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Author Topic: Raspberry Coins - Cyclone V - 28nm based FPGA miner  (Read 8242 times)
tony_357 (OP)
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June 11, 2013, 02:03:36 AM
 #1

Greetings,

we've designed a Bitcoin miner based on a dual Cyclone V (28 nm) FPGA card, which is configured by, controlled and communicates with a Raspberry Pi (credit card sized Linux computer).  The FPGA card consists of two Cyclone V A9 components (each contains 301K logic cells, for a total of 602K logic cells per FPGA card).  A single Raspberry Pi can work with up to 4 FPGA cards, and each Raspberry Pi system may be networked via ethernet.

The advantages of this system are :
- high performance  (we're looking at about 950-1250 MHash/sec/FPGA card depending on speed grade, PLL settings, etc.)
- low power (Altera claims Cyclone V - 28 nm technology to consume 40% less power than 65 nm technology)
 (Xilinx Spartan 6 - LX150 is 65 nm technology)
- reconfigurable, unlike ASIC's, FPGA's may be reused for other purposes if desired
 (ie: we have not yet tried Litecoin mining with this platform, but we are very interested in what performance could be achieved in that area).
- small size  (each FPGA card is about 3.5 inches x 2.2 inches (89mm x 56mm))
 (a 4 FPGA card unit (8 FPGA's total about 4-5 GHash/sec) is about 5.5 inches x 4.5 inches x 6.5 inches

Since we announced the project, we've received a great deal of interest from the Bitcoin community, and it quickly became apparent that there was a strong demand for this product.  As a result, in about the last month I've personally been meeting with suppliers, distributers, and manufacturers to see if I can manufacture this product, and it looks like we now have all the pieces in place to start a manufacturing run.

The hardest part was to secure significant quantity of FPGA's to meet demand (as gauged by people who registered interest).  We have a great deal of interest, and I don't believe we have enough FPGA to meet everyone's total demand in a single production run.  As a result, I've been rather quiet about saying anything  (I don't want to generate interest if I cannot deliver).  I have been working with Altera and Arrow and numerous personal contacts in Silicon Valley (that's where we are physically located) to obtain FPGA's in quantity.  I believe that I can obtain (in a reasonably short time) about 300 Cyclone V A9 FPGA's.  This is enough to make 150 FPGA cards. I believe that I can secure additional FPGA's for a second production run (I'm still working to get availability and timing on the second run).

To be honest, I was planning to send this email out a little later after I got everything neatly tied up in a bow and perfect, however, it has been very difficult to obtain these FPGA's in quantity.  Altera has other customers who also want these chips.  I have recently received an email indicating that they would like a PO order, or they may have to release these parts to other customers. As a result, I need to start the crowd-funding campaign to purchase these components sooner than I anticipated.

The end result, is that we are opening our web store a little sooner than I would like. 

The crowd funding site will be open on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 9:00 AM Pacific Time.  Units will be reserved on a first-come-first-serve basis.  (I know that this is short notice, but it does provide enough time that everyone will have a chance to read the email, and get an equal chance to be in the first production run). 

The web site for the crowd funding is : http://www.raspberrycoins.com/shop.
Details of how crowd-funding works is at : http://www.raspberrycoins.com/funding.

The first production run is for 150 FPGA cards.  The product (a single unit) consists of one or more FPGA cards (up to 4), a Raspberry Pi (to configure, control, and monitor up to four FPGA cards), power supply cards for the FPGA cards, and miscellaneous parts for the Raspberry Pi to operate (pre-loaded SD cards, USB cables, various cables, external 12V computer power supply, etc), detailed instructions for usage.  Several units may be connected together via ethernet.  Each unit will require a little bit of assembly (screwing together the enclosure, connecting the cables, configuring jumpers, installing the SD card. etc.), and instructions will be provided.  (If you desire pre-assembled units, send me an email, and I'm sure we can work something out).

I expect it will take about 3-6 weeks to manufacture, test, and ship out this product.  Standard shipping within the US will be 3-5 business days, please contact us if you would like expedited shipping.  Expedited shipping does not result in expedited manufacturing.  We will keep everyone informed of the status of this manufacturing run as it progresses.

The second production run will commence immediately following the first run, depending on lead times for the Cyclone V FPGA.  I will personally ensure that everyone is informed of the status of this run (and any additional runs we do) as well.

