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Author Topic: People are extremely biased towards bitcoin.  (Read 585 times)
Magister Magus
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December 21, 2017, 06:33:05 PM
 #21

Inflation is an hidden taxation, and governments always used it deliberatelly in this sense.
Whit bitcoin this is not possible, but who knows what a politician can invent to fraud the citizens?

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December 21, 2017, 06:38:50 PM
 #22

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.

I see LN as the only viable option to fix tx fee and time. Scalability issue is indeed at heights and these shit forks are only increasing the problem.

But I want to talk about the utility here. If you need a coin with utility as currency for everyday transaction, then even if fees goes down significantly, no one is going to use BTC for that because of the inbuilt deflation. As supply is limited, adoption is increasing and hence, price will rise. BTC has become a ""store of value"" than a currency.

For currency purpose we need a currency with little or no deflation like XRP with large supply. Bitcoin can never become that with 21 million supply. A little inflation is required for building a currency that people will actually use.
Why do we need inflation? You know what national banks are in collusion with the government use this mechanism? It is attempt for your account to close holes in the economy. It seems to me that the government should manage the economy so that we did not pay for their mistakes. That is why bitcoin has become so popular.
Why people have the mentality of inflation being a negative thing? Huge inflation is negative. But we need minor inflation.

""Inflation drives spending""

Suppose you have deflationary currency with which you can buy a car. But if you hold it for some months, you can buy 2 car. What will you do? Will you spend it? No. Same is the case with BTC.
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December 21, 2017, 06:52:16 PM
 #23

Fees are high but I would say that fees are following the bitcoin price. And not every exchanger or wallet have extremly high fees so there are options.
I agree that this problem should be solved but what bothers me the most is that when the price is on the rise no one is talking about the fees and everyone is saying that bitcoin will conquer the world. When the price starts to fall everyone argues about fees and how bitcoin will die soon, that it has no future and similar. This sucks.

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December 21, 2017, 07:16:31 PM
 #24

Inflation means that your money, I mean your "reserve of value" loses value.
There is nothing positive in this.
Of course it's an impulse to spending, but I don't see any good, at least at personal level: why to buy something if you don't need it?

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December 21, 2017, 07:24:23 PM
 #25

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that.

The one that's biased is you. Have you seen what some trolls here are saying and have you thought about why the answers to those statements are "FUD!, trolling" and such?
When I see a newbie coming to the forum and starting a thread titled: "bitcoin is dead" or "bitcoin is shit" or something in that tone I react to it by reporting that crap or responding with a defensive approach.
What would happen if you marched into a black neighbourhood with a I hate niggers sign? We are very nice and polite people, if someone says he hates BTC we're asking for reasons. Black guys would call your mom names and threaten to shoot you Wink

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December 21, 2017, 07:44:24 PM
 #26

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.



It's ok to point at bitcoin's problems, but it's NOT ok to sell your altcoin as the solution to bitcoin's problems, when your altcoin is not a solution but a scam making false promises.

There's not a single altcoin that scales anywhere without ending up with the same problems.

Tall these POS and tangle coins are nothing but scams.

LN will solve the scaling problem, just give it time for it to be properly released and implemented in websites all over the world.




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December 21, 2017, 08:00:08 PM
 #27


Why people have the mentality of inflation being a negative thing? Huge inflation is negative. But we need minor inflation.

Simple:
I go to work, and per one hour, I get X EUR.
Since I do not want to take loan or something, I want to save up , for example, 20000 "X"'s (10year wage)
but since there is INFLATION, I am losing on my day1 save of 8 "X"'s approx 1.03^10 , which means, my 8X will buy only 5X or so with 10 year difference.
Since the thing I want (say a yach or something, doesnt really matter at all) is very expensive, therefore 10year wage, no loan, just cash. How to beat inflation? Risking stocks? Bank deposits?
This is scam. People will spend even with 0% inflation.
You said, one car today, two cars in months. That's extreme deflation that will never happen. I don;t want deflation, but nor 3% inflation.
How would you solve my 20000 hour wage item I wish to buy without loan/margin?
please elaborate, thanks Smiley
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December 21, 2017, 08:05:03 PM
 #28

I think Bitcoin being the first crypt-currency have physiological effect on people mind. These people have some emotional attachment to it in some way or other. Bitcoin has inc. these people money or savings into 1000x, 100x, 50X or 5x, it doesn't matter , what matters is that these people had achieved their life dreams with the help of BTC price growth, so definitely there is a soft corner for BTC in those people heart and they just don't want that any other crypto should BTC ever.
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December 21, 2017, 08:36:41 PM
 #29

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.


