Bitcoin Forum
April 26, 2024, 07:31:37 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 27.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  

Warning: Moderators do not remove likely scams. You must use your own brain: caveat emptor. Watch out for Ponzi schemes. Do not invest more than you can afford to lose.

Warning: One or more bitcointalk.org users have reported that they strongly believe that the creator of this topic is a scammer. (Login to see the detailed trust ratings.) While the bitcointalk.org administration does not verify such claims, you should proceed with extreme caution.
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 4 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: Attention BMF/NYAN/TU.SILVER investors  (Read 5701 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic.
EskimoBob
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 910
Merit: 1000


Quality Printing Services by Federal Reserve Bank


View Profile
June 09, 2013, 05:02:54 PM
 #21

This spreadsheet is from the days he inflated the NAV and right before he started to delete the posts and his web site pages.

BTW, I actually want this guy to succeed so I can witness a miracle and get me 138-something back Smiley

While reading what I wrote, use the most friendliest and relaxing voice in your head.
BTW, Things in BTC bubble universes are getting ugly....
1714116697
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714116697

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714116697
Reply with quote  #2

1714116697
Report to moderator
1714116697
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714116697

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714116697
Reply with quote  #2

1714116697
Report to moderator
1714116697
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714116697

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714116697
Reply with quote  #2

1714116697
Report to moderator
BitcoinCleanup.com: Learn why Bitcoin isn't bad for the environment
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
1714116697
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714116697

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714116697
Reply with quote  #2

1714116697
Report to moderator
1714116697
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1714116697

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1714116697
Reply with quote  #2

1714116697
Report to moderator
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 09, 2013, 05:23:50 PM
 #22

This spreadsheet is from the days he inflated the NAV and right before he started to delete the posts and his web site pages.

BTW, I actually want this guy to succeed so I can witness a miracle and get me 138-something back Smiley


Well amusingly there's at present a huge fuck up in his spreadsheet where if he sold at anywhere near his supposed BV he'd just be stealing from investors.  I expect him to fix it - it's too obvious for even him to miss for long - but will be interesting to see how long it takes.

Incidentally he's made various claims about me in his thread such as :

  • I lost credibility over my criticisms of TU.SILVER.
  • He pointed out errors in my own accounts.
  • I'm just trolling.

Yet despite all those things being supposedly wrong with me :

  • My bonds (the ones that he accused of being a scam) are the single biggest investment in his list.  And it's not because he can't get rid of them - I've offered to buy them back at full face value (and ANY investor can sell back at 99% of face value any time).
  • He's changing TU.SILVER to pretty much EXACTLY what I've been suggesting all along - seperating the silver from the rest.
  • He offered to pay me to keep the books for BMF AFTER he'd made the criticisms of my securities and after all my comments about TU.SILVER.  (He also offered to pay me to keep the books for TU.SILVER).  I declined both offers to keep the books - I'm not interested in doing that for anyone.

So don't fall into the trap of believing that usagi even THINKS I'm incompetent or dishonest (if he does - and still wanted me to keep his books and chose to invest in me - what would that say about him and his judgement?).

Just to be clear on one more point.  The inconsistencies etc usagi pointed out in my accounts weren't inconsistent or wrong at all.  The problem was primarily his inability to understand how LTC-ATF (denominated in LTC) uses LTC-ATF.B1 (bonds sold with a face value in BTC) to offset BTC denominated liabilities against BTC denominated assets to massively reduce exchange-rate risk.  There's been one error in LTC-ATF's accounts that I'm aware of - and that had no impact on valuation, management fees or anything (a number used to show break-down of assets was accidentally overtyped).  That error was found, fixed and reported by me WITHOUT anyone else having reported it (or, as far as I know) even noticed it.  All his other points were either him not understanding things or asking questions based on numbers he'd plucked from thin air and which appeared nowhere (and which, despite repeated requests, he would never explain the origin of).

