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Author Topic: Same Bitcoin address  (Read 1219 times)
wooch4aeye
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November 03, 2017, 04:11:38 PM
 #1

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet) so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?

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btctousd81
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November 03, 2017, 04:22:23 PM
 #2

you are talking about bitcoin address collision.

ref: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/7724/what-happens-if-your-bitcoin-client-generates-an-address-identical-to-another-pe

but its nearly impossible, but in case if someone accidentally manages to create same address  as your, then they can spend your funds.


ref: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=104461.0


TryNinja
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November 03, 2017, 04:23:19 PM
 #3

Is it possible? Of course. There is no way to avoid someone generating the same address as someone else.
Is it likely to happen? Not really.

This has already been discussed in the past. And this post summarizes the chances of something like this happening.

Given your example of 1 billion users at 10 addresses each:

There are 2^160 or about 1,460,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 possible addresses
In your scenario, 1,000,000,000 people are using 10 addresses each for a total of 10,000,000,000 possible addresses
10,000,000,000 / 2^160 should yield the probability of a collision occurring
10,000,000,000 / 2^160 = 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000684

So the chances of a collision occurring in your scenario are approximately 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000684%

See why we don't consider collisions an issue?

DannyHamilton
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November 03, 2017, 04:31:57 PM
 #4

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

No.

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet)

Yes.  You should use a new address for EVERY transaction.

An address is like an invoice number.  It allows you to identify who is paying you, when they paid you, and what they are paying for.

You wouldn't re-use an invoice number, why would you re-use an address?  Then if you receive two similar payments you wouldn't be able to determine who they came from or what they were for.

so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?

No.

The quantity of addresses is MUCH MUCH TOO BIG for humans to ever use them up.  The probability of two humans ever having the same properly generated address in all of human history and future is effectively zero.

wooch4aeye
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November 03, 2017, 05:07:47 PM
 #5

Is it possible? Of course. There is no way to avoid someone generating the same address as someone else.
Is it likely to happen? Not really.

This has already been discussed in the past. And this post summarizes the chances of something like this happening.

Given your example of 1 billion users at 10 addresses each:

There are 2^160 or about 1,460,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 possible addresses
In your scenario, 1,000,000,000 people are using 10 addresses each for a total of 10,000,000,000 possible addresses
10,000,000,000 / 2^160 should yield the probability of a collision occurring
10,000,000,000 / 2^160 = 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000684

So the chances of a collision occurring in your scenario are approximately 0.000000000000000000000000000000000000684%

See why we don't consider collisions an issue?

are we need private key to have address ?

can use my own address (make one from mine )or must be generated ?

DannyHamilton
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November 03, 2017, 05:30:00 PM
 #6

are we need private key to have address ?

If you want to spend the bitcoins?  Yes.

can use my own address (make one from mine )or must be generated ?

They are generated from the keys.

Givebirth
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November 04, 2017, 06:08:25 AM
 #7

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet) so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?

No this is impossible because bitcoin adresses always generated in ramdon numbers and letters all of it so numbers have unlimited combination which is there is no possible way that 2 adresses can be the same.
AltCoinProject
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November 04, 2017, 06:42:52 AM
 #8

In theoretical it is possible, but low probability.

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Stedsm
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November 04, 2017, 08:29:56 AM
 #9

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet)

Yes.  You should use a new address for EVERY transaction.

An address is like an invoice number.  It allows you to identify who is paying you, when they paid you, and what they are paying for.

You wouldn't re-use an invoice number, why would you re-use an address?  Then if you receive two similar payments you wouldn't be able to determine who they came from or what they were for.

Excuse me for my query here, but if it applies to know whom sent us the payment for what and if an address actually works as an invoice as well as we should use a new address every time for new transaction, don't you think such rule should be applicable in the case of signature campaigns too?
(My query might sound irrelevant, but I am concerned about this rule that one can't change an address during the whole campaign).



so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?

No.

The quantity of addresses is MUCH MUCH TOO BIG for humans to ever use them up.  The probability of two humans ever having the same properly generated address in all of human history and future is effectively zero.

What about the leaked databases and/or addresses' private keys over few of the websites?
Can't diffrent wallets be allocated such addresses ever? If yes, aren't they prone to the danger of getting hacked the moment some funds arrive there?

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November 04, 2017, 07:56:51 PM
 #10

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet)

Yes.  You should use a new address for EVERY transaction.

An address is like an invoice number.  It allows you to identify who is paying you, when they paid you, and what they are paying for.

You wouldn't re-use an invoice number, why would you re-use an address?  Then if you receive two similar payments you wouldn't be able to determine who they came from or what they were for.