I've been very transparent about my stance on the current state of bitcoin: it's shit. The prices are up, that's great, but what about its usability and scalability? Did SegWit help bitcoin in some way? I think not, and most users who have used bitcoins to transfer money before are now using other altcoins to transfer their money. Bitcoin is being looked up as an investment by most people and forget that it's also initially intended to be a cheap and efficient transfer of value. No one's being bias about that though, and believe me I've met so many people being biased about fiat and the banks as well.




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jossiel
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December 21, 2017, 09:05:38 PM
 #30

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.


I know what you feel man and I'm also keep on defending and has been a supporter of bitcoin since then but this is the reality and it speaks for itself.

Before there are too many people that are loving the way sending transactions with bitcoin because it's fee isn't that high whether the price of bitcoin is high or low, it comes up to 5 decimal places just for the fee.

But I have faith into the core devs and this major problem of bitcoin will be solved soon.

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December 21, 2017, 09:09:40 PM
 #31

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.

What makes bitcoin so popular is that it shifted from becoming a crypto based currency to an investment, as its price started getting higher and higher, so when asked about the common problem that bitcoin faces today in comparisoin to the other coins most people won't even bother with it because they don't care if the transaction is fast or slow if the fees are high or low, either way thier bitcoin is always going to stay within their wallets, the only thing that they care about is wether the price goes up or down, when it comes to high fees the transactions are verified by miners, and as we all know bitcoin mining has become a task only for the people that own extreamly powerfull machines, and with less miners comes more transaction more transations mean the more you pay for the miners teh faster your transaction will go.
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December 21, 2017, 09:46:33 PM
 #32

Op you are actually saying the truth and we have to read others people comment about bitcoin instead of just ignore or saying things about people comment about bitcoin. I have read many comments on so many threads here and I have find out that bad comments about bitcoin always get bag but it is not supposed to be so.  We must be realistic to ourself and accept the fact that mining fee is the greatest enemy of bitcoin!

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Bardman
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December 21, 2017, 10:31:00 PM
 #33

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.



It's ok to point at bitcoin's problems, but it's NOT ok to sell your altcoin as the solution to bitcoin's problems, when your altcoin is not a solution but a scam making false promises.

There's not a single altcoin that scales anywhere without ending up with the same problems.

Tall these POS and tangle coins are nothing but scams.

LN will solve the scaling problem, just give it time for it to be properly released and implemented in websites all over the world.


Maybe they aren't but I can send ethereums almost instantly with far less fees right now. I'm not saying ethereums would scale better but right now, why should I buy/use bitcoins when I can buy/use ethereums? If I'm just buying bitcoin as an investment I might as well just buy eth or other alt coins that can do a 2x or 3x much easier than bitcoin right. Not everyone agrees that LN will actually work that well. Historically the solutions haven't really been too effective.

Andrej Peiboski
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December 21, 2017, 10:34:50 PM
 #34

Actually, everyone with a little technical background knows that bitcoin has some structural problem that will bring the system to a crisis.
But nobody know the exact moment, so there is still a lot of space to make decent gains.

Hydrogen
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December 21, 2017, 11:46:56 PM
 #35

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.

...

I haven't seen much evidence of ethereum or other alts having better network capacity than bitcoin. Alts only appear to be better suited to handling transfer fees due to their volume and usage being substantially lower. The idea that bitcoin is "falling behind" in comparison to other crypto could be an ethereum marketing gimmick which was outed by eth cat apps.

Part of the issue with btc transfer fees could involve wallets recommending far higher transfer fees than is necessary. I think I sent a transfer a few weeks ago with a fee of something like 0.0003 and it worked ok. The fees wallets are recommending could be exaggerated in value, although I'm not 100% certain on that.

I don't know if a solution exists but maybe we can organize and use lower fees on transactions to force miners to accept fees that are steadily decreasing, rather ones that are doing the opposite?

