Can someone start a group buy for the new BitFury miners?

[Mabsark]

If you're not yet aware. 400 Gh/s BitFury miners are now available for 15,000 EUR with an August delivery date or 7,500 EUR with an October delivery date.

[ANN] Bitfury ASIC sales in EU and Europe

Can someone start a group buy with hosting and listing on the stock exchanges like ADDICTION did?

[webjoe]

What are the "requirements" to do a group buy? 

[jlsminingcorp]

I can do if there's sufficient interest (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=250412.0). Why would only certain people be able to start group buys? I appreciate that people putting money into these things need to trust the organiser, but there are a few mechanisms to make these as secure as possible (Escrow, identity verification etc.) In the end, if people aren't happy that there are sufficient safeguards then they won't join, right?

[tyrion70]

I'll check with Blastbob tonight if we're up to it.. Need to check some things first, cuz they are a lot more expensive, so I'm unsure of ROI.

Cheers

[szmarco]

I'll check with Blastbob tonight if we're up to it.. Need to check some thongs first, cuz they are a lot more expensive, so I'm unsure of ROI.

Cheers

Yes.You are right.
Maybe the starter kit in August + 15 H-Board in October is a safer choice.

[TheSwede75]

I'm willing to run a group buy for the Bitfury miners, however only if I can arrange US shipment or hosting, as I am in the US. I have previous group buy experience and a fairly high level of community trust.

[Adamlm]

this one has started, first shares sold:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=250449.0

[Kushedout]

I'll check with Blastbob tonight if we're up to it.. Need to check some things first, cuz they are a lot more expensive, so I'm unsure of ROI.

Cheers

Interest. Would be a plus if this offer would include hosting as well. (and potentially become part of ADDICTION)

[Stinky_Pete]

I'll check with Blastbob tonight if we're up to it.. Need to check some things first, cuz they are a lot more expensive, so I'm unsure of ROI.

Cheers

I'm interested, but would like to see how the numbers compare with the ADDICTION schemes.

[tyrion70]

Allright folks,

We've compared some numbers, but decided against starting a groupbuy. We feel we can only start groupbuys on which we are willing to invest ourselves, in this case the numbers tell us we don't want to..

To start with, the current BTC/USD price is certainly not helping. It just dropped to $70 or €55. So below numbers might have been a lot better a few days or week ago.

We've compared the two 400GH options offered. In our own calculations for KNC we've used 31/10 as delivery date for the jupiters. Likewise we've used 31/8 and 31/10 for possible delivery dates for bitfury.

The prices in BTC for the miners used are:
KNC Jupiter: 100 BTC (we bought a lot cheaper, but that's the current price)
Bitfury October: 136 BTC (7500/55)
Bitfury August: 272 BTC (15000/55)

With an average difficulty rise of 14% per retarget period these are the break-even numbers in days:
KNC Jupiter: 105 days, top is 115 BTC after 217 days
Bitfury October: never, top is 127 after 245 days
Bitfury August: never top is 192BTC after 287 days

For power we took ,67btc per week for the jupiters and ,33 for bitfury (half).

As you can see at current prices we might not even run another KNC groupbuy let alone a bitfury one knowing it won't break even. We ran it again with 1/8 and 1/10 as delivery dates in which case the August on still doesn't break even and the October on does after 140 days.

I must say we've used some pessimistic variables like an extra 350TH added difficulty to reflect the Jupiters/bitfury miners starting hashing at the same time, so you might get slightly different results, but this is what we've been using for our decisions so far.

All in all, we won't start a bitfury GB. We'll also wait with a 3rd KNC groupbuy until the BTC price stabilizes a bit. Wish I had better news..

Cheers,
BlastBob & Tyrion70

[bitcoin_max]

Only certain people are allowed to start group buys.  If you are not part of the club, "btharper" will flame any post you put up.

Have you tried? 

[jlsminingcorp]

Allright folks,

We've compared some numbers, but decided against starting a groupbuy. We feel we can only start groupbuys on which we are willing to invest ourselves, in this case the numbers tell us we don't want to..

To start with, the current BTC/USD price is certainly not helping. It just dropped to $70 or €55. So below numbers might have been a lot better a few days or week ago.

We've compared the two 400GH options offered. In our own calculations for KNC we've used 31/10 as delivery date for the jupiters. Likewise we've used 31/8 and 31/10 for possible delivery dates for bitfury.

The prices in BTC for the miners used are:
KNC Jupiter: 100 BTC (we bought a lot cheaper, but that's the current price)
Bitfury October: 136 BTC (7500/55)
Bitfury August: 272 BTC (15000/55)

With an average difficulty rise of 14% per retarget period these are the break-even numbers in days:
KNC Jupiter: 105 days, top is 115 BTC after 217 days
Bitfury October: never, top is 127 after 245 days
Bitfury August: never top is 192BTC after 287 days

For power we took ,67btc per week for the jupiters and ,33 for bitfury (half).

As you can see at current prices we might not even run another KNC groupbuy let alone a bitfury one knowing it won't break even. We ran it again with 1/8 and 1/10 as delivery dates in which case the August on still doesn't break even and the October on does after 140 days.

I must say we've used some pessimistic variables like an extra 350TH added difficulty to reflect the Jupiters/bitfury miners starting hashing at the same time, so you might get slightly different results, but this is what we've been using for our decisions so far.

All in all, we won't start a bitfury GB. We'll also wait with a 3rd KNC groupbuy until the BTC price stabilizes a bit. Wish I had better news..

Cheers,
BlastBob & Tyrion70

Thanks for sharing your analysis guys, that's certainly a gloomy picture. Is there any particular reason that you didn't include VAT in your analysis (not that this helps matters)? What the hell has happened to the bitcoin price this afternoon!!

[tyrion70]

Thanks for sharing your analysis guys, that's certainly a gloomy picture. Is there any particular reason that you didn't include VAT in your analysis (not that this helps matters)? What the hell has happened to the bitcoin price this afternoon!!

Hmm.. you just made it 21% worse :p Reason: I forgot And I'm used to exclude VAT..

[jlsminingcorp]

Sorry, trying to help, not make things worse . At least it's only 20% in the UK!

I guess ROI for all of these depends on where we think the bitcoin price will be in the future. Back to playing with my spreadsheet now - you guys have made me think.

[tyrion70]

Good of you to point it out.. VAT can be an unpleasant surprise..

There's just a lot of factors to take into account. In the spreadsheet we use, i took difficulty as the major variable, so every column has a different difff from 0 to 30%. In the rows are the earnings per week. It became pretty difficult lol.. All in all difficulty is the most deciding factor on roi. We've seen difficulty go up by more than 20% lately. Last period was a nice one with only 10% but the next one will probably be around % again..

We'll see what happens I guess

[l0ft]

I have access to next to free electricity. Only problem is GST (equivalent of VAT) is 7% into Singapore.
I can get it shipped to a friend in the UK and then ship it into Singapore.

I understand that there's a groupbuy for BitFury miners at the moment and they are reserving 13% + electical costs.

Would anyone be interested if I started one for 10% while covering electrical costs?

Is there a kickstarter type collection service where people pledge amounts and aren't required to transfer till we have enough to go ahead. Tracking payments is not an issue but it would be ideal if a similar platform for bitcoin were up.