the cases that voluntary exchange is not mutually beneficial, such exchanges cannot (by reason) be voluntary.

Depends on what you mean by "voluntary."  In the above trade, you could have chosen to keep your wallet & pick your brains up off the sidewalk.  I love freedom of choice.

Was choosing not to trade an option? No? Then I guess it wasn't really "voluntary," was it. Think these things through before posting something you think is clever.

Of course it was.  You were free to choose not to trade & find out the mugger's response.  Just like a woman can choose not to work for a pittance & watch her kids starve to death.  Freedom is a wonderful thing, it's delicious you must have some.

Edit: brackets

[ktttn]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

[Rassah]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

Is this a statement of fact, or a hypothesis? Would one example of a place without taxes that is not in the amazon jungle prove your theory wrong? Would you then just keep expanding your theory until it became "Unless you live in a place without tax-collecting government, you have to pay taxes anywhere in the world?"

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What do you think makes a meme -- obscurity or repetition.  Still thinking?  Oh, come on, i'll give you a hint, it's the last one.  ... Give up?  Ok, it's the last one, repetition!  Yeah, sure you were about to say that.

So... "the earth is round" is a meme then?

It's not a biconditional, you goof.  Here:  So... since all men are mortal, then all mortals are men? Answer: NO.

That's a gradeschool logic mistake.

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I already lived in a paradise much like that -- ya iz toy je stranyi kak tyi, moy daragoyi   (Translated: I am from the same country as you, my dear)

Ah. Well, I guess that explains why you are still defending the motherland, while the rest of us got the fuck out in the 80's/90's.

If you think admitting that the rock's as bad as the hard place = defending, then why, pray tell, are you defending this statist disaster?

Uh... what? Which one am I defending? I don't live in Ukraine or Italy, and don't like US much either.

Uhh...  then i'm not defending Russia. Have you stop facepalming yet?

[Rassah]

Skin cells on my shirt.  - PRIVATE AND PERSONAL
Some record that claims I own a tree. - PRIVATE
The ink from a pen I wrote with. - PERSONAL, unless you are talking about the ink still in your pen, in which case PRIVATE
A silo of grain ten million miles away someone just sold me. - PRIVATE
The mining rigs that pay to my address. - PRIVATE
The Dollars in my bank. - PRIVATE

Half are personal, the other private. Can you not determine which? Of course we can all see which is which.

Did I do that right?

[ktttn]

The sad fact is that, yes, slavery has historicly been found coincincidntal to capitalsim. It's also been found coincidental to just about every other known form of governance, including those matriachies that certain posters seem so fond of.  Corrolation is not causation.

Of course not.  Just like smoking doesn't cause cancer  Sure, there's some correlation, but causation?  The only difference is in smoking & cancer, the correlation is much weaker than in capitalism & slavery.  Fact Cat agreez.

The point is don't use correlation, use method of how it happens. Smoking wasn't proven to cause cancer because of correlation, it was proven to cause cancer because of the specific methods discovered. So, I'll get you started on this:
"Capitalism is the cause of ((contemporary wage)) slavery because when people practice capitalism they need to exploit margins which leads to slavery.

I absolutely agree.  That's why armed mugging is so popular  I point a gun at your face & offer you a profitable trade:  Your life for your wallet.  After a quick negotiation, you conclude that it's in your enlightened self interest to part with your wallet & not your brains.  Another deal done

Which is why the richest men in the world have made their wealth by armed mugging. Or, which is why armed muggers are the richest people in the world  I seriously can not face-palm hard enough at this. I mean, if you really believe this, why not go out, invest in a gun, and become a multi-millionaire yourself?

In the cases that voluntary exchange is not mutually beneficial, such exchanges cannot (by reason) be voluntary.

Depends on what you mean by "voluntary."  In the above trade, you could have chosen to keep your wallet & pick your brains up off the sidewalk.  I love freedom of choice.

Was choosing not to trade an option? No? Then I guess it wasn't really "voluntary," was it. Think these things through before posting something you think is clever.

Edited.

[ktttn]

Skin cells on my shirt.  - PRIVATE AND PERSONAL
Some record that claims I own a tree. - PRIVATE
The ink from a pen I wrote with. - PERSONAL, unless you are talking about the ink still in your pen, in which case PRIVATE
A silo of grain ten million miles away someone just sold me. - PRIVATE
The mining rigs that pay to my address. - PRIVATE
The Dollars in my bank. - PRIVATE

Half are personal, the other private. Can you not determine which? Of course we can all see which is which.

Did I do that right?

Those things are all public.

Edit: Poll! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=239271.0

[crumbs]

The sad fact is that, yes, slavery has historicly been found coincincidntal to capitalsim. It's also been found coincidental to just about every other known form of governance, including those matriachies that certain posters seem so fond of.  Corrolation is not causation.

Of course not.  Just like smoking doesn't cause cancer  Sure, there's some correlation, but causation?  The only difference is in smoking & cancer, the correlation is much weaker than in capitalism & slavery.  Fact Cat agreez.