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December 21, 2017, 11:55:46 PM
 #36

Fees are high but I would say that fees are following the bitcoin price. And not every exchanger or wallet have extremly high fees so there are options.
I agree that this problem should be solved but what bothers me the most is that when the price is on the rise no one is talking about the fees and everyone is saying that bitcoin will conquer the world. When the price starts to fall everyone argues about fees and how bitcoin will die soon, that it has no future and similar. This sucks.

Fee lets say is not an big issue, bigger issue is waiting  time to get your transaction confirmed we need LN ASAP to solve this issue. Its easy to believe in bitocin and other alts when price is raising, but when its falling down its hard then, really hard. You have many people that are buying at ATH in hope to get rich quick and when they see price to go down they are angry as hell because nobody loves to lose money.

On the other hand you have people that are trying to escape from this fee problem into alts where it gets ugly as everyone that owns or that is invested in particular coin want to tell that alt which he/she is holding is the best one out there - but in reality it is just another tactic to lure people so that others gain. Thats what I understand is happening with BCH, there are a lot other coins out there that even have faster blocks, lower fees but people that have heavily invested there want their voices heard, we have many people in BCH that are popular figures within it which causes it to get noticed. People fail to look for fundamentals and what is and what should work, they rather go with other opinions in search for quick buck if they don't have their opinion formed on the matter. I have nothing against BCH, just the way they are attacking btc like there are only bch and btc out there in field, but in fact they are not.

That's why I am saying cryptocurrency trading is pure gamble because we can see that it is mostly used as playground for people to speculate the price, its sad but this is how it is today.
pushkarmore
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December 22, 2017, 12:08:08 AM
 #37

Yes I agree with you that people are extremely biased towards bitcoin and yes of course it is one of the best cryptocurrency which is having huge demand and highly volatile in nature.

Transaction's fee really matter's a lot here for small traders with small amounts, and i think it will soon settle down during the upcoming fork. I have noticed that before the fork the transactions fees just surge's and decreases once the fork has been ended. Once the demand get's filled or fade away then bitcoin won't be able to compete with other coins which are good both investing wise and technological wise as it will gain demand based on it's technology in future for sure.
Magister Magus
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December 22, 2017, 12:12:43 AM
 #38

There is a lot of misinformation in mainstream about anything, and especially about cryptoworld.
Even crypto fans has a lot of strange ideas.
But this is not a problem, who have the right information will win. Simple.

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Bardman
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December 22, 2017, 12:43:16 AM
 #39

Yes I agree with you that people are extremely biased towards bitcoin and yes of course it is one of the best cryptocurrency which is having huge demand and highly volatile in nature.

Transaction's fee really matter's a lot here for small traders with small amounts, and i think it will soon settle down during the upcoming fork. I have noticed that before the fork the transactions fees just surge's and decreases once the fork has been ended. Once the demand get's filled or fade away then bitcoin won't be able to compete with other coins which are good both investing wise and technological wise as it will gain demand based on it's technology in future for sure.

Maybe but maybe not and all these forks are not good for your average bitcoin user, all these ''complicated'' issues are scaring people away from bitcoins or cryptos in general, which might be ok for now but eventually it's going to be damaging.

The_Dark_Knight
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December 22, 2017, 02:25:37 AM
 #40

Most people here and reddit will defend bitcoin no matter what instead of looking at the problems. Every time someone comments something about the speed or transaction fees they will just yell ''FUD'' or ''Another attack on bitcoin'' but it's not always that. I have been a strong supporter of bitcoin myself but we have to face it, it's not in a good position right now, sure the price is great but what else? Insane fees that are not getting solved any time soon? I know the demand is high but the ones that are buying are just buying to sell eventually not to support bitcoin, not to use it. The demand will eventually fade away and what do we have left? An outdated bitcoin that won't be able to compete with better coins.

But what did you expect? You are going to find some of the most convinced people about bitcoin here on the forum and reddit, it is like trying to talk about the limitations of gold in a forum about gold, it is obvious they are not going to be very open to criticism even if what you are saying is completely true, also since those people have a good knowledge about bitcoin then most likely they know that and they are not interested in hearing it again.
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