[Group buy] Avalon chips Escrow John K / Please check refund list until Sunday

[racquemis]

agreed. Also there was no word on the HEX16 being designed at the start of this GB1 when we paid for the chips. It was not part of the terms.
Also, even if this wasn't the case,I'm not willing to pay a design fee when you still have given no word on what will done with boards of people with a chip refund.
Can they be refunded when gen2 arrives and new people start ordering? If not there would be no need for a design fee since you then basically got free boards to sell.

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[quest]

there's no need for a vote, design fees should be included in PCB cost, not on chips which we never received.

I agree.

+1

Edit: do we need to sign for this  

[marto74]

there's no need for a vote, design fees should be included in PCB cost, not on chips which we never received, at last we saw why your board price is cheaper than another - cause your calculations are all wrong!

You do not need to offend me.

Just say that you think I do not deserve payment for organizing this group. THAT IS ENOUGH

[quest]

mail sent

[quest]

Marto74 is asking for twice the compensation he asked for in the opening post.
From the opening post:

9. Pricing
A: I am asking for a 9% surplus for my nerves (risk compensation). the 10k chips totaled to 782.1BTC, which results to a resale price of 0.085BTC / chip.

782.1BTC divided by ten Thousand chips equals 0.07821BTC / chip
with the 9% fee it results in a chip of price of 0.085BTC / chip as advertised in the terms. (0,00679 BTC fee)

With the new designers fee of 0,09*0,085=0,00765BTC. The total fees we pay to marto 74 equals a whopping 18,3% fee over the original chip price (excluding escrow fee)

This is unacceptable and i demand that you remove the additional fee before sending the refund list to John K.
This "Cash-in first, ask questions later" tactic is unacceptable. It should be the other around.

to the other GB1 participants:
If we don't have a satisfactory from marto by the end of the day, i urge everybody to contact John K to get the refund on hold before he runs with double the fee.

I also think that is is better to let john pay it directly so that you don't have to ask for it later.

[jkminkov]

there's no need for a vote, design fees should be included in PCB cost, not on chips which we never received, at last we saw why your board price is cheaper than another - cause your calculations are all wrong!

You do not need to offend me.

Just say that you think I do not deserve payment for organizing this group. THAT IS ENOUGH

I have lost two months worth of wages here, and I have every right to offend every female collateral relative of yours.

[nemercry]

there's no need for a vote, design fees should be included in PCB cost, not on chips which we never received, at last we saw why your board price is cheaper than another - cause your calculations are all wrong!

You do not need to offend me.

Just say that you think I do not deserve payment for organizing this group. THAT IS ENOUGH

I have lost two months worth of wages here, and I have every right to offend every female collateral relative of yours.

Could you all please calm down ? We're all sitting in the same boat and it does not get better if we start to throw stones at our heads, because the harbour closed their doors(i.e avalon).
@racquemis: What you say isnt true ? How do you get to those 18,3% ?
He takes 9%(8.68% to be exact.) what it exactly what was stated on the first page. It's 0.9% less than SebastianJu and Zefir wanted to take.

782.1BTC * 1,09 = 852,489 pet batch.
Makes 0.0852489 BTC/Chip
In my example 32 Chips at 0.0852489 BTC/Chip that makes 2.7279648 BTC
I only payed 2.72BTC because the rest was ceiled down.(We all did, just an example on my own investement)
(2.72 /32) = 0.085 BTC/Chip * 10000 = 850 BTC/Batch

Compared to its original price: 782.1/850 = 0.9201176
Now lets build the inverse of this 1/0.9201176 = 1,0868175
Which results in a margin taken by marto of 8,68% instead of 9%.
Which now builds the discrepancy on that what you paid and the deducted fee from marto. In other words deduct 8.68% from the original price of 0.0085 btc and you got the right solution.

[racquemis]

Yeah, i see now. reading and logic in a sleepy state is't the best. Deleting that post. Sry guys.
if he just mentions the Original 9% fee, instead of PCB fee. i wouldnt be confused.

