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Author Topic: [XPM] Why Primecoin is Useless, Doomed to Fail?  (Read 13667 times)
eCoinomist (OP)
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August 14, 2013, 06:23:01 AM
Last edit: August 15, 2013, 12:27:10 PM by eCoinomist
 #1

[XPM] Investment Analysis: Why Primecoin is Useless, Doomed to Fail?

1) Primecoin is not a Commodity

Unlike Bitcoin, there is no cap to how many Primecoins will be made. What determines XPM production rate is the demand. XPM is not scarce – this is what drives BTC prices up constantly.

Due to difficulty algorithm of Prime, here is what happens:

Demand Increase -> Supply Decrease

Demand Decrease -> Supply Increase

 (higher demand -> higher difficulty -> less reward per block, but the rate of block generation per day is dynamically adjusted by the client to be stable at approximately 1400 blocks per day. => that means higher demands leads to less Primecoins production rate per day).

Primecoin:
- 1 block per minute.....How often is difficulty retargetting?
- Reward is 999 divided by the square of the difficulty....So,

diff    reward
8   15.609375
9   12.33333333
10   9.99

==========
That means when demand plummets, Primecoin price can bottom out to zero, but when demand rises fast, its price can sky rocket above BTC's level very easily.

This characteristic, while appealing to day traders, because of huge price swings as we have observed, is a bad element for long term investors - unlike bitcoin, there is no guarantee or a logical prediction that each XPM you hold will gain value in the future .

Put it this way: when demand decreases, the difficulty will drop, that means there will be more Primecoins mined everyday, but since no one wants them anymore, it will be unprofitable for miner to keep mining, so they give up, leading to more difficulty drop, which means even more Primecoins will be generated, and so on... until everyone have a huge stash of Prime worth exactly nothing (by which time your investment has evaporated). This is why it's a very bad idea to invest in Primecoin.

2) Primecoin is not a Currency

Prime is less secure than bitcoin, more prone to 51% attack (attack can happen with even less than 50% priming power) as stated in white paper.

Prime still takes minutes to confirm, not 3-4 seconds like Visa => no average Joe will ever use it, even if Sunny has plans to promote it, speaking of which...

There is no plan for any further development. This start to look like PPC - pump and dump scheme, just waiting for the next Primecoin alt to be released with a few parameters changed, like different difficulty algo, for example.

Besides that, Primecoin is pretty much a Bitcoin clone with different hashing algorithm.

3) Conclusion

If you release a new PrimeClone that is exactly the same as Primecoin but with limited, lets say, 20M coins cap, it will quickly get more interest than Primecoin, because your PrimeClone will be scarce and will attract long term investors.

Demand is simply perception,

Perception is based on believes,

When people stop believing all the crap talk about Primecoin, such as usefulness for scientific research (because some smart mathematicians have spoken out in this forum confirming no validity of such arguments, but pure speculations) the demand will fall. Shortly followed by price drop and VPS mining farms down.

By the time only botnet scammers remain operating, Primecoin is over, paving way for PrimeClone or something else, or perhaps Sunny can make a new coin based on new innovative hashing algorithm!

Even his supporters got pissed when he announced Primecoin last month!
This is hilarious, check it out.

========
Rumor/Truth? (you decide!)

Primecoin does have purpose other than solving for primes. It's meant as an attack for mining market share. The plan is that this will help gain acceptance of PPCoin in the long term. Whether this actually happens we'll have to wait and see.

Sunny King says it best here:

http://www.ppcointalk.org/index.php?topic=288.msg1715#msg1715

erk
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August 14, 2013, 06:28:35 AM
 #2

Same problem with fiat, no cap on how much is in circulation, very inflationary.
usahero
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August 14, 2013, 06:47:20 AM
 #3

I don't agree with you with many points and I don't think your claims are logically argumented/supported.  But I do welcome negativity coming from your post, as I would like to rebuy some of xpm at cheap prices, just like last time Smiley)
crendore
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August 14, 2013, 06:48:53 AM
 #4

This guy has been mining primecoin since day 1.  He's just trying to drive the price down so he can buy more. i wouldn't put any stock in this drivel.

