U.S. bank closing all of my deposit accounts because of bitcoins

[Inedible]

I am sorry but I have never heard of this before. I have of freezing but not just random closing.

Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks! 

As mentioned already by someone else, it's already been posted.

Healthy scepticisim is good but just because you've never heard of it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

[Inedible]

One of the very best things for bitcoin would be if the USA started a "war on bitcoin"... every single 'war on' anything that the US starts fails miserably and their target becomes legal and/or legitimate.

'war on drugs' anyone?

Drugs have become legal/legitimate? I know weed in some states has but it'll never happen for ecstasy, heroin, cocaine, etc.

[Inedible]

Why couldn't they just ask the customer to stop the undesired transactions rather the closing the account preemptively?

No because the bank are then going to be held responsible for the existing transfers so they'd need to be investigated.

As a business (the bank) - it's far better to be seen to do something against money laundering than only allowing a small number of transactions through.

Don't forget, for money laundering, you might only need to make one huge transfer and be done. If the bank just said, don't do it again, then most money laundering would pass by unchecked.

[AliceWonder]

Open an account at a credit union and use that for your bitcoin stuff.

Seriously.

Every thread I've seen about closed accounts due to bitcoin have one thing in common - major national banks.
Maybe that's just because most people use major national banks, but I suspect *speculation ahead* they close enough to get people talking but not enough to be looked at for anti-trust. I suspect it is a FUD tactic hoping to slow/stop the adoption of bitcoin.

Trade unions are less likely to be party to that kind of thing. And even if a trade union does close the account you use for bitcoin, it doesn't then impact your regular banking account.

[ellard]

Walk in and hand a note to the bank teller saying:

Give me all your bitcoins.

Of course don't include anything sayings like this is a stick up or anything.
It's just a joke like if you walked in and asked the teller to give you all her quarters because you are doing laundry. She will laugh, you will laugh, everyone in the bank will giggle and laugh and fun will be had by all. 

Not sure if troll

Are you asking if I'm a troll?

[joesmoe2012]

FYI, I got a call from my bank multiple times verifying that I was sending money to bitstamp, and that chase would not be held responsible for bitstamps failure to provide service (they didn't mention bitcoins but they alos never asked what bitstamp was or anything else). I send lots of wires, probably 20% get flagged, bitstamp ones get flagged nearly 80% of the time.

I'm always sending from/to the same account.

IAFCU is going to be very interesting, what do their wire fees look like?

[tclo]

Drugs have become legal/legitimate? I know weed in some states has but it'll never happen for ecstasy, heroin, cocaine, etc.
[/quote]

Yes it will...all drugs are legal in a couple of countries. I think Portugal in one. If we don't go extinct from climate change or nuclear annihilation or some killer virus, then eventually most countries will make all drugs legal.

[Inedible]

Walk in and hand a note to the bank teller saying:

Give me all your bitcoins.

Of course don't include anything sayings like this is a stick up or anything.
It's just a joke like if you walked in and asked the teller to give you all her quarters because you are doing laundry. She will laugh, you will laugh, everyone in the bank will giggle and laugh and fun will be had by all. 

Not sure if troll

Are you asking if I'm a troll?

Don't know if you're a troll as such but that post has surely got to be one.

If you did that in a bank we'll all be hearing it in the news by dinner time 

[ellard]

Walk in and hand a note to the bank teller saying:

Give me all your bitcoins.

Of course don't include anything sayings like this is a stick up or anything.
It's just a joke like if you walked in and asked the teller to give you all her quarters because you are doing laundry. She will laugh, you will laugh, everyone in the bank will giggle and laugh and fun will be had by all. 

Not sure if troll

Are you asking if I'm a troll?

Don't know if you're a troll as such but that post has surely got to be one.

If you did that in a bank we'll all be hearing it in the news by dinner time 

It was an attempt at humor.

Not sure how you think this might be trolling. We must have different opinions on what trolling is. 

[PilotCurly99]

It is my understanding that banks have been actively lobbying for years against the Dodd-Frank law, as the cost of compliance for them is astronomical and forces them to turn away business that they would want to have in a normal functioning market.  The posts here seem to indicate that may be true.  Nobody wants to turn away business, but once they look at the cost benefit analysis and risk reward relationship in this regulatory environment it sort of ties their hands.  Are the regulators being aggressive?  Yes, but the real answer is that it is time for a round of deregulation.  Probably not a politically popular word after the financial crisis, but economically it would be great!

[joesmoe2012]

People definitely are getting their accounts closed, anybody who thinks that's trolling is blind.

[d0qtrx]

If you're willing to take the time it may be possible to have your account reopened, but that outcome is not guaranteed.

Bank says they will never deal with me again, wont open or reopen any accounts. Funny thing that they kept my credit accounts but closing only deposit accounts

Of course. They want to bleed you dry on interest.

[MagicBit15]

I am sorry but I have never heard of this before. I have of freezing but not just random closing.

Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks! 

I'm sorry reading is hard for you.  OP posted it on the first page.

So sorry I missed that tiny link while scanning. No need to be rude. Ya jerk. 

Anyway wow that is very weird and sucks. I also don't know nor have ever heard of what USbank is so you should probably not use them lol.