There will be additional production runs as long as there is sufficient demand, and I am able to secure FPGA's.  This entire operation is possible only because of your support, so I will work to ensure that it is as transparent as possible.  Lots of companies make products, but the ones which stand out are the ones which provide excellent customer service - so that is what I will attempt to do with Raspberry Coins.  (I believe that if you are really happy with our product, you will buy more, and/or tell your friends, so I also believe this practice is also good business).

Even after units have shipped, we intend to continue working on optimizing the FPGA design.  There are also some experiments I would like to run on Cyclone V with regards to cooling, tolerances, and clock rates.  If we come up with something better, we will release a new configuration bitstream, and you will have a more effective miner.

I hope to make a product that will exceed your expectations.
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June 11, 2013, 02:08:58 AM
 #2

Reserved for flaming

Edit: You were going so well until you got to the 'crowdfunding' bit. Oh, and the "3-6 weeks bit". If you were actually controlling/planning the project you'd have a more concrete time more than +/- 25%

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June 11, 2013, 02:17:00 AM
 #3

His post count beats mine  Grin
tony_357 (OP)
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June 11, 2013, 02:24:51 AM
 #4

I'll be meeting with additional manufacturers tomorrow in Fremont, CA.  We have one or two lined up, and I'll be evaluating quality.  If you have any recommendations (ie: had good experience with) for manufacturers in the Silicon Valley area, I'm willing check them out.  (Keeping things local provides a number of advantages).

The 3-6 weeks is just in case we have a delay in FPGA's shipping, or anything else in the manufacturing run.  If everything works out right, it could be faster, but I want to "sandbag" a little so that I can exceed expectations.
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June 11, 2013, 03:22:58 AM
 #5

How do you intend to compete with asics on the market?

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turtle83
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June 11, 2013, 03:25:51 AM
 #6

Don't you think ~10 BTC for ~1 GH/s is a little steep?

Considering i can get 3 of those ASICMINER usb dongles for ~7 BTC which does ~1 GH/s and probably use a lot less power... < 10W including hubs and a pi to mine them with. And this i can get in ~3 days in my hands to mine with.

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June 11, 2013, 03:36:53 AM
Last edit: June 11, 2013, 04:03:35 AM by jasinlee
 #7

What is your lead time if you can get them?

http://www.wattminderinstruments.com/enclosure

This site has a similar favicon and has the products pictured, is this your parent company?

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tony_357 (OP)
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June 11, 2013, 04:04:16 AM
 #8

What is your lead time if you can get them?

I believe (through personal connections) that I can get enough for 150 boards (300 FPGA's) in a production run, however my distributor and Altera cannot hold this amount for me for much longer without a PO.  As a result, we're doing this crowd funding proposition.  I should be able to get some more for a second production run a little later.

FYI : the standard lead time from all distributors will be "out of stock - 19 week lead time" (for the Cyclone V A9's).  (If you know of anyone who has a shorter lead time, let me know, and I'll immediately look into it).  It's only because I used to work at Altera a while back, and via various personal contacts that I'm able to find these chips a bit sooner.  (They have other customers trying to get these chips as well).

Tony

As an aside, when I went to distributors to describe what we were doing, there appeared to be a fair amount of personal interest in Bitcoin (mostly everyone there had not heard of it), and more than a few started to investigate this topic on their own.
tony_357 (OP)
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June 11, 2013, 04:26:57 AM
 #9

What is your lead time if you can get them?

http://www.wattminderinstruments.com/enclosure

This site has a similar favicon and has the products pictured, is this your parent company?

Yup - I'm Tony.

I discovered the Raspberry Pi at Wattminder Instruments.  The enclosure is similar (the mounting holes are in different locations, as this is a slightly bigger board).  I friend of mine called me up, about putting together a Bitcoin miner for him (he could not find miners at the time).  I mentioned it to Wattminder Instruments (several times), but management did not want to pursue Bitcoin related activities.  As a result, I and some other guys decided to do this separate from Wattminder Instruments.

You may have met me at a Stanford VLAB event and asked if I was at Wattminder Instruments or at Raspberry Coins.  I do both.  I'm VP Special Projects at Wattminder Instruments, and will continue to represent them in this role (as long as they want me to - I believe in the Wattminder Instruments goals).  I'm also CEO of Raspberry Coins.

Raspberry Coins is a company which is dedicated to making Bitcoin mining hardware, and exploring Litecoin mining as well.  I also believe that Bitcoin can do a great deal of good in the world - (ie: helping people in nations like Argentina escape from the ravages of runaway inflation, etc.), so as a result, I'm a supporter of Bitcoin, and Bitcoin related technologies.  (BTW: I'll be promoting a Stanford VLAB event in Silicon Valley coming up on June 18th (we'll try to have a little demo board there for display), once we get our VLAB marketing finalized - if you're in the Silicon Valley area, try to reserve the date - it should be interesting).