If its indeed only the 9%. we all signed up for the 9% when we paid for the chips. we knew what we were getting into. its in the terms in the opening post. marto74 deserves the 9%. still bit high for my likes but he earned the 9% with everything he has went through here. including my erroneous post

[nemercry]

If its indeed only the 9%. we all signed up for the 9% when we paid for the chips. we knew what we were getting into. its in the terms in the opening post. marto74 deserves the 9%. still bit high for my likes but he earned the 9% with everything he has went through here. including my erroneous post

+1

Lets leave this mess behind us and sail to new grounds. : )

[Zich]

If its indeed only the 9%. we all signed up for the 9% when we paid for the chips. we knew what we were getting into. its in the terms in the opening post. marto74 deserves the 9%. still bit high for my likes but he earned the 9% with everything he has went through here. including my erroneous post

+1

Lets leave this mess behind us and sail to new grounds. : )

+1

martin indeed deserve the 9% for all his work to organizing this groups buy. Nothing free of service.
We all already know the risk for gamble. 9 % lost in gamble, wow don't you all think that was a good deal?

If you all want to blame someone then blame Yifu for making this drama. The story will be different if avalon ship in time, i believe many of you will send extra tips to martin.

[fex]

Marto put a lot of work into group buy and board design and deserves a compensation. However, I'm already donating 3 ordered PCBs to him because I obviously don't need them anymore - isn't that enough? Anyways, I'll accept the extra fee if that's consensus; I mean, those are conditions stated in the OP.

[Zich]

One thing for sure is the 2 % escrow fee won't be refunded. Other 7 % you all need to appreciate martin work.
This is not small matter organizing Group Buy. What martin spend on that 7% is not our concern because it is his right. And i was very gratefull that he used it for HEX16 development so the price not very high in the end.

[jkminkov]

cool job, organizing a failed group buy, postponing best group interests by 2 weeks at the end and getting free 66+ BTC for all that!

[darkfriend77]

cool job, organizing a failed group buy, postponing best group interests by 2 weeks at the end and getting free 66+ BTC for all that!

+1

[marto74]

cool job, organizing a failed group buy, postponing best group interests by 2 weeks at the end and getting free 66+ BTC for all that!

Again ,
What happened after waiting 2 weeks??
The refund is done by Avalon and nobody that is not wanting chips anymore is going to be forced to receive chips instead of BTC.
You think that organizing this is a joke?
You and a few  other members joking with the signed messages, what do you want???
I just think I deserve payment for my efforts, but will let you all decide .
Please understand I'm trying to serve equaly all of you .
Avalon fucked us all, but you specially after reselling some of your chips at higher prices ...........
So the group will decide , and YES  with signed messages again , because it is the only way somebody can prove ownership.
And with you I will not make a deal never again, after we finish this messy Avalon deal
Peace
Martin

[jkminkov]

return my btc, no vote on that matter!

[marto74]

return my btc, no vote on that matter!

Personally to you I'll return the tax coresponding to your chips that I did received in 25 days.
In any case you will not get the escrow tax of 2 % as far this was part of the deal.
Consider  your fee in this group as a gift
Hopefully after that I'll never heard anything of you.

Regards: Martin

[jkminkov]

cool, I'm glad your conscience had spoken.

[voxelot]

I have another request to make an edit and be removed from the refund list.  I have sold my order of 32 chips to vl4dim1r and I wish him the best of luck having the chips shipped to him and burned to the K16 boards.  Marto... he will be emailing your address set up for his shipping arrangement.

Regards

Code:

I, voxelot, hereby transfer ownership of 32 avalon chips from Order #34 in marto74 batch #1 to vl4dim1r in exchange for TxID db81c1a882a2b90dc8887687ed2ad4918d84202c02744433c3037faa8b3607ab

I wish him best of luck during the prototyping process for the Klondike K16 board!

Code:

H6brEVEo3wm9c65YxYgGKSQaUbdrFhyl5D/msfCYvWOxCVaDnhQR4eVLRmKRbMbuPU7Ap49iv5zIZ6kkGB2Hl5s=

[quest]

return my btc, no vote on that matter!

Personally to you I'll return the tax coresponding to your chips that I did received in 25 days.
In any case you will not get the escrow tax of 2 % as far this was part of the deal.
Hopefully after that I'll never heard anything of you.

Regards: Martin

I think Marto did a good job after all. There is a refund option and a option to receive chips. Also the 7% fee is voluntarily.

Edit: Just for reference marto edited his post from "7% design fee for our boards" if you requested for a refund to "a little les than 7 % service tax for me for the efforts running this group".