Butterfly Labs Announces Bulk Chip Sales

[YipYip]

BFL Chips?  I think market is already flooded with Avalon chip orders.  With (almost) open source ref. design.

Why would someone want to buy BFL chips at this point? Do they offer better GH/s/Watt?  

People who wanted to go DYI route have already done so.

Help me understand, what is so compelling about BFL chips that would make me buy few?

BFL chips crap all over Avalon chip, read about them before you post. The market is NOT flooded with Avalon chips, the have not shipped.

STop impersonating an australian...... sock puppet!

The never ending sock puppet army ...int03h ...others + others

They always start slow and then end up sounding exactly the same ...

Funny thing is once they have been used one up we never hear from them again ....strange ?

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[Phinnaeus Gage]

BFL Chips?  I think market is already flooded with Avalon chip orders.  With (almost) open source ref. design.

Why would someone want to buy BFL chips at this point? Do they offer better GH/s/Watt?  

People who wanted to go DYI route have already done so.

Help me understand, what is so compelling about BFL chips that would make me buy few?

BFL chips crap all over Avalon chip, read about them before you post. The market is NOT flooded with Avalon chips, the have not shipped.

STop impersonating an australian...... sock puppet!

The never ending sock puppet army ...int03h ...others + others

They always start slow and then end up sounding exactly the same ...

Funny thing is once they have been used one up we never hear from them again ....strange ?

That's because they go on tour.

[stripykitteh]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

A few who did show interest would only do so if payment was on delivery and nothing up front.

Sanity prevails on bitcointalk

This was always going to be a longshot for them. They are experts at marketing their products to unsophisticated buyers (not pumping up my own tyres, they got me as well). Anyone contemplating buying chips themselves is likely an order of magnitude better informed and would see that the risk of buying BFL chips doesn't justify the premium. Only by shipping all product lines in volume will BFL demostrate that their chip issues are behind them.

It's catch-22. If the chips worked properly they would have had developers begging them to release them. Because the chips don't work very well they need to sell more to get a better volume price. But no one experienced will want to buy chips to help them do that.

[k9quaint]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

A few who did show interest would only do so if payment was on delivery and nothing up front.

Sanity prevails on bitcointalk

This was always going to be a longshot for them. They are experts at marketing their products to unsophisticated buyers (not pumping up my own tyres, they got me as well). Anyone contemplating buying chips themselves is likely an order of magnitude better informed and would see that the risk of buying BFL chips doesn't justify the premium. Only by shipping all product lines in volume will BFL demostrate that their chip issues are behind them.

It's catch-22. If the chips worked properly they would have had developers begging them to release them. Because the chips don't work very well they need to sell more to get a better volume price. But no one experienced will want to buy chips to help them do that.

And the BFL chip performance is only marginally better hash/$ than Avalon's. Why would anyone take that risk?

Price/Performance
BFL: 2600 MH/s for $89 is 29.2 MH/s per $1
Avalon: 280 MH/s for $10 is 28 MH/s per $1

Power efficiency
Avalon: 66,000 MH/s @ 600W 110 MH/w 
BFL: 5200 MH/s @ 35W 148MH/w  (the ars technica box measured 5.2 @ 50W)

[Starlightbreaker]

BFL Chips?  I think market is already flooded with Avalon chip orders.  With (almost) open source ref. design.

Why would someone want to buy BFL chips at this point? Do they offer better GH/s/Watt?  

People who wanted to go DYI route have already done so.

Help me understand, what is so compelling about BFL chips that would make me buy few?

BFL chips crap all over Avalon chip, read about them before you post. The market is NOT flooded with Avalon chips, the have not shipped.

and it'll ship 2 weeks after avalon chip order starts being assembled and/or shipped out.


 

[mgio]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

A few who did show interest would only do so if payment was on delivery and nothing up front.

Sanity prevails on bitcointalk

This was always going to be a longshot for them. They are experts at marketing their products to unsophisticated buyers (not pumping up my own tyres, they got me as well). Anyone contemplating buying chips themselves is likely an order of magnitude better informed and would see that the risk of buying BFL chips doesn't justify the premium. Only by shipping all product lines in volume will BFL demostrate that their chip issues are behind them.

It's catch-22. If the chips worked properly they would have had developers begging them to release them. Because the chips don't work very well they need to sell more to get a better volume price. But no one experienced will want to buy chips to help them do that.