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August 14, 2013, 06:50:24 AM
 #5

This guy has been mining primecoin since day 1.  He's just trying to drive the price down so he can buy more. i wouldn't put any stock in this drivel.

+1

ebmarket.co
vinne81
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August 14, 2013, 07:00:12 AM
 #6

This guy has been mining primecoin since day 1.  He's just trying to drive the price down so he can buy more. i wouldn't put any stock in this drivel.

+1

I mine XPM since day 1, still mining. I don't agree with the OP, but still... apart from the innovative algorithm, primecoin is just... a coin. Like the others. I don't see why primecoin should be the chosen coin to survive while others will die.

What reasons are there for primecoin to survive? (please no "primes help science" , these chains we are finding are virtually useless for science)
cryptocoinsnews
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August 14, 2013, 07:00:16 AM
 #7

http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/08/14/xpm-why-primecoin-is-useless-doomed-to-fail/

/David Parker, Director of CCN
maco
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August 14, 2013, 07:04:43 AM
Last edit: August 14, 2013, 07:18:57 AM by maco
 #8

When did anyone say primecoin confirms in seconds?
- Link?

I am not expecting you to link me to your blog.

It isn't only a different hashing algorithm...  Primecoin has so far
proven more energy efficient, and increased likelihood for most computer users to mine XPM.

Sure, it won't get you to mine a lot of primecoins daily,
but at least it is possible for those with no hope.

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits.
I rather ask the next generation of tech boomers, 10 years from now,
how and why these are useful to them with their current technology.
Maybe, you won't see a benefit now or maybe you will. Let's see.

Which group are you going to be apart of... 
The people walking and taking action in the search for primes? and better our technology?
crendore
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August 14, 2013, 07:05:45 AM
 #9


This article says exactly the same thing as you just posted here.  This is such sensationalist writing, just to try to get clicks to your blog.  You are adding nothing to the community but FUD.

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August 14, 2013, 07:08:20 AM
 #10

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits. What can these numbers do?

I seriously doubt these prime numbers we find have any purpose at all, now or in the future Smiley
erk
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August 14, 2013, 07:12:16 AM
Last edit: August 14, 2013, 07:24:41 AM by erk
 #11

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits. What can these numbers do?

I seriously doubt these prime numbers we find have any purpose at all, now or in the future Smiley

There not prime numbers, they are Cunningham chains.

http://primes.utm.edu/notes/faq/why.html

Some say they are looking for the mathematical fingerprint of God, like Carl Sagan wrote about Pi in his book Contact.

Or http://rense.com/RodinAerodynamics.htm

Perhaps they are just nutters.

maco
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August 14, 2013, 07:12:35 AM
 #12

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits. What can these numbers do?

I seriously doubt these prime numbers we find have any purpose at all, now or in the future Smiley

Integration of FPU
krasnyoktyabr
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August 14, 2013, 07:18:10 AM
 #13

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits. What can these numbers do?

I seriously doubt these prime numbers we find have any purpose at all, now or in the future Smiley

Yep. If it were something deemed academically important, a lot more than a few hundred/thousand CPUs in a small community would be working on it. I'm not suggesting that this vein (prime chains) has no purpose or will have no purpose, but the amount of work being done on primecoin will not be significant. If it is found that these chains are of extreme importance for some reason, the work of primecoin could be overshadowed in a very short period of time.

I don't dislike primecoin, but it doesn't do an appreciable amount of work over a normal hashed coin. It might be a step along the road towards improving the value of hashing, but more than likely it is just making the botnets richer.

I would be more than happy to eat crow, but it shall remain to be seen.
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August 14, 2013, 07:23:11 AM
 #14

Yep. If it were something deemed academically important, a lot more than a few hundred/thousand CPUs in a small community would be working on it. I'm not suggesting that this vein (prime chains) has no purpose or will have no purpose, but the amount of work being done on primecoin will not be significant. If it is found that these chains are of extreme importance for some reason, the work of primecoin could be overshadowed in a very short period of time.

I don't dislike primecoin, but it doesn't do an appreciable amount of work over a normal hashed coin. It might be a step along the road towards improving the value of hashing, but more than likely it is just making the botnets richer.

I would be more than happy to eat crow, but it shall remain to be seen.

