Butterfly Labs Announces Bulk Chip Sales

[erk]

This is interesting.  Chips delivered en mass in around 100 days?  Is that BFL suggesting they will get most or all of their preorders done within the next 100 days and then concentrate on the chip business?  To me it seems pretty unlikely, as the PCBs instead of the chips seem to be the hold up right now.  BFL could well be shipping chips while product preorders are still outstanding.  It will take a while for third parties to develop, test and ship their own boards so BFL probably have 200 days from now before rival products appear based on BFL chips.

BFL don't make the chips, they are made for them, all the do is order the wafers, then send them of to the chip makers. Nothing whatsoever to do with the BFL production line making miners.

[PuertoLibre]

Is it OK in the US if those damn assholes sell the basic components of a product I already paid in June 2012 to another customer?! They should burn in hell! 

Considering that's not what they are doing, all you have done is shown your lack of comprehension of a relatively simple product announcement. I suggest you go and read it again, perhaps twice.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/3014-butterfly-labs-announces-bulk-chip-sales.html

Uh, they are offering to convert orders to chips orders. So it appears you don't know or don't read...

[PuertoLibre]

If they deliver a single ASIC before all pre-orders are shipped, they fucked their customers again. There are no signs that they will ship all their pre-orders in the next 100 days. I read the announcement several times but don't see the statement that the ASIC shipment will begin after the last Miner pre-order was shipped.

I hope they do, just to rub it in your face! It's clowns like yourself that try and equate the supply of a single component with the supply of a completed whole item. If it were just chip supply that was holding up the pre-orders they would have been out the door weeks ago. Why not pick on long torex screws, or cases, they need those too.

Those screws and cases were ordered long in advance, erk. Sometimes re-ordered more than once when the design changed.

Please, learn...something.

[PuertoLibre]

This is interesting.  Chips delivered en mass in around 100 days?  Is that BFL suggesting they will get most or all of their preorders done within the next 100 days and then concentrate on the chip business?  To me it seems pretty unlikely, as the PCBs instead of the chips seem to be the hold up right now.  BFL could well be shipping chips while product preorders are still outstanding.  It will take a while for third parties to develop, test and ship their own boards so BFL probably have 200 days from now before rival products appear based on BFL chips.

So... at 200 days for 3rd party.

I guess the question folks considering chips need to ask themselves is... will third parties deliver faster at 200 days, than BFL itself.  Tough call... I would lean towards third parties.

I personally have no interest in their chips with the current state of information about them and their reference design.

Or it is total BS, which from these guy seems totally likely.

Remember, not one unit of the newer BitForce line has shipped, at all. Just a few Jalepenos so far, which is an older one before that little refresh when it was obvious their first design was flawed.

Now they suddenly can handle additional demand to ship bulk chips too?  

Or, maybe BFL needs a little more funding to buy the chips for the new product lines.

I wonder if there is a respin in progress as well.

[k9quaint]

Forget how little they are making on the Jalapenos.
At $50 per chip (if that's correct) the 1.5 TH/sec mini rig will cost them $26,000 in chips alone to manufacture!

Dude ASICs cost between $0.5 - $2 each to manufacture dependant on volume of chips and intricacy of mask layers.

Explaination of the process BFL's contractors are using for chip production:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-project_wafer_service

They outsource production to a company like this one. Here is their price list:
http://cmp.imag.fr/products/ic/?p=prices

They have not been doing the full mask + full wafer run for hundreds of thousands of chips. They have been getting hundreds of chips each time they did a run, which means they are doing MPW. That means a ballpark price of $40-$60 per chip depending on volume.

[Bugpowder]

It's over folks.  BFL will never deliver units.

[ecliptic]

Just admit you don't know what OrSOC being involved means.

You keep playing the ORSoC card. Will you be giving money to ORSoC for these ASIC miners for which no ASIC exists yet? Will ORSoC pay you back in case you never receive your ASIC miner that doesn't yet exist?

ORSoC will do no such thing. ORSoC is the ODM and will take NO responsibility in the potential fuckups of KNCMINER.

ORSoC is NO GUARANTEE you will ever see your miner.

They formed a partnership WITH ORSoC.  KNC miner is ORSoC

I'm not saying they won't have technical issues or troubles.

But ORSoC is not going to take your money and run

http://orsoc.se/orsoc-and-kncminer-are-partnering-up-to-develop-bitcoin-mining-products/langswitch_lang/en/

[pitan]

What's next? Pre order of the casing? Oh no I'm waiting for them to offer to pre order the whole BFL!
Don't they know the limits? This pre order scheme is getting old and its popping up everywhere now

[mezzomix]

On their site they have quite a few job openings available for those based in the US.