[TippingPoint]

Here is the letter that OP posted a link to earlier in this thread:

here is what i got. it doesn say much. So when i called bank asking what rules i broke they told I was buying bitcoins . I didnt tell bank i was using it to buy bitcoins just ecurrencies. Somehow they find out
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/106526372/letter.jpg

What sorts of transactions were you doing related to bitcoins?

all i was doing is arbitrage. buying in one place sell them in other

[Rampion]

Drugs have become legal/legitimate? I know weed in some states has but it'll never happen for ecstasy, heroin, cocaine, etc.

Yes it will...all drugs are legal in a couple of countries. I think Portugal in one. If we don't go extinct from climate change or nuclear annihilation or some killer virus, then eventually most countries will make all drugs legal.

BS. "All drugs are legal" NOWHERE. In most of european countries (including Spain, Italy and obviously PORTUGAL) possession of any drug for personal use is decriminalized, meaning that if you get caught smoking a joint, or doing cocaine/heroine whatever, you can NEVER go to jail unless they can prove that your are a drug dealer - if you are not and only have "personal use" quantities, you just get a fine, an administrative sanction that is just like a speeding ticket.

Even more, even if you have very big quantities (a couple of kilos of Marihuana, dozens of grams of cocaine), if you can a) prove that you are an addict and that those quantities are for you and only for you (for example for a whole year) and b) the prosecutors cannot prove that you are a dealer (for example because you can justify all the money you have from a legit job, plus you do not have any trafficking related gadgets like scales, etc.), then you will be free as a bird regardless of the quantity they catch you with.

But this is very different from "all drugs are legal". You still cannot legally sell any drugs nowhere, apart from a very few and notable exceptions regarding cannabis (and sometimes minor drugs like shrooms) in The Netherlands (but its just because they do not enforce the law, not because its explicitly legal(), North Korea, Pakistan and some States of the US.

You see, "legalizing all the drugs" (legalizing meaning that you are able to freely buy and sell them) is not happening anytime soon, there is too much powerful people living directly (trafficking) and indirectly (Government agencies like DEA, drug police, etc.) from drugs being a "black market" thing, and thus something that is sold with a huge premium and without paying any tax. The 1961 Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs is still being enforced, and nations that try to do otherwise are always reminded by the US that there is a 1961 treaty that needs to be respected or there will be very serious consecuences. This is why The Netherlands never "legalized" Marijuana, even tough they don't enforce its illegality in coffee shops.

Sorry for the off-topic, but the "all drugs are legal in Portugal" its so wrong I couldn't help myself...

EDIT: maybe a mod should move these three posts (mine and the two I'm replying to) to a different thread as this is 100% off-topic.

[Aseras]

The account didn't get closed because of bitcoins. It got closed because of your usage. Having to file 3-4 SAR a day tends to make banks grumpy. Even 1-2 a month is a red flag. Unless you have a HUGE business account and keep enough money in there for it to be worth it to them to keep a staffer on hand to file them all.

You can thank your government and the ridiculous laws it passed. Now, not only can you not use a bank account in the US, but no foreign bank will touch you either, for the same reason.

/ another indentured citizen of the United States.
//wants out before the country implodes.

[polarhei]

Perhaps you use non FinCEN like mtgox ( currently now registered with FinCEN but not available for 48 States for the time being) authorized service to block you. I think this is the reason.

[AliceWonder]

The account didn't get closed because of bitcoins. It got closed because of your usage. Having to file 3-4 SAR a day tends to make banks grumpy. Even 1-2 a month is a red flag. Unless you have a HUGE business account and keep enough money in there for it to be worth it to them to keep a staffer on hand to file them all.

You can thank your government and the ridiculous laws it passed. Now, not only can you not use a bank account in the US, but no foreign bank will touch you either, for the same reason.

/ another indentured citizen of the United States.
//wants out before the country implodes.

The quantity may have been the red flag but the transaction fee they charge covers the cost of filing.

[Anon136]

the long and short of it is your behavior caused them to believe that you were more of a liability to them than an asset. so they cut you off because its their bank, they can chose to do that.

[niko]

This sounds wholly inaccurate.   It is perfectly legal to buy or sell bitcoins using a bank account.  Coinbase does tends of thousands of transactions every day.

Can you post the letter from the bank?

Must be more involved here.

He was moving thousands of dollars through is personal accounts to do arbitrage across exchanges.  You should at least talk to your branch manager before starting this kind of activity.

Really.  Because using a bank as a bank is a bad thing.  But maybe he was using too many free wire transfers..... wait.... wire transfers are not free....

Ok.  I get it.  They were making too much money on him and wanted to stop. 

I could imagine if he was constantly moving money around for free, but not for fees.

He was doing business, and these may have been personal accounts. Banks structure their workload and expectations differently between personal and business accounts. This whole sad problem may be as trivial as the distinction I just pointed out. Add to this the possibility of AML flagging, an occasional idiot in the corporate office, and general ignorance of what Bitcoin is, and you get high likelihood of what is described in here.

I, too, wanted to run multi-currency arbitrage. Developed algos, tested them on historical data, but after weeks of preparations had to give up precisely due to admimistrative overhead. It's not easy doing it right.