On the last point it was as bad as :

Me saying "I have 12 Apples"
Him asking "Why do you have 500 oranges?"
Me saying "I've never mentioned oranges and have 500 of nothing - where do you get the idea that I claim to have 500 oranges?"
Him saying "You still won't explain why you say you have 500 oranges".
Me saying "Just fuck off".

You can read it all the the LTC-ATF.B1 thread (linked by usagi) if you want a laugh.  Having explained how this worked he then repeated questions based on the same lack of understanding in the LTC-ATF thread.  At that point I gave a more comprehensive answer - and the questions stopped.  Presumably by then, even if he still didn't understand it, he'd seen enough to realise that he was wrong.

Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 11, 2013, 03:44:57 AM
 #23

It's not that there is a particularly large amount of money owed. I've shown that the shareholders on BTC-TC, for BMF, are pretty much all paid out (sans about 40 BTC). It's more along the lines that I was forced to shut down BMF by a bunch of trolls. It's not really something you can argue. I was looked into by people like augusto croppo and BCB. It's over btharper. Deprived lied about me. EskimoBob lied about me. Ian Bakewell and BitcoinOZ lied about me in order to steal from me and my companies.

Responding to this here - so as not to derail the BTC-TC thread.

True there isn't much money owed to BMF investors - but they aren't the only investors owed money (Nyan.A are owed rather more - unless the promise to pay them is being forgotten about again).  And that he lost so much that there wasn't a lot to give back isn't exactly something to brag about.

On to the usual misleading comments next.  If you read the quote from usagi you'd get the impression that BCB and and augusto croppo investigated him and found him innocent.  Nowhere have I seen any records on an investigation by Augusto (he did keep spamming "where's the evidence" in a usag-related thread for a while then pronounced usagi innocent).  BCB however DID do an investigation - in a thread specifically made for it.  The thread's locked now - but here's the LAST post in it from him that actually comments on usagi's behaviour (there's one more announcing investigation would be paused for a while).

Can't do proper quoting due to it being a locked thread but will provide link.

Quote from: BCB
usgai does not have time to respond to provide evidence that could make any scam accusations go away (i can only assume becuase providing such information would only further prove his guild)  however he does have the time to open a months old scammer thread to continue this practice of obfuscation and distraction.

Usagi,

It is OBVIOUS that you are not able to or just do now want to clear your name so

PLEASE WIND DOWN YOUR COMPANIES, PAY YOUR INVESTORS BACK AND GO AWAY.

Thank you.

Not exactly what you'd expect to find as his last comments from reading what usagi wrote is it?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.msg1432590#msg1432590

But of course I'm only trolling when I claim usagi tries to mislead.  Right? Maybe that was just an uncharacteristic comment by BCB or is out of context or is poorly written and doesn't represent what he actually believes?  Well no:

   
Quote from: BCB
Usagi is a scammer. Please tag him. Every step of this investigation has show that usagi consistently misrepresented the value of his assets.  This fact has been pointed out again and again by numerous other community members. And when individuals make claims against usagi he makes scammer complaints against them.

Usagi has been caught in lie after lie and he as deleted over 1000 posts to cover up this fact.

Finally when a link in a post could possible disprove or support a claim. Every link that leads back to usagi's website is "not found".

Tell me this: why would usagi delete over 1000 posts AND and entire website that documented his contracts and his asset valuation if ANY of this information could prove he is not guilty of the accusations?

Answer:  because this deleted information proves that's usagi is dishonest liar and incompetent fund manager running a fraudulent investment scheme.

Please tag usagi now and end this fiasco. This would also send a message this this type of fraudulent  activity is not accepted here.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.msg1430313#msg1430313

And that's the view of someone usagi was trying to make you believe had cleared him.  If that's the view of those he thinks support him then is there any real need to even consider what his opponents think?
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 11, 2013, 04:04:22 AM
 #24

Just deleted a response from usagi - didn't bother reading it as about to head to bed.  Reason I delete his posts is simple - if he wanted to discuss things in one thread then his original one was the place.  You can't start a policy of deleting one half of a discussion just because you believe you're right then expect those on the other side to extend to you the courtesy you denied them.

