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Author Topic: Official Avalon mining rig clones thread from bitmine.ch (NOW SHIPPING)  (Read 57753 times)
erem
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September 09, 2013, 01:23:37 PM
 #441


They do not recognize this. In previous emails exchanged with them, I made clear we invested on them. Their answer was as cold/rude as it could be. "We do not sell investments, we sell products."

If buying a non existing product from a non experienced "company" based on promises is not an investment on them........
... (then) ... show me your investment contract!
I guess you bought a product and not an investment. That fact that the product was not in hand straight away makes no difference.

So for example ... you buy new car (BMW, VW, Nissan, ... whatever is your favorite) ... it gets custom made according to your needs and then (usually after months of waiting) delivered (or you arranged factory pick).
Is that an investment as well? I guess not.
You could argue that the Avalon Clones make you money and the car doesn't, but even if you have a Pizza delivery service or run a taxi, I doubt very much that the car manufacturer gives you your money back (or free upgrades ... some dealers might do ... but not the manufacturer), if they bring out a newer and better version in the meantime. So in the end you can cry all day long, but it does not change the fact that you made a mistake in buying that product in the first place.

And here comes the big IF: If I would have known that before, I would not have bought them myself. But after thinking long and hard (when I still had the chance to opt-out) I decided to stay on.
Here comes the small if (at least for me): If you did not think it through, because greed controlled your brain all the way, until you realized that you overpaid or bought the wrong product, then I feel sorry for you and hope you learned a lesson (as did I).

Never the less ... peace and mine for everyone!

       one4many

You are partially right. The problem is that the agreement was not only to deliver a product, but also deliver it in certain time. The customers ordered products which were scheduled to deliver in August. They didn't receive the promised devices on time. When somebody is manufacturer it is always a risk that a supplier won't deliver a product but it is not something that customer may care. There was an agreement between a buyer and seller to deliver the device on time. Passing all the risk to the the final customer is unfair and possibly against EU consumer protection law (don't not Swiss however). That is also very bad move from the marketing point of view since the customer remembers disappointment. I also do not understand why Giorgio is not responding. I understand that he may be overworked, but silence is the worst choice now. I hope Bitmine will show their professionalism and find some solution  Smiley

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September 09, 2013, 01:36:37 PM
 #442


Sure he is absultely right, Bitemine came with big words, took the money, ilegal changed policies & finally just hot air and a lot of angry clients. They know it weeks now that the ROI of clients will never happen and just continue gamble with peoples money. If you think the whole situation can`t get worst - they can`t even produce 30 units in 2 weeks PLUS it seems that "friends" get units faster than other clients.

I wrote them now 5 times that I don`t want my Batch2 orders and want a refund as they stated & contracted when I bought - no answer, not one... Bitmine you are just one more big client support fail! So in my opinion DONT buy at them new 28nm generation devices as they will burn your money & finally they will look you never get a ROI. Thats sure now & you can see how trustfull they are now fucking up their early clients! They never had one of this chips in hand & are now stealing the next batch of money - be warned!

If they will not answer soon I will go the same way as Cimpex because this whole thing is a big fraud till now if they will not refund or upgrade old orders.

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September 09, 2013, 02:57:41 PM
 #443

The risk cannot be input to the client, thats not how business work.
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September 09, 2013, 03:58:36 PM
 #444

Ok - just got my shipping confirmation of batch1. So please have look at the upgrade options now for the batch2 orders.

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September 09, 2013, 04:05:13 PM
 #445

This all said by the one who received an email to pickup his avalons before anyone else received any kind of notice...

What's up shill? Having a nice day?

I can only second that.
Not my problem if you wait for hours (days?) to get your order in?
I was the first who ordered! And took the liberty to actually visit them to see that they are legit.
Something I paid out of my own pocket ... when everybody was scream Scam here ... just go back to first few pages of this thread.
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September 09, 2013, 04:41:24 PM
 #446

This all said by the one who received an email to pickup his avalons before anyone else received any kind of notice...

What's up shill? Having a nice day?

I can only second that.
Not my problem if you wait for hours (days?) to get your order in?
I was the first who ordered! And took the liberty to actually visit them to see that they are legit.
Something I paid out of my own pocket ... when everybody was scream Scam here ... just go back to first few pages of this thread.

Tell me your banck account number to paid you back

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September 09, 2013, 09:09:51 PM
 #447

can we get an update on batch 2 orders of what's going to happen, Yifu announced today they are refunding all chip orders.
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September 09, 2013, 09:40:41 PM
 #448

can we get an update on batch 2 orders of what's going to happen, Yifu announced today they are refunding all chip orders.

It would make more sense to give you customers the choice of cancelling their order and give them store credit for future orders (for example for CoinCraft units). Heck, even deduct the of PCB and parts ordered but get us out of this loosing dead-end.
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September 10, 2013, 07:50:45 AM
 #449

Dear all,

Yesterday we have FINALLY been able to talk with Yifu and he assured us a refund of the batch 2+3 Avalon ICs.

We are now putting together a general offer where you'll be able to choose from either a refund or a very interesting upgrade to our new, 28nm Coincraft products. We will also post the details of the upgrade offer that will be reserved to all of our batch 1 customers.

Please keep an eye on the forum and on the newsletter as we will posting the details soon.

