[CLOSED] 100 KnC Jupiter 1-500

[zefir]

Updates
2013-07-03: KnC confirmed that our order is at the front of the queue
2013-06-10: 24 Jupters ordered and paid
2013-06-09: Phase one timed up, group buy failed; check here for further processing
2013-06-09: Price adaptation due to BTC/fiat exchange rate drop: 70 -> 80 BTC
2013-06-08: Order will be changed for Device Hosting

Ok, I know I am late with this, but I needed first to get some confidence that KnC is serious.

About
I placed my order for 100 KnC mining devices with some unproductive coins in April the day before BTC reached ATH of $266 and plumped down to $50. With the current exchange rate and the modified product, I am obviously not going to buy all of those 100 units, but maybe 20 or so. Therefore I offer to everyone who believes in KnC's plans to participate in this group buy.

I checked that I am in fact still in the 1-500 group and entitled for the early products over their order page:

On top of the $713.5k I'll have to pay 10% Swiss VAT and custom handling fees to be paid to courier - so this group buy has a volume of ~$0.8M.

What
I am offering a participation in this group buy that guarantees to get your Jupiter from within the first 500 units shipped. If you already ordered yours or traded your place from some other early bird, this is not for you.

Also, this is not for you if you want to trade a position in the pre-order queue: the devices will be shipped to Switzerland first and then either forwarded to your address or kept ready for a local pickup.

If you are interested, you agree that my role in this process is limited to act as organizer and proxy. I am not in any way liable for failures of 3rd party - this is especially relevant when it comes to KnC and their ability to keep their promised performance and schedule. Do your due diligence, look at the past stories of ASIC products deployment and perform your own risk analysis.

If you decide to order, you agree with this and accept that my responsibility is limited to the bare proxy functionality, i.e. it starts with the devices being delivered to me and ends when they are picked up by the parcel service (or when you pick them up in person).

How
There are only three days left to complete the payment for the reserved units, and since this is an all-or-nothing order (see below: Why), I need to collect money fast and collect lots of it.

Blockchain based Accounting
I am going to use a blockchain based registration and payment scheme that proved itself when I collected the funds for Avalon ASIC chip distribution. It is based on two key factors:

• you vote / register with sending coins from an address you control to a common address
• you remain anonymous until the point where you want to claim what you paid for by signing with the address you paid from

In consequence, for participating in the following process, it is absolutely necessary that you a) send from an address you control and can sign with (no MtGox, pool address, etc.), and b) you don't delete the related address until this deal is finalized. If your wallet does not allow you to specify from which address to send, you need to be able to sign at least with one of the inputs.

The great deal with this process is that there is no need for additional accounting - the blockchain is our indisputable process log. Note: when it comes to payment ordering (who paid first), the order is given by the block the payment was first confirmed.

Step one: Gather Interest
Before I start collecting coins, I need to check if there is enough interest for the full order (I am not going to do a partial buy). For this step, for the number of Jupiters you want to buy, you send 1 BTC to the common address 1EqJmgTZkiA5u7FaJmbiK9otznpx3G5Qha (i.e. if you want to buy 3, you send 3 BTC there). The first 20 coins represent the 20 Jupiters I am going to order for myself.

I will let this reservation window open until 2013-06-09T18:00Z (this Sunday, 18:00 GMT). If the address reaches a balance of at least 100 coins, I'll start with the funding phase (see below). You do not need to ask if there are devices left - just check the address balance and you know. Also, I will refund all over-payments, so you might want to show your interest even if there are already 100+ registered - in case someone changes his mind you might get in line.

Please note: the coins paid in this phase are

• fully refunded if you overpaid (i.e. didn't make it into the 100 first to get a device)
• fully refunded if we do not collect enough to buy it in full
• not refunded if you change your mind after registration and would be entitled to buy the device(s)

The last point is to prevent people from fake registering and preventing serious takers from joining. Also, it obviously causes quite some work at my side if done with malicious intent.

Step two: Collect Funding
In case there are enough adventurous followers joining, I will start collecting the funds for the order. The process will be the same as for the registration phase above, only the address will change to 1EW13ao9f6nFh51NrdKjLH1DTCgBbcFKH9. Based on the current BTC rate, I will collect 70 BTC for each Jupiter. Again, the first 1400 coins in this address are for my own 20 devices.

The payment window for the final funds will be open for 24h. If your registration was serious before, you should already be prepared to have them ready for transfer from the same address you send your registration coins from by then. I will need to pay the order on Monday, so those who did not pay by then will be replaced by the moving up ones.

Please note: since the prices are denominated in fiat but paid in BTC, there will be an adjustment of the final price to be paid based on exchange rate. That is, if the BTC/fiat exchange rate rises until payment, you will get something back, if it drops, you will need to add some more. In any case, you will pay the exact same price that I will be charged for.

In this phase, coins are

• not refundable once the payment was made
• fully refunded if we do not collect enough for the full order
• fully refunded if KnC refuses the order for any reason

After Sales
Please note that once the devices are ordered and you registered your shipping address, it can not be changed after. This is important to keep in mind, because nearly everywhere people start to trade ordered mining rig long before they got it delivered. I will not be able to support this, so those who want to trade need to organize it privately.