Post in your own thread usagi.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 11, 2013, 04:08:54 AM
 #25

As a show of good faith, until the end of the month I am willing to manually buy back shares at this price on a first-come-first-served basis -- which is what the market would be like if we could trade. Hopefully by that time we will list and I can just place the orders on the exchange like a normal person  Wink

A show of good faith would be paying out Nyan.A as promised.  Good faith is keeping your existing promises - not making new ones.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 07:33:01 AM
 #26

Response to this:

Attention LTC-GLOBAL moderators!

There are just 7 days left to approve BMF before it's listing application will be withdrawn.

Since I began this process, a number of issues have come to light regarding both BMF and the moderation process itself. What I once thought was a very good idea (the LTC-GLOBAL moderation process) has turned into a disaster, primarily due to there being no oversight whatsoever, no standard, and no training for moderators. As a result I sold my own LTC-GLOBAL shares (I was a moderator myself). Ultimately, while my moderation style received a lot of praise by burnside and others, I could not abide by the lack of standard employed by moderators. I think the best moderator right now is odolvlobo. I do not like anonymous moderators. I feel that it is an abuse of power.

In general, LTC-GLOBAL moderators are voting inconsistently and are voting against the best interests of LTC-GLOBAL. Further, at least three LTC-GLOBAL moderators have not yet kept their promise to me to change their vote to YES should I acquiesce to their policy. This message is a plea to those three moderators in particular. On two occasions, at least one moderator has simply changed their vote to a different reason.

1. I was asked to provide identity escrow. I have done so, and the vote was changed to ABSTAIN or NO without offering any additional explanation.
2. I was asked to publish the holdings of BMF. I have done so, and the vote has not been changed from NO to YES yet.
3. I was asked to show that I was dedicated to running BMF and that I had not abandoned it. When I did so, the vote was changed to ABSTAIN or NO without any comment.
4. Someone has voted NO, despite all accusations against me either being proven false, being withdrawn, or (most notably wrt Deprived's 'PSA's) being shown to have been made out of spite or for petty revenge, solely to damage my reputation.
5. Possibly separate (or connected) to the above, two known moderators have refused to answer PM's (sent many months ago) requesting discourse over their votes. (Actually, I do think Carnth responded, but he appeared unwilling to offer any criticism regarding his vote.)

Besides the above, I have made good on personal promises to step in and donate 100s of BTC to BMF and NYAN shareholders.

I have moved all the BMF assets to a separate BTC-TC account and opened the portfolio to public view.

I have shareholder support. Shareholder have voted AGAINST closing BMF and have voted FOR listing with the new contract.

I have resumed paying daily dividends and shown that it is within the capability of BMF to continue the current policy indefinitely. (I have done the same thing with TU.SILVER as well, for the record).

The most frustrating thing about all this is the five moderators who have refused to discuss their NO and/or ABSTAIN votes with me for over six months. This shows extreme negligence on the part of the moderators. Many of the moderators themselves run securities that I heavily invest in both personally and with BMF. Some of them also run securities which would be in competition with BMF.

There are still 7 days left to vote correctly. If you've voted NO or ABSTAIN on BMF, please take a long look at that -- not why you've done so (you have a right to your own decision) -- but why you have refused to give a reason or to allow me to make amends for whatever you feel is wrong with BMF. Yes, as a moderator it is your duty to be tough on new assets, but it is also your duty to be constructive and explain why you have voted NO, and by not doing that you have given BTC-TC a rather poor reputation. Is BTC-TC a place which is fair, or is BTC-TC a place run by a clique who is unfair?

Attention LTC-GLOBAL moderators!

There are just 7 days left to put up with usagii's whining then he'll be out of your hair for good.

Rather than pick holes in every line of his post let's look at what he's actually done.

He posted a public spreadsheet calculating the NAV/U (or Book Value) for BMF.  It was massively wrong - due to a simple error that basically doubled it.  When he became aware he'd made that cock-up (probably from my post in this thread) and found it he then REMOVED the spreadsheet from public view rather than simply correcting it.