Agreed. Imo, there will be bagholders. They can then be happy that they served science  Cool
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August 14, 2013, 07:30:56 AM
 #15

Prime is less secure than bitcoin, more prone to 51% attack (attack can happen with even less than 50% priming power) as stated in white paper.

Thats big problem, and attack can happen any time as happened with some other alts.
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August 14, 2013, 07:58:48 AM
 #16

OP is on record as heavily backing Emunie - a closed source, heavily pre-mined crypto currency. The supply of which also varies with demand.

Primecoin is not a currency because it takes 1 minute to confirm? Unlike Bitcoin which takes 5 times longer? lol what a dumbass. Bitcoin was ruled as real money by a US district court this week. Literally nothing in the OP makes any logical sense, can't decide if OP is genuinely mentally challenged or is just trolling with FUD. Probably a combination since he thinks his Internet Explorer logo ripoff was a solid contribution towards the Emunie project.

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bobbahope
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August 14, 2013, 08:30:30 AM
 #17

I think I should address a major issue in your first point.

You say that the supply of primecoins is bound to increase until primecoins are worthless,
but you make the mistake of assuming that demand for primecoins, and computing power bent on mining primecoins are the same.

Given primecoins design where reward falls inversely to difficulty,

The upcoming primecoin gpu miners should make it so that the difficulty rises to the point where even slight interest shall be able to keep the supply of new primecoins negligible, especially given how most miners have gpu based rigs, which should become unprofitable in the next few months.

Hence the supply of primecoins should be very dear, even if for some reason demand for primecoins falls.

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August 14, 2013, 08:40:26 AM
 #18

OP forgot to mention that the block rate and moneysupply are rather stable due to the block reward varying with difficulty.
http://cryptometer.org/primecoin_90_day_charts.html
If anything, then higher (mining) demand increases supply and lower (mining) demand decreases it due to the diff algo not retargeting instantly.

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August 14, 2013, 08:43:26 AM
 #19

Fud more please. XPM is useless now, its too expensive, because VPS' folks are cashin in now instead of us, hard working traders Smiley

useless dump dump dump

cya at 0.0051?


// i'm just trolling


Quote
Due to difficulty algorithm of Prime, here is what happens:

Demand Increase -> Supply Decrease

Demand Decrease -> Supply Increase

OP does not understand the implications of new technology.......... Smiley Whatever.


The more people don't understand the economy, the easier it is to make $$$.
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August 14, 2013, 08:49:02 AM
 #20

When did anyone say primecoin confirms in seconds?
- Link?

I am not expecting you to link me to your blog.

It isn't only a different hashing algorithm...  Primecoin has so far
proven more energy efficient,
yep, but its a moot point. the only reason bitcoin is perceived as inefficient(even though it has  a technical efficiency rating of 98.7%) is probably due to the price ber bitcoin in relation to the price of electricity. should bitcoins dramatically increase in price, this becomes a moot argument, and primecoin will be bereft of its biggest selling point over bitcoin.

and increased likelihood for most computer users to mine XPM.
bull fucking shit, if you aint got 30 fucking servers or a botnet you aint getting shit with primecoin. stop lying.

Sure, it won't get you to mine a lot of primecoins daily,
but at least it is possible for those with no hope.
hmm, now you contradict your claim that primecoin "increases likelihood for most computer users to mine XPM." just stick to the facts next time. you and the OP both get a FUD rating in my opinion cuz neither one of you stick to facts.

At least with Primecoin, I can go to bed knowing, we made progress for future benefits.
I rather ask the next generation of tech boomers, 10 years from now,
how and why these are useful to them with their current technology.
Maybe, you won't see a benefit now or maybe you will. Let's see.

Which group are you going to be apart of... 
The people walking and taking action in the search for primes? and better our technology?

I can see  how someone would easily be goaded into believing that prime chains just mean so much to science, and they are so much more energy efficient, but the reality is, they are of speculative value to science at best, meaning they theoretically have value, but at present time there is no need for them? Bitcoin was created to be secure and thats what it is, the most secure banking system ever invented. i could give 3 fucks less if its "inneficient".  the only reason we perceive it that was the low value due to small userbase. this point in bitcoin history reminds me of the great depression. this too shall pass.

My negative trust rating is reflective of a personal vendetta by someone on default trust.
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