When
Registration window opens effective immediately and closes 2013-06-09T18:00Z.

Funding window opens as soon as there are interests for 100 devices, but no later than 2013-06-09T18:00Z. If the threshold is not reached, the order will not be placed and all funds are returned to sender.

Why
As you noticed, I am not asking for any premium, commissions or other charges - you basically will pay the exact same amount that you would pay if you place yourself a 1-500 order. I am doing this because I am generally a nice guy , but my main motivation is a promised discount given by KnC personally if I buy all the 100 devices.

That is why this is an all-or-nothing deal. And this is also why I reserve the right to abandon the group buy in case KnC refuses to keep their promise. You for sure can imagine that handling this amount of orders is a PITA workload to do, and you for sure understand why I can't do this for free.

Who
Whom are you going to send millions for a naked promise? Well, I won't keep the coins for long and move them to KnC. As initially stated, it is solely your decision to trust this company, but if you are still reading, you maybe made up your mind. Then of course there is a risk of me taking all 100 Jupiters and run with them. While there are various logistical problems for the practical implementation with that, I reached some level in the Bitcoin world that allows me make a better living the regular way than with anything I could potentially pull out of this stunt.

You can check some of my references from my forum signature, here are some I want to link directly:

• sold 5000 ASICMINER shares some months ago
• have an ASICMINER board seat
• have organized the Avalon ASIC chip distribution for DIY folks, proxied 5k+ coins to Avalon
• supplying Europe with BTC (check my LocalBitcoins profile)

Communication
I live in Switzerland and check forum and mail at least twice a day. Please be patient if you do not get your request responded immediately, most probably it is because you are living in the wrong time-zone or I got some RL things to do.



That's all. Good Luck.
zefir

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[redcomet]

Well this looks fun - a 100 unit order.

I assume we would pay shipping after you receive the units?

Would you foresee any problems shipping to the US?

I have been sitting on the fence about KNC, but this seems like a good deal.

I'll send 1 btc over once I get it from my exchange.

EDIT:
At current rates 1 jupiter would be 64 btc - can you list what all the 70 btc covers exactly?


EDIT 2:

Address 13vEmRoo8beAfdLc9ELw8GGAH3WTYgoEg4
TX 3168a43ef4f41aab893a5c66ba7a0b1aad79b9354cde8b3e1e40e8aefaf5c457

[zefir]

Well this looks fun - a 100 unit order.

I assume we would pay shipping after you receive the units?

Would you foresee any problems shipping to the US?

I have been sitting on the fence about KNC, but this seems like a good deal.

I'll send 1 btc over once I get it from my exchange.

EDIT:
At current rates 1 jupiter would be 64 btc - can you list what all the 70 btc covers exactly?

Generally, shipping will be handled the way buyer wants, i.e. he decides the courier of choice, insurance, economy / express, etc. Obviously problems with shipping are outside of my control, i.e. if someone asks his device to be shipped to Syria, I won't refuse but also won't take responsibility.

As for the price: exchange rate got a little bit volatile recently, so risk is high it to be lower on Monday. But as described, you are going to pay exactly what I am charged for (BitPay total / 100 per unit). The delta is returned to sender.

[logicbomb666]

i'm way too poor for this proposition.  Good luck raising funds!

[Bitcoinorama]

How the...?! You have a hundred unit preorder in the first 500 orders??

[newmars]

a $10k+ shipping cost  

[FCTaiChi]

I agree plasmoske.  Though, if I had disposable income and wanted to take some risk, I'd love to buy a couple of these.  I hope everyone is careful, and checks all the details before they buy, though.

[zefir]

How the...?! You have a hundred unit preorder in the first 500 orders??

As written in OP, when KnC first announced, their products were priced somewhere at $3k. with a exchange rate of $200+, 100 units totaled at 1.5k BTC - thats the amount I am still putting at risk.

Wasn't it like 3 per order for people in the 1-500 group?

Anyhow if it turns out KNC is not going to be able to deliver, there's going to be a whole lot of fucked up people who will be in debt/bankrupt.

Too many stupid people getting ASIC mania these past few months.

The 3 unit limit was not there when I pre-ordered. It might have been introduced lately, but from the order system I am able to checkout all 100 (see screenshot in OP).

Yes, this is risky. I guess KnC collected already several millions, and it will be a sad day for the community if they fail - which is btw the case for all other ASIC manufacturers.

[Mabsark]

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

[Adamlm]

What about making a group buy for 5-10 Jupiters with hosting at KNC (or at your place) and dividing each device to 5-10 shares? I think many members would be interested. I know there many group buys like this but not every OP of these is as trustworthy as you

[Franktank]

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

Would you be willing to provide the option of KnC hosting the device? That seems to be a deciding factor for some.

[zefir]

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

Would you be willing to provide the option of KnC hosting the device? That seems to be a deciding factor for some.

There is not much information about hosting so far, but since KnC offers to change your mind and ship devices you initially ordered for hosting, I am fine with this.