The point is don't use correlation, use method of how it happens. Smoking wasn't proven to cause cancer because of correlation, it was proven to cause cancer because of the specific methods discovered. So, I'll get you started on this:
"Capitalism is the cause of ((contemporary wage)) slavery because when people practice capitalism they need to exploit margins which leads to slavery.

I absolutely agree.  That's why armed mugging is so popular  I point a gun at your face & offer you a profitable trade:  Your life for your wallet.  After a quick negotiation, you conclude that it's in your enlightened self interest to part with your wallet & not your brains.  Another deal done

Which is why the richest men in the world have made their wealth by armed mugging. Or, which is why armed muggers are the richest people in the world  I seriously can not face-palm hard enough at this. I mean, if you really believe this, why not go out, invest in a gun, and become a multi-millionaire yourself?

In the cases that voluntary exchange is not mutually beneficial, such exchanges cannot (by reason) be voluntary.

Depends on what you mean by "voluntary."  In the above trade, you could have chosen to keep your wallet & pick your brains up off the sidewalk.  I love freedom of choice.

Was choosing not to trade an option? No? Then I guess it wasn't really "voluntary," was it. Think these things through before posting something you think is clever.

Edited.

And what wage did you expect, ktttn?  Paying you more than is absolutely necessary is simply not enlightened self-interest.

[MoonShadow]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

[ktttn]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Hi.
Never. Anything. At all.

[crumbs]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Wasn't it you that posted a that freedomizer NH link, MoonShadow? NH

[ktttn]

The sad fact is that, yes, slavery has historicly been found coincincidntal to capitalsim. It's also been found coincidental to just about every other known form of governance, including those matriachies that certain posters seem so fond of.  Corrolation is not causation.

Of course not.  Just like smoking doesn't cause cancer  Sure, there's some correlation, but causation?  The only difference is in smoking & cancer, the correlation is much weaker than in capitalism & slavery.  Fact Cat agreez.

The point is don't use correlation, use method of how it happens. Smoking wasn't proven to cause cancer because of correlation, it was proven to cause cancer because of the specific methods discovered. So, I'll get you started on this:
"Capitalism is the cause of ((contemporary wage)) slavery because when people practice capitalism they need to exploit margins which leads to slavery.

I absolutely agree.  That's why armed mugging is so popular  I point a gun at your face & offer you a profitable trade:  Your life for your wallet.  After a quick negotiation, you conclude that it's in your enlightened self interest to part with your wallet & not your brains.  Another deal done

Which is why the richest men in the world have made their wealth by armed mugging. Or, which is why armed muggers are the richest people in the world  I seriously can not face-palm hard enough at this. I mean, if you really believe this, why not go out, invest in a gun, and become a multi-millionaire yourself?

In the cases that voluntary exchange is not mutually beneficial, such exchanges cannot (by reason) be voluntary.

Depends on what you mean by "voluntary."  In the above trade, you could have chosen to keep your wallet & pick your brains up off the sidewalk.  I love freedom of choice.

Was choosing not to trade an option? No? Then I guess it wasn't really "voluntary," was it. Think these things through before posting something you think is clever.

Edited.

And what wage did you expect, ktttn?  Paying you more than is absolutely necessary is simply not enlightened self-interest.

Well I expected a gosh darn goose egg.
Too bad about all those negative integer net earners, hm?

[MoonShadow]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Hi.
Never. Anything. At all.

And no one buys anything on your behalf either, I suppose.

[MoonShadow]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Wasn't it you that posted a that freedomizer NH link, MoonShadow? NH

Maybe.  I don't remember that one.  I'm pretty sure there are still taxes in NH, though.

[Rassah]

The point is don't use correlation, use method of how it happens. Smoking wasn't proven to cause cancer because of correlation, it was proven to cause cancer because of the specific methods discovered. So, I'll get you started on this:
"Capitalism is the cause of ((contemporary wage)) slavery because when people practice capitalism they need to exploit margins which leads to slavery.

Ah, thank you. So, can you explain what you mean by "wage slavery?" Does it involve being forced to do anything against his/her will?

[MoonShadow]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Hi.
Never. Anything. At all.

This makes me even more curious.  How do you access this forum, if you neither own anything, nor buy time at a cybercafe?

[crumbs]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Hi.
Never. Anything. At all.

This makes me even more curious.  How do you access this forum, if you neither own anything, nor buy time at a cybercafe?

She's one of those weird people with friends...

[crumbs]

Unless you live deep in the amazon jungle you have to pay taxes, anywhere in the world. Theres no getting away from it.

I pay no taxes and live in no amazon jungle.
Freeganism.

I thought you lived in the US, do you not pay sales taxes?  Do you never buy anything at all?

Wasn't it you that posted a that freedomizer NH link, MoonShadow? NH

Maybe.  I don't remember that one.  I'm pretty sure there are still taxes in NH, though.

Nah.  No sales tax.
It's also the birthplace of the fabulous GG Allin (RIP)