In his own thread you'll see his reported NAV/U fall from ~.06 to ~.03 - or you WOULD see it were it not that he deleted various of his own posts as well as those of people pointing it out.  But some evidence still remains of how he couldn't even work out his own NAV/U:

After the 100BTC in assets I've donated to relaunch the fund, the current NAV/U of BMF stands at approximatelty 0.05.

June 13th, 2013: 0.03610483 NAV/U (4,022 outstanding shares).

It was previously quoted even higher but that got deleted.  No doubt my accusation that his NAV/U was wrong is one of the many things I supposedly got wrong or were proven untrue.

Perhaps the best and fairest way to look at how good his reporting is would be to look at his active, running asset - TU.SILVER.  So let's have a look at its NAV/U,

Hmm, I can't.  To look at the accounts I'd have to spend $90 buying a share then give it to him.  Luckily he has weekly reports, so I don't need to see the accounts - and can just look at the NAV/U there.

Hmm, that's strange.  There's no mention in of it in the last few.  In fact the last mention of any NAV/U or similar is in the monthly report at the end of May where it says :

"Internal Calculation of 0.04348010"

Guess it hasn't changed much and that's still around what the NAV/U is.  And there's another clue as to where the price lies in a later post of his:

An example of an un-reasonable price (imo) is 0.033 and 0.099. The people with those orders up should be unlikely to get them filled!

His advice to investors, BTW, is just to guess what the price is - put up an order and if he likes it he'll fill it.  

So over we trot to the Bitfunder order book to pick up some of the shares - we know there should be some for sale as he just got some new silver in.

Hmm - fuck all volume on the Bid side (he long since gave up the pretence that he was going to provide visible liquidity) and on the Ask side:

21    ฿0.09090    
45    ฿0.0910    
700    ฿0.10      

Nothing under .09.  And we know the 700 order is his (check asset lists and noone other that him holds anything near that number) - at a price he himself said was unreasonable not that long ago (and with no news in between to suggest it had suddenly become reasonable).

What's happening here is actually classic usagi.  He tries to sell his shares at well above their value - making sure to either give no information or wrong information to investors.  If some sucker actually buys at that price, that then increases NAV/U and he can either pay it out as dividends or brag about how his trading is making profit.  When all he's really doing is running a near ponzi - where the profit for existing shares come from new sales.

And if the price gets high enough he can then justify using that to buy back personal shares or shares held by his other companies - screwing all other investors.  Which is exactly what happened with nyan/bmf not long before GLBSE died.  He had a spell of price pumping in which he was allegedly buying back shares.  But in practice what happened was the prices were inflated with small trades then the big volume of buybacks were off-exchange ones involving his own companies' holdings in one another (that's when nyan's holdings - supposed to be there to protect nyan.a/b - vanished).  Actual investors who wanted to sell back found there was no way THEY could get to sell at the fake prices.

Don't fall for his whining, lieing and deceit.  NOTHING he does is done in a sraightforward manner - it's ALL about tricking and misleading investors : with one of his favourites being failing to provide information then claiming it isn't his fault if investors paid too much.  When of COURSE it's his fault when he doesn't publish NAV/U or a public list of holdings.  With TU.SILVER the contract says :

"How it works
We calculate the price of silver in bitcoins and add a small markup for shipping and vault storage."

So when you see Asks up and know he's got new silver in stock, then check the BTC address and see it's his, you'd assume the price he was selling at WAS the value of the share + a small markup.  Is it?  Well - I don't know, as he doesn't publish NAV/U.

But if it is NOT a small a markup then he's lieing.
And if it IS a small markup then he really should have, at some stage, told investors the NAV/U had more than doubled since the last report.  I mean - isn't that something they'd like to (and should) know?

Now for the final laugh:

Make no mistake, TU.SILVER is the most trustworthy fund in the entire community, or my name isn't Tsukino Usagi!