Excuse me for my query here, but if it applies to know whom sent us the payment for what and if an address actually works as an invoice as well as we should use a new address every time for new transaction, don't you think such rule should be applicable in the case of signature campaigns too?
(My query might sound irrelevant, but I am concerned about this rule that one can't change an address during the whole campaign).
It is convenient for signature campaign managers to just keep paying the same address over and over, and that does work, but it's not necessarily the most "correct" way to use addresses. I'm sure any campaign manager would change the address they'd pay you at if you needed them to, they probably just say you can't because if not they would have a lot more work managing the users' constantly changing addresses.
mycryptobiz
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November 04, 2017, 08:06:03 PM
 #11

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet) so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?
Absolutely not,wallets like electrum usually gives you 20-26 address to play with and plase do remember this addresses are your and only yours .
They develop their softwar in a random and unique way that even afrer 100000years there will be no same address.
I hope this helps.
gabbie2010
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November 05, 2017, 06:17:44 AM
 #12

Based on research and some some blockchain technology book I read.
 There is no such bitcoin address it is only the bitcoin protocol internally that read  and identifies the recipient of the bitcoin by ScriptPubKey. So the issue of having the same bitcoin address is sorted out internally by blockchain technology.
Read more from the culled text.

"ScriptPubKey
You might not know that as far as the Blockchain is concerned, there is no such thing as a
Bitcoin Address. Internally, the Bitcoin protocol identifies the recipient of Bitcoin by a
ScriptPubKey.
A ScriptPubKey may look like this:
OP_DUP OP_HASH160 14836dbe7f38c5ac3d49e8d790af808a4ee9edcf OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG
It is a short script that explains what conditions must be met to claim ownership of bitcoins.
We will go into the types of operations in a ScriptPubKey as we move through the lessons
of this book.
We are able to generate the ScriptPubKey from the Bitcoin Address. This is a step that all
bitcoin clients do to translate the “human friendly” Bitcoin Address to the Blockchain readable address"
Reference: Programming The Blockchain In C#.

       
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mstone
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November 05, 2017, 03:57:33 PM
 #13

Address collision has an extremely low probability, unless of course the method used to generate the addresses is flawed (e.g. a poorly implemented RNG)
jenni161
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November 05, 2017, 04:36:39 PM
 #14

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet) so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?
Absolutely not,wallets like electrum usually gives you 20-26 address to play with and plase do remember this addresses are your and only yours .
They develop their softwar in a random and unique way that even afrer 100000years there will be no same address.
I hope this helps.

If I'm not truly mistaken, the only way to really make sure there is no 2 same addresses would be to keep a list of all addresses somewhere. And that would, of course, be unsecure. Even if one program wouldn't give same key for different users, there are other programs so one wallet not colliding is not enough. I know, that this is very, very unlikely but theoretically speaking.

Edit: I don't know how that one wallet could do it, but if we imagine it could.
neurotypical
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November 05, 2017, 05:03:37 PM
 #15


No.

The quantity of addresses is MUCH MUCH TOO BIG for humans to ever use them up.  The probability of two humans ever having the same properly generated address in all of human history and future is effectively zero.

What about the bitcoin address collider experiment thing, where they have claimed to find up to 3 different addresses with funds on them? I remember reading about this, but I can't find more details. The website of this thing is:

https://lbc.cryptoguru.org/about

They seem to have passed the 1000 trillion mark.

Taras
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November 05, 2017, 05:20:17 PM
 #16


No.

The quantity of addresses is MUCH MUCH TOO BIG for humans to ever use them up.  The probability of two humans ever having the same properly generated address in all of human history and future is effectively zero.

What about the bitcoin address collider experiment thing, where they have claimed to find up to 3 different addresses with funds on them? I remember reading about this, but I can't find more details. The website of this thing is:

https://lbc.cryptoguru.org/about

They seem to have passed the 1000 trillion mark.



It looks like they're going through private keys counting upwards from 0. Here is an example of a private key, in hex format, that they found to have money on it:
000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000022306e3f1a72

That private key was probably originally made to be cracked. Either that or some faulty wallet that made it stored it as a 6-byte integer and it overflowed badly. It was definitely not secure in the first place and our properly generated private keys will never, ever be affected.
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November 06, 2017, 12:42:12 PM
 #17

is there any rules between wallets to have Special bitcoin address ?

and i see many wallet give for 1 user more than 1 address (HD wallet) so after 10 years if number of users increase can two users get same address ?
example address: 17RTTUAiiPqUTKtEggJPec8RxLMi2n9EZ5
there are 34 letters and numbers, or even more
the sum of numbers (10) and letters (26) in the alphabet : 36
so you can create this much wallet 36^34 ,

36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x3 6x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36x36=???

or it could be much more if the character of the address increases or decreases

there is no possibility of the same address in 2 accounts
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November 06, 2017, 11:54:22 PM
 #18

Address collision has an extremely low probability, unless of course the method used to generate the addresses is flawed (e.g. a poorly implemented RNG)
Agree with your opinion.
Collision, This is not possible. Actually, the code is generated randomly by the Random Number Generator (RNG) system.
For our eyes, the code does look random, but for RNG it may be that the code is actually sequential, because only RNG is able to create and translate the Random Code.
"All random numbers are generated on the web server using Javascript Math.random"

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November 07, 2017, 02:13:53 PM
 #19

I guess that it would be possible. But the chances are very slim, does that mean that it's unpossible? No certainly not. If you see weird activity in your wallet it's most likely the result of hacking.
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