Long story short, we're two different companies - with two different goals.  The only thing similar is that we both use a Raspberry Pi, and a similar enclosure  (Since the enclosure is basically two acrylic sheets, and there are similar Raspberry Pi enclosures, there is nothing proprietary about the enclosure).
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June 11, 2013, 04:49:27 AM
 #10

I hope this project has enough support. I'm pretty interested in these.
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June 11, 2013, 05:56:13 AM
 #11

those prices are a rip in the ass. good luck with your venture. Ever heard of a bank or credit? schmuck!
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June 11, 2013, 06:20:06 AM
 #12

I like the concept. The hash per dollar is painful, though.
tony_357 (OP)
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June 11, 2013, 06:37:17 AM
 #13

How do you intend to compete with asics on the market?

In the same way that FPGA's have always competed with ASIC's - time to market + flexibiltiy

An ASIC can provide significantly cheaper cost of production for volume quantities than FPGA's.

However, ASIC technology requires significantly more resources and verification than FPGA's (where the underlying digital logic is already pre-verified (ie: DFT/DFM, scan chain insertion, etc.) ).  This brings time-to-market concerns for ASIC technology - and in the case of Bitcoin mining - time = money (or difficulty level).  If you are able to obtain an ASIC in quantity early and in sufficient quantities, then you could do quite well with an ASIC (as far as mining goes).  (ie: you've got the only ASIC miners, and everyone else is using slower technology).

If everyone has the same ASIC technology, then you need faster ASIC technology than anyone else out there to make any inroads - which again requires significant time and resources.

Everyone has compared 65 nm technology FPGA's vs 65 nm technology ASIC.  However, we plan to utilize 28 nm technology FPGA technology, and if we obtain any volume production, then we can get a price decrease, which means we drop our prices.

Altera has recently announced 20nm and 14nm technology products (for mid-range Aria and high-end Stratix lines).  The 28nm Cyclone V was announced in 2011.  Altera announced Cyclone IV in 2009.  Cyclone III was announced in 2007.  If they keep up with their schedule, then is Cyclone VI not far behind?  Will this be 22 or 20nm technology?  How fast and cost effective will this be compared to a 65 nm ASIC?  I don't know. 

I do know that FPGA has gone a lot further than anyone ever thought, and these products follow Moore's law quite well.

The second part of my reply is FLEXIBILITY.  These devices are NOT purpose built-ASIC's.  We are investigating utilizing the 12.4 Mb built-in memory (1,220 M10K blocks) per FPGA (24.8 Mb, 2,440 M10K blocks total) for use in Litecoin mining.  A purpose-built, Bitcoin mining ASIC can never be re-targeted for other uses.  These FPGA's on the other hand are MUCH more flexible.
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June 11, 2013, 06:59:17 AM
 #14

Product dead on arrival. Who needs expensive fpga miner in the age of asics? Btw, nice job, cool design. I like the aesthetic side of this tiny rig.
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June 11, 2013, 07:10:44 AM
 #15

Bitcoin gpu and fpga mining will be dead in two months - so forget it. But if you manage to tame the scrypt (LTC)...
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June 11, 2013, 07:24:18 AM
 #16

I would order one just for supporting this company.
And why not?

We are giving Millions $ to some BFL that hates us and lie to us... and we are so greed that we cant pay for FPGA miner that can mine litecoins?
As i remember everyone was asked to Ltc Fpga Miner???

Just need to get some BTC more, dont want to use own money  Tongue

What about delivery to Finland?

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June 11, 2013, 07:26:13 AM
 #17

Reserved

Message me if you have any problems
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June 11, 2013, 07:58:13 AM
 #18

 Roll Eyes I love Raspberry Pi.

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June 11, 2013, 07:58:26 AM
 #19

By the way, why the price is so high? If you are building 300 boards and have inside connection at Altera, single FPGA would cost ~180$, raspberry pi is cheap, enclosure makes another 20$ from some cheap labor country. PCB+passives+power makes another 50$. So your profit is like 500$ from single unit :O Plus mining profits from testing the produced units couple weeks before delivery.  
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June 11, 2013, 08:04:59 AM
 #20

How is it better than http://www.xilinx.com/products/boards-and-kits/EK-K7-KC705-G.htm
 running it @ 1GH/s or more. And it had potential to mine LTC as well.

Revewing Bitcoin / Crypto mining Hardware.
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