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Author Topic: Feature request: Forum remailer  (Read 151 times)
nullius (OP)
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March 11, 2018, 11:00:05 PM
 #1

I hereby suggest a forum remailer to integrate with and complement the PM system.

Why?

  • Privacy.  It is infeasible to use PGP for each and every PM.  Good mail clients integrate neatly with PGP/GPG, making secure communications convenient and nearly transparent; but many forum users will decline to give out an e-mail address, even if I suggest a good e-mail provider for this purpose.  A forum remailer would facilitate PGP use, provided that it must pass PGP/MIME without mangling it.
  • Usability.  The PM interface is—suboptimal, to put the matter politely.  (Frankly, I hate it.)  With e-mail, people have a choice of clients and can choose their own user interfaces.
  • Resources.  A remailer would only need to store spooled messages for long enough to pass them on to their destinations.  The PM system must store messages for as long as a user desires not to delete them.

It is difficult for me to make a specific suggestion as to how this should work, when I do not know anything about the forum’s internals.  Conceptually, I think a remailer could dovetail with the PM system.  For receiving, users could choose to opt-in to the remailer—whereafter they would no longer receive PMs, and all remailed messages plus PMs would be (only) forwarded to their registered e-mail addresses.  For sending, users could unilaterally send mail to uid@users.bitcointalk.org; the recipient would receive the message as a PM, or via the remailer if opted in for it.

Note:  The message format for “remailed” PMs would need to be much different from the format currently used for “new personal message” e-mail notifications.  It would need to preserve formatting, respect MIME parts for messages sent to the uid@ address, and provide From/Reply-To information which would automatically cause replies to pass through the remailer.  Making this non-ugly is actually the biggest practical problem I can think of.

I have previously suggested this here in Meta, off-the-cuff:

Re drafts - e.g. if I open a VM for Bitcointalk I will probably use it for a few days so good enough for me although TBH I'm not into long essays. Sometimes when I need to save it for longer I send it in a PM to myself.

PMs here are a disaster, in my opinion.

Feature suggestion for a “crypto” forum:  An opt-in remailer, which would let me send mail to suchmoon@users.bitcointalk.org—or maybe 234771@, since usernames here can contain charcters which are problematic.  (Problematic, despite being allowed by the original RFC 822.)  Spam could be curtailed by requiring SMTP envelope FROM the registered e-mail address, and obeying SPF records, etc.

That way, I could use the very convenient PGP functionality of my mail client.  Plus its drafts box.

I should start a new Meta topic.  Watch for it.

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March 11, 2018, 11:15:18 PM
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Like a post office here on the forum? I do agree on this since i'm trying to be more private but i have a question. Will this be managed by a group of people or a programmed bot?

If by a group of people, time would be their enemy.

If by a programmed bot, then good choice, but the thing is, can it handle a huge load of PMs circulating daily?
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March 12, 2018, 02:04:55 AM
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PMs received (except those sent by newbies, in terms of content) can be sent via email, and will contain the content of said PM, which can be encrypted if the sender takes steps to do so.

The forum acting as a remailer would also open the possibility of more phishing scam attempts, it would make it difficult to prevent this, and would make it difficult to track who is behind these types of scams. The same is true for other types of spam.

Another issue is the sender would need to expose their email address in order to send another member a message.


Overall this would give an incremental amount of convenience in maintaining privacy for the recipient, while making things much easier for scammers and spammers. 
nullius (OP)
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March 12, 2018, 03:08:12 AM
 #4

Note:  The principal purpose of my suggestion is to facilitate bidirectional PGP-encrypted communications between users.  PGP is important to me—so much so, that I am now CM for my very own 256% AIRDROP BOUNTY SIGNATURE SPAM old-school CRYPTO campaign.

Everybody is familiar with this warning on the “Send message” page of the forum’s PM system:

Quote
Note: PM privacy is not guaranteed. Encrypt sensitive messages.

As one who has attempted to follow that advice, I can attest that it is flat-out impractical.  I endure extreme inconvenience (and oftentimes, monetary loss) for the sake of privacy.  If I can’t handle the mind-numbing, error-prone tedium of copypasting manually encrypted/decrypted significant numbers of messages in and out of the forum’s PM system, then the above warning to “encrypt” is but a mockery.

Please improve the forum to make it feasible for privacy-conscious users to use PGP for every message, all the time.


Like a post office here on the forum? I do agree on this since i'm trying to be more private but i have a question. Will this be managed by a group of people or a programmed bot?

If by a group of people, time would be their enemy.

If by a programmed bot, then good choice, but the thing is, can it handle a huge load of PMs circulating daily?

Of course, this function would be performed in software.  Not what would usually be considered a bot:  A daemon, or more likely, daemons plural (mailer-daemon plus something to integrate the mailer with the PM system).  I do not even see how it would be possible for humans to—what, manually select and move messages between the PM and e-mail systems?

If ordinary MTAs can easily handle millions of messages, and the forum’s PM system can handle what it does now, I do not see where any scaling concerns would arise unless the system were implemented by monkeys.


PMs received (except those sent by newbies, in terms of content) can be sent via email, and will contain the content of said PM, which can be encrypted if the sender takes steps to do so.

However:  (0) You can’t simply hit “reply” to those messages.  (1) There is no way to send PMs by e-mail; the only means to send a PGP PM is manual copypaste with a web browser (!).  (2) PGP/MIME cannot be sent through the PM system.  (3) The message header fields are not set to values conducive to comfortably reading PMs in your e-mail; the From: and Subject: fields in particular would need to be more informative.

The forum acting as a remailer would also open the possibility of more phishing scam attempts, it would make it difficult to prevent this, and would make it difficult to track who is behind these types of scams. The same is true for other types of spam.

How?  Given proper upfront identification of messages as being from a user (via Bitcoin Forum), I don’t see how this would significantly assist phishing.  As stated below, it should be obvious that I do not suggest that messages should be blindly passed through the system.  Logging could and should be performed for abuse response purposes.  Logging and rate-limiting could be used to combat spam, just as same are used now.

Another issue is the sender would need to expose their email address in order to send another member a message.

From the term “remailer” (as opposed to “forwarder”) and my discussion of many users’ reluctance to expose their mail addresses, I deemed it obvious that the sender address would be rewritten.  E.g., mail from me through the system would be received with a From: header of "nullius via Bitcoin Forum" <976210@users.bitcointalk.org> (or nullius@users.bitcointalk.org—but likely the numeric address, since forum usernames can contain characters problematic in mail address box parts).  SMTP envelope FROM should be a VERP (Variable Envelope Return Path), as used by mailing lists to catch bounces.  Note:  Some of my discussion here requires an understanding of how Internet mail works.

Essentially, I am suggesting some form of Type 1 Remailer.

Overall this would give an incremental amount of convenience in maintaining privacy for the recipient, while making things much easier for scammers and spammers. 

How?



Emphasis:  I did suggest that the receiving end of the system should be opt-in for those users who want to receive all PMs by e-mail.  The only change for those who did not willingly opt-in would be that they may receive PMs which originated in the mail system.  Of course, sending into the system must be restricted to the e-mail address associated with a username; and mail should show up in the PM system as being “from” a username, just as it does now.

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