They also offer con-sulting...

Long con-sulting?! 

[KS]

Just admit you don't know what OrSOC being involved means.

You keep playing the ORSoC card. Will you be giving money to ORSoC for these ASIC miners for which no ASIC exists yet? Will ORSoC pay you back in case you never receive your ASIC miner that doesn't yet exist?

ORSoC will do no such thing. ORSoC is the ODM and will take NO responsibility in the potential fuckups of KNCMINER.

ORSoC is NO GUARANTEE you will ever see your miner.

They formed a partnership WITH ORSoC.  KNC miner is ORSoC

I'm not saying they won't have technical issues or troubles.

But ORSoC is not going to take your money and run

http://orsoc.se/orsoc-and-kncminer-are-partnering-up-to-develop-bitcoin-mining-products/langswitch_lang/en/

I think you need a crash course in commercial law.

KNC is NOT ORSoC. A partnership only means they are working on the project together, as in ORSoC is building the rig to the KNC specs.

ORSoC will not be doing business with you.

Move this discussion to the KNC thread if you'd like to pursue your argument.

[CoinHoarder]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

[tvbcof]

The bulk chip idea is a good, if unoriginal, one.  They could reduce the costs down to the point where there is some vague hope that their victims..er...'customers' might eventually receive some hardware.  And there would be some wins for the community at large.

To bad we are talking BFL here so it's nearly certain to be a scam.

Even if their offering of a hot running heat-sink needing chip was of interest, I would not do it unless there was both an escrow with multiple escrow agents needing to sign, and also some sort of a performance bond posted by BFL which was forfeited upon failure to perform.

[KS]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

Not ideal but it's good starting point for the talents out there. Better than trying to figure out everything from scratch.

[smoothie]

Is it OK in the US if those damn assholes sell the basic components of a product I already paid in June 2012 to another customer?! They should burn in hell! 

Considering that's not what they are doing, all you have done is shown your lack of comprehension of a relatively simple product announcement. I suggest you go and read it again, perhaps twice.

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/announcements/3014-butterfly-labs-announces-bulk-chip-sales.html

Uh, they are offering to convert orders to chips orders. So it appears you don't know or don't read...

+1

Erk is another BFL tard. Can't read and can't see a scam when it is glaringly obvious.

[smoothie]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

Not ideal but it's good starting point for the talents out there. Better than trying to figure out everything from scratch.

How do you consider vaporware chips a good starting point?

Only difference with what people have now is they have money. If they order they will have no money and an email saying they have "chips" on their way in 100, 200, 300 days?

dont make me laugh 

[KS]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

Not ideal but it's good starting point for the talents out there. Better than trying to figure out everything from scratch.

How do you consider vaporware chips a good starting point?

Only difference with what people have now is they have money. If they order they will have no money and an email saying they have "chips" on their way in 100, 200, 300 days?

dont make me laugh 

I was referring to the reference design. It's better to start with one than figuring out the chips. (there is no reference design AFAIK though, so it was more of a "generic" comment )

Now, whether BFL delivers is another can of worms.

[smoothie]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

Not ideal but it's good starting point for the talents out there. Better than trying to figure out everything from scratch.

How do you consider vaporware chips a good starting point?

Only difference with what people have now is they have money. If they order they will have no money and an email saying they have "chips" on their way in 100, 200, 300 days?

dont make me laugh 

I was referring to the reference design. It's better to start with one than figuring out the chips. (there is no reference design AFAIK though, so it was more of a "generic" comment )

Now, whether BFL delivers is another can of worms.

even with the reference design how do you really know it works?

We dont.

[KS]

lol @ BFL

What good is BFL releasing a reference design if the reference design is flawed? IE.  power issues/other issues....

"You can buy our chips, but good luck getting them to work!"

Not ideal but it's good starting point for the talents out there. Better than trying to figure out everything from scratch.

How do you consider vaporware chips a good starting point?

Only difference with what people have now is they have money. If they order they will have no money and an email saying they have "chips" on their way in 100, 200, 300 days?

dont make me laugh 

I was referring to the reference design. It's better to start with one than figuring out the chips. (there is no reference design AFAIK though, so it was more of a "generic" comment )

Now, whether BFL delivers is another can of worms.

even with the reference design how do you really know it works?

We dont.

As with every design: make it, test it, change it.

I'm not promoting BFL, if that's your worry, but I would support freelance pcb designers (as I do for the Klondike project).

[Quantus]

I bet they stop shipping jalapenos after they start to ship chips.  

[erk]

I bet they stop shipping jalapenos after they start to ship chips.  

See what Avalon do first.