The important word here is "or".  So long as the second part is true the first part doesn't have to be (and if you use the exclusive meaning of 'or' the first part has to be untrue).

Is he a character from Sailor Moon?  If not then his name isn't Tsukino Usagi and all doubt should be on the veracity of the first part of the sentence (that TU.SILVER is the most trustworthy fund).

Not sure if this was a conscious attempt to deceive whilst being able to argue that technically what he said was true (i.e. one part of the 'or' was true which makes the whole sentence true).
haveagr8day
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112
Merit: 10


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 10:50:07 AM
Last edit: June 24, 2013, 03:44:00 PM by haveagr8day
 #27

i blieve in usagi

please vote

Please disregard this post. Someone got access to my account last night. Sorry for the inconvenience.

░▒▓█ Coinroll.it - 1% House Edge Dice Game █▓▒░ • Coinroll Thread • *FREE* 100 BTC Raffle
Tips: 14pw9gn35ueAWHvdkesQV298QLPWGBESjs
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:12:36 AM
 #28

I have shareholder support. Shareholder have voted AGAINST closing BMF and have voted FOR listing with the new contract.

The motion's been up for nearly 2 weeks and so far 11.2% of shares have voted Yes on it.

Hardly overwhelming support - main thing it shows is that most just aren't interested in participating in usagi's stupidity, even when they're losing money.

Shareholder support isn't a tiny minority of share voting yes.  It's a clear majority.  Obviously usagi can get that by allocating shares to his other companies and voting himself.  That may well be legitimate in this case - but isn't a basis on which to claim that other shareholders support (or have any interest in) him continuing with the farce.


YES: 169 - NO: 0 - ABSTAIN: 0 - OUTSTANDING: 1513 (169/1513 = 11.2% Approval)

That's usagi's motion status after nearly 2 weeks.  That is NOT shareholder support - it's shareholder apathy.


YES: 281 - NO: 0 - ABSTAIN: 0 - OUTSTANDING: 282 (281/282 = 99.6% Approval)

That's what I got in less than 2 days in last motion I ran.  THAT is shareholder support (just over half the votes were my own shares - they weren't cast until after a majority of others had voted Yes.  Vote would have failed if there'd been any significant number of No votes).
haveagr8day
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112
Merit: 10


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:13:27 AM
Last edit: June 24, 2013, 03:51:00 PM by haveagr8day
 #29

Deprived what is your fund?
Please disregard this post. Someone got access to my account last night. Sorry for the inconvenience.

░▒▓█ Coinroll.it - 1% House Edge Dice Game █▓▒░ • Coinroll Thread • *FREE* 100 BTC Raffle
Tips: 14pw9gn35ueAWHvdkesQV298QLPWGBESjs
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:17:54 AM
 #30

Deprived what is your fund?

https://www.litecoinglobal.com/security/LTC-ATF

That's where the motion I posted results of came from.
haveagr8day
Member
**
Offline Offline

Activity: 112
Merit: 10


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:18:11 AM
Last edit: June 24, 2013, 03:51:10 PM by haveagr8day
 #31

OK but u voted yourself? isn't that cheating

are you acting in the best niterests of yoru shareholders?

Please disregard this post. Someone got access to my account last night. Sorry for the inconvenience.

░▒▓█ Coinroll.it - 1% House Edge Dice Game █▓▒░ • Coinroll Thread • *FREE* 100 BTC Raffle
Tips: 14pw9gn35ueAWHvdkesQV298QLPWGBESjs
ArcticWolf
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 196
Merit: 100



View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:20:20 AM
 #32

OK but u voted yourself? isn't that cheating

are you acting in the best niterests of yoru shareholders?

He waited until the majority of other shareholders had voted yes before casting his votes

https://www.crypto-trade.com/ref/arcticwolf Try CryptoTrade.com, a new exchange for trading Currencies and Securities
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:21:31 AM
 #33

OK but u voted yourself? isn't that cheating

are you acting in the best niterests of yoru shareholders?

Not sure who's sockpuppet troll you are - but go back to trolling the lending forums and trying to buy feedback.  Further posts of yours will be deleted.