And the BFL chip performance is only marginally better hash/$ than Avalon's. Why would anyone take that risk?

Price/Performance
BFL: 2600 MH/s for $89 is 29.2 MH/s per $1
Avalon: 280 MH/s for $10 is 28 MH/s per $1

Power efficiency
Avalon: 66,000 MH/s @ 600W 110 MH/w 
BFL: 5200 MH/s @ 35W 148MH/w  (the ars technica box measured 5.2 @ 50W)

Yeah, I'm really surprised they didn't offer a significantly better price than Avalon. They are shipping later and they are an unproven technology. I don't see any reason to chose them over Avalon for discrete chips right now.

I think they are going to get very few pre-orders and drop the price significantly in the next few weeks. Or maybe they actually need the money that desperately and will simply go out of business.

It doesn't help that they just angered every so single one of their 60,000 preorder customers which would have been their best market for selling discrete chips.

[tinoki]

BFL Chips?  I think market is already flooded with Avalon chip orders.  With (almost) open source ref. design.

Why would someone want to buy BFL chips at this point? Do they offer better GH/s/Watt?  

People who wanted to go DYI route have already done so.

Help me understand, what is so compelling about BFL chips that would make me buy few?

BFL chips crap all over Avalon chip, read about them before you post. The market is NOT flooded with Avalon chips, the have not shipped.

STop impersonating an australian...... sock puppet!

The never ending sock puppet army ...int03h ...others + others

They always start slow and then end up sounding exactly the same ...

Funny thing is once they have been used one up we never hear from them again ....strange ?

That's because they go on tour.

http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/crossfade/RedHotChiliPeppers2011Tour.jpg

Which one is Josh and Anthony or Steven? or Josh Secretary? 

[Stack]

So they've pissed away all their pre-order money with the assumption that it'd keep on rolling in, so now that avalon has taken their market they've made a half-assed panic offer in response.

Sad! they don't deserve a single chip order! and wouldn't even need to offer it had they just started delivering some decent quantities of product.

[smoothie]

So they've pissed away all their pre-order money with the assumption that it'd keep on rolling in, so now that avalon has taken their market they've made a half-assed panic offer in response.

Sad! they don't deserve a single chip order! and wouldn't even need to offer it had they just started delivering some decent quantities of product.

+1

BFL needs to be gone. Meaning out of business. They have hurt this community and its members much more than any other scam to date.

[mezzomix]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

Only idiots will now pre-order from BFL and pay the order without an escrow.

There is no sign that BFL will start shipping large amounts within the next weeks and months. They are now in a prototype phase and maybe they loose money with every Jalapeno they ship. A poor yield is the only reason I can imagine why only 30 - 40 Jalapenos were shipped since april.

[erk]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

Only idiots will now pre-order from BFL and pay the order without an escrow.

There is no sign that BFL will start shipping large amounts within the next weeks and months. They are now in a prototype phase and maybe they loose money with every Jalapeno they ship. A poor yield is the only reason I can imagine why only 30 - 40 Jalapenos were shipped since april.

The 30 or 40 is at least 100 but don't let me spoil your smear.

http://bfl.ptz.ro/

[intron]

Well it's been over 48 hours, several people have tried starting group buys but as far as I can see not a SINGLE person has commited to SINGLE chip.

Only idiots will now pre-order from BFL and pay the order without an escrow.

There is no sign that BFL will start shipping large amounts within the next weeks and months. They are now in a prototype phase and maybe they loose money with every Jalapeno they ship. A poor yield is the only reason I can imagine why only 30 - 40 Jalapenos were shipped since april.

The 30 or 40 is at least 100 but don't let me spoil your smear.

http://bfl.ptz.ro/

c:\tmp>wc -l bfl_list.txt
   3408

c:\tmp>grep Undelivered bfl_list.txt | wc -l
   3365

Gives 43 happy people

[erk]

c:\tmp>wc -l bfl_list.txt
   3408

c:\tmp>grep Undelivered bfl_list.txt | wc -l
   3365

Gives 43 happy people

You forgot all the ones that haven't registered on that list.

[FCTaiChi]

So... I haven't been paying attention.

Are all the engines equivalent performance, and if so... what is the performance per engine?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=209750

[intron]

c:\tmp>wc -l bfl_list.txt
   3408

c:\tmp>grep Undelivered bfl_list.txt | wc -l
   3365

Gives 43 happy people

You forgot all the ones that haven't registered on that list.