Update: Device Hosting
Since several users approached me with their preference for hosting instead of shipping Jupiter units, and since KnC allows devices ordered for hosting to be changed to ship afterwards, if we make it to order I will do with all devices ordered for hosting and change it to shipping in a later step.

[2weiX]

+2

https://blockchain.info/de/tx/2e48ac8ac6118ab3e186f5a3e925b75ece95fba45591a3e281dbe9184cfbb718
https://blockchain.info/de/tx/a2f99c3655905df26cbbc2b91bd010def81b24f5754ab367b20a69713551d4a0

should this go through, I would work towards changing my two existing Saturn orders into these two here.

[Charles999]

Hi,

In my group buy, I am hosting it in southern california at a datacenter.  Please check the group buy for more info.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=228700.new#new

Thanks

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

Would you be willing to provide the option of KnC hosting the device? That seems to be a deciding factor for some.

[600watt]

wow.

[Franktank]

+1

TxID: https://blockchain.info/tx/966f38ee15e7c9bbba55d7b6f7ff3c9e9ce4a1c117d5ea3585b04ccf13033013

[pitchbend]

Zefir can you specify your pre-order number for this devices? or at least what range it was?

How the...?! You have a hundred unit preorder in the first 500 orders??

As written in OP, when KnC first announced, their products were priced somewhere at k. with a exchange rate of +, 100 units totaled at 1.5k BTC - thats the amount I am still putting at risk.

Wasn't it like 3 per order for people in the 1-500 group?

Anyhow if it turns out KNC is not going to be able to deliver, there's going to be a whole lot of fucked up people who will be in debt/bankrupt.

Too many stupid people getting ASIC mania these past few months.

The 3 unit limit was not there when I pre-ordered. It might have been introduced lately, but from the order system I am able to checkout all 100 (see screenshot in OP).

Yes, this is risky. I guess KnC collected already several millions, and it will be a sad day for the community if they fail - which is btw the case for all other ASIC manufacturers.

[zefir]

Zefir can you specify your pre-order number for this devices? or at least what range it was?

Hm, I'm still unclear if there was an order number at all and if it is of any relevance for the real ordering now.

Anyhow, all I got when I pre-ordered was an email including this lines

Code:

Order ID: 192

The desired goods: KNC Bitcoin miner numbers 1-500

Quantity: 100

Is this what you are asking for?

[Ente]

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

Would you be willing to provide the option of KnC hosting the device? That seems to be a deciding factor for some.

There is not much information about hosting so far, but since KnC offers to change your mind and ship devices you initially ordered for hosting, I am fine with this.

Update: Device Hosting
Since several users approached me with their preference for hosting instead of shipping Jupiter units, and since KnC allows devices ordered for hosting to be changed to ship afterwards, if we make it to order I will do with all devices ordered for hosting and change it to shipping in a later step.

Does that mean its either "all 100 are shipped" or "all 100 are hosted"?
Or, hopefully, you may tell them to host 47 and have the 53 others shipped to you?

And, just so that I don't miss anything in the hundreds of other pages:
- the first 500 orders (or ordered devices?) may pay the full sum now to be the first ones delivered
- after the first 500 it's first-pay-first-receive
- they want to have shipped by the end of september


Ente

[zefir]

Is there any sort of discount for those wanting KnC to host it?

Would you be willing to provide the option of KnC hosting the device? That seems to be a deciding factor for some.

There is not much information about hosting so far, but since KnC offers to change your mind and ship devices you initially ordered for hosting, I am fine with this.

Update: Device Hosting
Since several users approached me with their preference for hosting instead of shipping Jupiter units, and since KnC allows devices ordered for hosting to be changed to ship afterwards, if we make it to order I will do with all devices ordered for hosting and change it to shipping in a later step.

Does that mean its either "all 100 are shipped" or "all 100 are hosted"?
Or, hopefully, you may tell them to host 47 and have the 53 others shipped to you?

And, just so that I don't miss anything in the hundreds of other pages:
- the first 500 orders (or ordered devices?) may pay the full sum now to be the first ones delivered
- after the first 500 it's first-pay-first-receive
- they want to have shipped by the end of september


Ente

The exact ToS for hosting are not yet finalized, the most recent information is from https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-12

I expect and will let KnC confirm that it will be possible to leave some devices hosted and ship the others on demand.

After all, they are interested to get funding for their chips, there is no reasonable incentive to refuse giving us such a choice.

This would impose two additional advantages

• the shipping costs do not need to be paid upfront
• we might reach an agreement to send those units to buyers who want to have them at home directly, instead of proxying them over Switzerland

If this group buy reaches the required threshold by tomorrow (which right now does not look like), I will clarify these open points before I start collecting the final funds.

EDIT: forgot to address the other points

As for

- the first 500 orders (or ordered devices?) may pay the full sum now to be the first ones delivered
- after the first 500 it's first-pay-first-receive
- they want to have shipped by the end of september

This group buy assumes and makes only sense if the pre-orders are kept in front of the queue (which is what KnC approved several times). If it turned out do be handled differently, I will not order and funds are returned to sender.