For anyone interested just look at his posting history - he's spamming like mad trying to build up post count.
usagi
VIP
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 812
Merit: 1000


13


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:24:32 AM
 #34

OK but u voted yourself? isn't that cheating

are you acting in the best niterests of yoru shareholders?

He waited until the majority of other shareholders had voted yes before casting his votes

The issue he is raising is quorum. He's attacking me because of the small number of shares which voted (and I did not vote with any shares under my control) while using as evidence a vote he took where he voted using his own shares.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:29:41 AM
 #35

OK but u voted yourself? isn't that cheating

are you acting in the best niterests of yoru shareholders?

He waited until the majority of other shareholders had voted yes before casting his votes

The issue he is raising is quorum. He's attacking me because of the small number of shares which voted (and I did not vote with any shares under my control) while using as evidence a vote he took where he voted using his own shares.

The issue I'm raising is that you claim to have the support of shareholders when you only actually have the support of 11% of shareholders excluding yourself.

In the vote of mine I quoted I had the support of all but 1 shareholder (who held a single share and wasn't around in the 2 days the vote ran for).  Whenever I run votes I only vote late with my own shares - and will vote NO if there's any significant votes against.  I also then offer to buy back any shares anyone wants to sell at over NAV/U for a week or two.

My point wasn't that you couldn't pass the motion - you could, by allocating your own shares and voting (and with no NO votes that would certainly be legitimate).  My point WAS that it was typical deception by you claiming shareholder support when you only had support from a small minority of shareholders.  11% voted yes, the other 89% couldn't be bothered to even vote at all - THAT's how keen and eager their support is.

Shareholders is not the same thing as shares.

If one person holds 90% of shares and 10 others hold 1% each and then in a vote the 90% votes yes and the other 10 all vote no :

It's TRUE to say a majority of shares voted yes.
It's true to say the motion was passed by 90% to 10%.
It's a LIE to say a majority of shareholders voted yes - under 10% did.
And if you were the 90% it would be a LIE to say you had the support of shareholders - truth would be you bludgeoned the motion through whilst opposed by ALL other shareholders with zero support other than yourself.

The above example is slightly worse than the BMF situation - just trying to illustrate the point.

You tried claiming your investors supported you, but the truth is the only way you can pass a vote is with your own majority of shares which almost certainly means only a minority of shareholders supported it (unless all the shares that didn't vote are held by a few people - which seems unlikely).
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 11:41:23 AM
 #36

I can't work out whether haveagr8day is trolling to genuinely try to support usagi or trolling to try to harm usagi by being seen as representative of the standard of those supporting usagi's continued fumblings.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 04:44:35 PM
 #37

Appears he now actually DOES have enough YES votes - which in no way alters the fact that he didn't when he made his post earlier.  And of course doesn't make him any more (un)fit to run a company than was the case earlier.

You'll note that he repeatedly accuses me of lying - yet doesn't point out what the lies are.  So, for example, with Nyan my claim (ignoring the details) was:

Nyan had significant holdings,
Nyan's holdings were contractually committed to back Nyan.a/b
Usagi sold all those holdings and the proceeds didn't go to Nyan.a/b

Which part of that is supposedly the lie?  It can all be established as fact.

In respect of Nyan.a :

He personally promised (early this year) to fully repay Nyan.a its 1 BTC
He ceased making any effort to do so after a few desultory dividends
He then denied having made the commitment at all (a lie he's no longer telling - yet)
He threatened not to keep his word at all if BMF wasn't approved

Any of those a lie?

etc.
usagi
VIP
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 812
Merit: 1000


13


View Profile
June 24, 2013, 05:44:54 PM
 #38

Appears he now actually DOES have enough YES votes - which in no way alters the fact that he didn't when he made his post earlier.  And of course doesn't make him any more (un)fit to run a company than was the case earlier.

