450btc Bounty (Pledge) for Open Source Exchange project.

[Anonymous]

It is becoming clearer we need a way for anyone to set up a bitcoin exchange easily . This must be open source but let companies build on top if need be.

A bonus feature would be the ability for the default installation  to plugin to mt gox or bitcoin market .

10%  of bitcoins earned from http://bitcoin.me will be added to this bounty so claim your vanity bitcoin address and help grow this project at the same time.  

This bounty is a pledge drive. No one has to send any coins untill the project is founded.

jgarzik  100
Mahkul  250



Coding/Web Design
genjix
Nefario

Pm me if youre name is missing!

[1714006675]

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[1714006675]

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[1714006675]

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[jgarzik]

Pledge 100 BTC.

[davout]

A bonus feature would be the ability for the default installation  to plugin to mt gox or bitcoin market .

Define "plug in to mt gox"

[kiba]

Starting tomorrow, I will accelerate development of bitpredict so I can take on this project.

I been anticipating this project for quite some time but I did not expect anybody would take initiative in funding this project.

[Mahkul]

I desperately need something like that to create an exchange in Poland.

One thing I don't know how to approach is how to build up a graph that would show relation between BTC and PLN (Polish Zloty)? I don't mean how to draw it, but where to get the current value of PLN from? Would I have to connect to mtgox first and then check how PLN is to USD?

Once someone explains that to me I would be happy to pledge 250BTC for this.

[Cryptoman]

You could write a script to extract the USD/PLN exchange rate from this screen:
http://www.xe.com/currency/pln-polish-zloty

Or, maybe this needs to be a requirement of the project, i.e., the acquisition of real-time exchange rates.

[jgarzik]

One thing I don't know how to approach is how to build up a graph that would show relation between BTC and PLN (Polish Zloty)? I don't mean how to draw it, but where to get the current value of PLN from? Would I have to connect to mtgox first and then check how PLN is to USD?

The value of PLN is based on each BTC/PLN trade that occurs on the BTC/PLN exchange.

The traders who create orders on the BTN/PLN exchange are the ones who determine the current value -- which is, by definition, the value of the most recent BTN/PLN completed trade.  This describes automated currency exchanges -- open markets -- such as mtgox.

Other sites that perform manual currency exchanges simply calculate an exchange rate based on

• a commission (your profit)
• PLN/USD rate from http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=USDPLN=X
• BTC/mtgox-USD rate from http://www.bitcoinwatch.com/

[Mahkul]

One thing I don't know how to approach is how to build up a graph that would show relation between BTC and PLN (Polish Zloty)? I don't mean how to draw it, but where to get the current value of PLN from? Would I have to connect to mtgox first and then check how PLN is to USD?

The value of PLN is based on each BTC/PLN trade that occurs on the BTC/PLN exchange.

The traders who create orders on the BTN/PLN exchange are the ones who determine the current value -- which is, by definition, the value of the most recent BTN/PLN completed trade.

Thank you jgarzik. So, in theory, that means that the relation between PLN and BTC could be different than the relation between USD and BTC shown on mtgox? Of course this won't be off by much, because then people will go somewhere else, unless someone is selling coins for nothing? For some reason I was thinking that my exchange would have to monitor values on mtgox and follow it. Stupid me.

[Mahkul]

I pledge 250BTC 

[jgarzik]

Thank you jgarzik. So, in theory, that means that the relation between PLN and BTC could be different than the relation between USD and BTC shown on mtgox? Of course this won't be off by much, because then people will go somewhere else, unless someone is selling coins for nothing? For some reason I was thinking that my exchange would have to monitor values on mtgox and follow it. Stupid me.

Option 1:  In an open market exchange, an exchange assumes a neutral role, connecting (a) people selling PLN for BTC with (b) people selling BTC for PLN.  The exchange rate is based on the most-recent currency trade between users.  If there is a difference between BTC/PLN and BTC/USD rate, then users may make a profit on that difference through arbitrage.

Option 2:  In a for-profit currency exchange, you are seeking to (a) sell PLN, buy BTC or (b) buy PLN, sell BTC for customers.  You set the exchange rate, based on your informed knowledge of BTC, USD and PLN exchange rates, and customers will buy--or not--based on your store's exchange rates.

Remember, value of USD and PLN varies in the real world too!

[Mahkul]

What I would love to be doing is charging something like 0.5% per transaction (isn't that what mtgox is doing?), but only in BTC. I don't want to take a risk and get commission in PLN (the Revenue office in Poland wouldn't like that). Do you think it would be fair to only get commission from people selling BTC (and not PLN)? In other words, it is always the BTC seller who pays the commission and not the buyer.

[genjix]

Instead of pledging small bounties for what is an important project, it might be a good idea if we setup a page on the wiki and begin documenting how such a site should look/function.

Making this site is piss easy. It's the spec that's hard.