But still, there are 43 happy people...:-)

[YipYip]

c:\tmp>wc -l bfl_list.txt
   3408

c:\tmp>grep Undelivered bfl_list.txt | wc -l
   3365

Gives 43 happy people

You forgot all the ones that haven't registered on that list.

I forgot erk that u have access to all of the delivery documenation.... considering u work for those asshats

erk..josh..bfl_temp..sonny...jody...whoever the fuck u are...u are  not an australian thats for sure !!

[YipYip]

c:\tmp>wc -l bfl_list.txt
   3408

c:\tmp>grep Undelivered bfl_list.txt | wc -l
   3365

Gives 43 happy people

You forgot all the ones that haven't registered on that list.

But still, there are 43 happy people...:-)

43 ... thats extremely impressive......

215g ...i could achieve that with 70 rigs...I have 20 at the moment and another 10 in a week or so

So i am ~50% of the total output of BFL so far after 60000 pre-orders and ~12-14 months of development

It cost me about 40k and these guys on guesstemates have spent in excess of 2-5+million
(maybe u could give us some exact figures erk mac jerk)

These guys are the poster child of FAIL town USA

[SebastianJu]

And the BFL chip performance is only marginally better hash/$ than Avalon's. Why would anyone take that risk?

Price/Performance
BFL: 2600 MH/s for $89 is 29.2 MH/s per $1
Avalon: 280 MH/s for $10 is 28 MH/s per $1

Power efficiency
Avalon: 66,000 MH/s @ 600W 110 MH/w 
BFL: 5200 MH/s @ 35W 148MH/w  (the ars technica box measured 5.2 @ 50W)

This advantage turns negative when taking into account that these chips theoretically arrive 4 to 5 weeks after avalon chips arrive when ordered at the same time. In this time the difficulty grow so much that there is no advantage anymore or even an disadvantage.

[k9quaint]

And the BFL chip performance is only marginally better hash/$ than Avalon's. Why would anyone take that risk?

Price/Performance
BFL: 2600 MH/s for $89 is 29.2 MH/s per $1
Avalon: 280 MH/s for $10 is 28 MH/s per $1

Power efficiency
Avalon: 66,000 MH/s @ 600W 110 MH/w 
BFL: 5200 MH/s @ 35W 148MH/w  (the ars technica box measured 5.2 @ 50W)

This advantage turns negative when taking into account that these chips theoretically arrive 4 to 5 weeks after avalon chips arrive when ordered at the same time. In this time the difficulty grow so much that there is no advantage anymore or even an disadvantage.

If they arrive at all. Avalon has already demonstrated their ability to produce lots of chips that work and actually ship them to customers. I would imagine these chips would earn in a day what they cost in a year in electricity.

[MrTeal]

And the BFL chip performance is only marginally better hash/$ than Avalon's. Why would anyone take that risk?

Price/Performance
BFL: 2600 MH/s for $89 is 29.2 MH/s per $1
Avalon: 280 MH/s for $10 is 28 MH/s per $1

Power efficiency
Avalon: 66,000 MH/s @ 600W 110 MH/w 
BFL: 5200 MH/s @ 35W 148MH/w  (the ars technica box measured 5.2 @ 50W)

This advantage turns negative when taking into account that these chips theoretically arrive 4 to 5 weeks after avalon chips arrive when ordered at the same time. In this time the difficulty grow so much that there is no advantage anymore or even an disadvantage.

The pricing for BFL chips is extremely goofy. The better performing chips are actually cheaper per engine, so until BFL updates their prices there's no reason to purchase anything but Grade A chips.

As for why you would choose the BFL chips over the Avalon ones, I would say that BFL's present more interesting opportunities for board and cooling design. The BFL ASICs consume less power than their Avalon counterparts, and the lower device count per GH simplifies board design. If both were available immediately at the current prices I think it'd be a no-brainer.

The big question for BFL (and Avalon) is whether they can actually deliver on the timelines they've talked about. Both of them have had huge issues with getting production out the door for completed miners, but chips sales should be much simpler. It's been 7 weeks since people started paying for Avalon chip sales now. If Avalon does get their chips out in the next 3 weeks as promised, 3+ months for BFL chips will be hard to justify. If Avalon is late (and they're already 3 weeks late on providing samples), it might be closer.