You'll note that he repeatedly accuses me of lying - yet doesn't point out what the lies are.  So, for example, with Nyan my claim (ignoring the details) was:

Nyan had significant holdings,
Nyan's holdings were contractually committed to back Nyan.a/b
Usagi sold all those holdings and the proceeds didn't go to Nyan.a/b

Which part of that is supposedly the lie?  It can all be established as fact.

In respect of Nyan.a :

He personally promised (early this year) to fully repay Nyan.a its 1 BTC
He ceased making any effort to do so after a few desultory dividends
He then denied having made the commitment at all (a lie he's no longer telling - yet)
He threatened not to keep his word at all if BMF wasn't approved

Any of those a lie?

etc.

Yes, the statements of fact you made were lies, except that I did in fact promise to repay NYAN.A holders their 1 BTC. And despite you continuously claiming I've renegged on that, in every single communication I've had with shareholders I have reaffirmed my committments. And I have not just talked, I have done so, returning my own personal shares (over 900 shares) and donating hundreds of BTC and thousands of dollars towards this. Because I have honor, unlike you.

The proceeds from the sale of shares went directly to the shareholders, for example. This is published and on the forums for months. It was linked to you several times. You were the one, in fact, who suggested the liquidation auction -- which I ran despite a shareholder vote saying my shareholders did not want me to do this. It severely crippled BMF, but I did it because you said you would promise to help me get listed. A promise you broke almost immediately when you resumed attacking me and claiming there was no list of assets.

I also didn't deny making any commitment, quote me. What I said is I am not contractually obliged to step in and cover NYAN.A personally, which is a truth.
And no, I do not have to donate hundreds of BTC to BMF -- a separate company from NYAN -- whether it lists or not. I've already given back over 400 BTC to BMF considering the personal shares I donated and the assets I've given it recently. I donated those assets and my shares because I wanted people to know I was serious about doing something beautiful in this community. It's really sick that you would try to stop me from doing that.

You're just an asshole doing everything you can to prevent me from listing because you don't like me personally.

You let your personal emotions get tangled up in your business and you fucked up, you started lying about me, and you lost a lot of credibility because of that. Don't you get it? All of my shareholders (last I checked) want the company up and trading. They are the ones holding the bag, not you, so what do you care?

You care because if BMF lists it will compete with your funds and you know that I am a far, far better asset manager than you. Given the choice between something like DMS and a company which accretes value with a manager who has a history of stepping in and protecting shareholders, you don't stand a chance.

Go ahead and delete the post, Deprived. It's all you have left.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 25, 2013, 01:43:17 AM
 #39

The proceeds from the sale of shares went directly to the shareholders, for example. This is published and on the forums for months. It was linked to you several times. You were the one, in fact, who suggested the liquidation auction -- which I ran despite a shareholder vote saying my shareholders did not want me to do this. It severely crippled BMF, but I did it because you said you would promise to help me get listed. A promise you broke almost immediately when you resumed attacking me and claiming there was no list of assets.

Usagi deliberately misunderstanding what was said - as usual.

I referred to the holdings of NYAN - NOT nyan.a/b/c.  The auction has nothing to do with NYAN (that's the parent company) - the assets of that had long since vanished (before GLBSE even went down).

A whole paragraph arguing against a claim I didn't even make.  YOU may want to conveniently forget that NYAN had assets that were stripped off removing cover from nyan.a/b, but it doesn't alter the fact that it happened.
Deprived (OP)
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532
Merit: 500


View Profile
June 25, 2013, 01:49:43 AM
 #40

I also didn't deny making any commitment, quote me. What I said is I am not contractually obliged to step in and cover NYAN.A personally, which is a truth.

Sure - here's the quote where you deny promising to repay it (not just that you weren't contractually comitted).  Specifically you accused ME of lieing when I said you'd promised to personally repay it.  Something you now accept is the truth.

NYAN.A: You promised to repay this in full personally.

Another lie. It was insured by CPA. There's a big difference. What I actually said has been posted on the forums since pretty much November.

You pile lies on top of lies - then lie about having lied.
Pages: « 1 [2] 3 4 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!