Then after we can make a git repo and begin coding.

I have no idea how such a thing would function. But with a clear document with simplistic drawings i'm confident we could easily do this in a week or less.

How about pledging the money not for the software (which is likely to be some weekend shoddy hackjob which isn't maintained) but for a comprehensive design spec detailing exactly what each page of the site does, how the API looks, how the tech works .etc

Such a thing on the wiki can then be easily discussed/maintained by others.

1- I pledge to help with designing the look or coding.

[Anonymous]

Instead of pledging small bounties for what is an important project, it might be a good idea if we setup a page on the wiki and begin documenting how such a site should look/function.

Making this site is piss easy. It's the spec that's hard.

Then after we can make a git repo and begin coding.

I have no idea how such a thing would function. But with a clear document with simplistic drawings i'm confident we could easily do this in a week or less.

How about pledging the money not for the software (which is likely to be some weekend shoddy hackjob which isn't maintained) but for a comprehensive design spec detailing exactly what each page of the site does, how the API looks, how the tech works .etc

Such a thing on the wiki can then be easily discussed/maintained by others.

1- I pledge to help with designing the look or coding.

I agree on documenting things . Its not actually the site thats important its coming up with some sort of standard for future reference.

I have another bounty for something similar which is a web based currency converter like you see at xe.com  A current list of resources for people to use to build on top of would be helpful.

[davout]

I would love such a spec be put together, that might mean if bitcoin-central.net, my new baby fits in i'll get to collect the bounty the day i feel like opensourcing

[Anonymous]

I would love such a spec be put together, that might mean if bitcoin-central.net, my new baby fits in i'll get to collect the bounty the day i feel like opensourcing

I dont have a problem with that. 

[Anonymous]

A bonus feature would be the ability for the default installation  to plugin to mt gox or bitcoin market .

Define "plug in to mt gox"

Include the docs on exactly how to use the merchant api.

Something similar was done recently for mybitcoin thanks to madhatter.

There are a few currency conversion tools that also would be helpful to include...yahoo? xe.com?

[Anonymous]

What I would love to be doing is charging something like 0.5% per transaction (isn't that what mtgox is doing?), but only in BTC. I don't want to take a risk and get commission in PLN (the Revenue office in Poland wouldn't like that). Do you think it would be fair to only get commission from people selling BTC (and not PLN)? In other words, it is always the BTC seller who pays the commission and not the buyer.

I think charging for filling up your account might be better than per trade fees?

For example a currency exchange that lets you fill up your trade wallet for a fee.

[jgarzik]

Instead of pledging small bounties for what is an important project, it might be a good idea if we setup a page on the wiki and begin documenting how such a site should look/function.

I agree on documenting things . Its not actually the site thats important its coming up with some sort of standard for future reference.

I have another bounty for something similar which is a web based currency converter like you see at xe.com  A current list of resources for people to use to build on top of would be helpful.

I urge the exact opposite -- start coding first.  If people start writing, then you wind up with a project where kiba, RHorning and other talkative types have a lot of input into something that few programmers are interested in coding.

Absent a real bounty, that compensates real programmers at real market rates (100+ BTC/hour), you are looking at volunteer programmers working on their own inclination, on their own time, to produce something that interests them.  A wiki document might be "interesting" reference material, but don't expect volunteer programmers to write code for a spec created out of thin air by non-programmers.

The world is littered with useless, pie-in-the-sky specifications better suited for garbage pails.  And those were written by engineers.  Specifications written by management types that don't code are even worse.

[kiba]

I want to earn bitcoin, not be a volunteer programmer.  

That being said, there's some benefit in having a clear spec.

[genjix]

The world is littered with useless, pie-in-the-sky specifications better suited for garbage pails.  And those were written by engineers.  Specifications written by management types that don't code are even worse.

After Apache 1, instead of jumping into coding Apache they spent more than a year documenting how they should think it looks. Then with Apache 2 they had an exact idea what to make and it was a true community effort.

codeswarm apache visualisation:
http://www.vimeo.com/1076588

Python does the same with the PSEPs.

Remember the python zen:
Now is better than never.
Although never is often better than *right* now.

Free software projects are really excellent when they have to code programs where it's clear what the function is. But when there's no framework or beginning idea in place then it's more a hackfest. That's why much of the best free software projects are opened-up former closed projects (firefox, blender, openoffice, qt, ...)- because now it's clear to everyone which direction the project has to go and the swarm can iterate to perfection.

I have no idea what an exchange site looks like. But having a spec and some screenshot mockups would make it super easy for everyone to contribute a few modules and quickly get such a site done. It's something everyone wants and I'm sure everyone will chip in a small amount of time to maintain their own modules (it's not even a hard thing to code- probably).

We aren't talking about a huge 1000 page documentation bible but maybe 10 pages or so saying screen X does this, blaa blaa.