Thank you for your patience and understanding
wallydz
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September 10, 2013, 07:51:38 AM
 #450

can we get an update on batch 2 orders of what's going to happen, Yifu announced today they are refunding all chip orders.

It would make more sense to give you customers the choice of cancelling their order and give them store credit for future orders (for example for CoinCraft units). Heck, even deduct the of PCB and parts ordered but get us out of this loosing dead-end.

THis would be great my order # 216 is on batch 1 and still didnt get it !


and from all stats i did i will never get return on my invest and what is more funny all ASIC Seller just keep quiet but they know what is going on
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September 10, 2013, 11:32:02 AM
 #451

Yesterday we have FINALLY been able to talk with Yifu and he assured us a refund of the batch 2+3 Avalon ICs.

This is funny... so you didn't request a refund for batch 1... strange.. since you reported they haven't delivered them and you had to buy them elsewhere... (at double price, yeah right..)

Still I'm glade to see batch2 and 3 will have some sort of opportunity... even better would be for you to offer some real costumer support for batch1.. but as you are now focused in getting more money for another non existent product...

We see all happening again... new topic to sell new product.. you guys go there and answer everything to show that you care.. but as soon as you get the money... well..

> GeekFC.eu < Android TV Boxes & Raspberry Pi
one4many
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September 10, 2013, 12:43:58 PM
 #452

Yesterday we have FINALLY been able to talk with Yifu and he assured us a refund of the batch 2+3 Avalon ICs.

This is funny... so you didn't request a refund for batch 1... strange.. since you reported they haven't delivered them and you had to buy them elsewhere... (at double price, yeah right..)

Still I'm glade to see batch2 and 3 will have some sort of opportunity... even better would be for you to offer some real costumer support for batch1.. but as you are now focused in getting more money for another non existent product...

We see all happening again... new topic to sell new product.. you guys go there and answer everything to show that you care.. but as soon as you get the money... well..
I guess Giorgio is talking about their first order with Avalon and not the miner batch1 ... They ordered multiple lots (batches) of Asics from Avalon and they cancel only order 2 and 3 which was made a few weeks after the first one.
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September 10, 2013, 01:43:01 PM
 #453

bitmine acquired 70.000 chips for double price from zefir for their batch1 clones.

I am relieved that people come back on the right path, uncertainty and lack of communication gave me a couple of sleepless nights.
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September 10, 2013, 02:07:54 PM
 #454

It really depends on how you look at things..

I believe costumers would have preferred reading something like "Hey.. so Avalon isn't going to deliver any time soon, but we are able to buy the same chips (for "double" price?) in order to make the product you bought... or we can offer you one of our newer products. Which do you prefer?"

> GeekFC.eu < Android TV Boxes & Raspberry Pi
Micky25
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September 10, 2013, 02:42:36 PM
 #455

well, I for my part only want to get out of this bitcoin nightmare as fast as possible, completely. I've got blinded by greed, put too much cash in too much hazardous investments and in most cases only got out by a whisker and with minor losses, because the guys on the other sides surprisingly got back on track in the very last minute.

At least I got a chance to reconsider the worth of my labour again by that. No more magical money-out-of-nothing machines for me, maybe a solar collector will be adequate.
zefir
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September 10, 2013, 02:59:23 PM
 #456

bitmine acquired 70.000 chips for double price from zefir for their batch1 clones.

I am relieved that people come back on the right path, uncertainty and lack of communication gave me a couple of sleepless nights.

No, it were 7k chips, not 70k.

And it were my chips reserved for the manufacturing contract with Bitmine to build 65 Avalon clones for my mining operation. Instead of taking the clones, Giorgio paid me the potential mining profit I could make with them (which at that time was around 2x original price) to be able to serve pending orders of other customers. The other day ASICMINER dropped rig prices to 0.35BTC/GHps and made Avalon chips almost worthless. So this attempt to make as many customers happy as possible turned out to be a very bad deal for Bitmine.

I am only a customer like anyone else here (with still 40+ clones in order) and therefore understand and share the disappointment most of you have. But Bitmine is not the correct target for your anger. I know first hand that they did whatever was doable to keep their part of the deal.

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September 10, 2013, 03:07:39 PM
 #457

Zefir, they posted news on their website on the 12/08 (https://bitmine.ch/?p=802) saying the following:

Quote
But what happens in the unlikely event that Avalon is not going to deliver the chips soon? In this case, as we value our customer’s loyalty, your order will automatically be upgraded to a second generation miner based on Bitfury chips with double as much hashing power for FREE.

Nothing said they would be the buying chips elsewhere.

As you pointed, it was a bad move from them.

Why should we accept this when they offered another solution?

> GeekFC.eu < Android TV Boxes & Raspberry Pi
Micky25
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September 10, 2013, 03:13:05 PM
 #458

No, it were 7k chips, not 70k.

Sorry I remembered and reported that wrong, I knew I should have checked your post, I was in a hurry.
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September 10, 2013, 06:02:34 PM
 #459


But Bitmine is not the correct target for your anger.


+1

..Assuming that the upcoming Asic devices will be in our hands soon, for the same price we should get about 15x the power of their Avalon clones.
Not a good deal if compared to what we've lost since July, but way better than having anything Avalon-based today.

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September 10, 2013, 08:22:01 PM
 #460

So if you order now https://bitmine.ch/?product=coincraft-desk for example. 600ghps when you will get it? In 2013 or Q1 2014? Sry there is just so many confusing post and no correct answer.

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