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Author Topic: [XPM] Why Primecoin is Useless, Doomed to Fail?  (Read 13691 times)
FreedomCoin
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August 14, 2013, 04:20:14 PM
 #41

isnt xpm almost worth $1 now? i thought i saw it at .89c per xpm yesterday.

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August 14, 2013, 04:24:02 PM
 #42

isnt xpm almost worth $1 now? i thought i saw it at .89c per xpm yesterday.

Yeah it was even ~1.4$ or so, you see why some retards try to talk crap.... the war of alt coinz just started, its gona be even worst in future, for crap coin to profit you must bash talk all the others

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August 14, 2013, 04:30:46 PM
 #43

op's post

https://i.imgur.com/IuJrm.gif

Srsly. The butthurt is strong with this one.
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August 14, 2013, 04:30:46 PM
 #44

isnt xpm almost worth $1 now? i thought i saw it at .89c per xpm yesterday.

Yeah it was even ~1.4$ or so, you see why some retards try to talk crap.... the war of alt coinz just started, its gona be even worst in future, for crap coin to profit you must bash talk all the others

Compared to BTC and LTC the price is shooting up really quick when looking at how old XPM is. Even if they say the cunningham chains have no use to the science community "at the moment" at least its a unique proof of work. And from what ive heard, so take it with a grain of salt. But attempting to divide prime numbers is harder than breaking SHA and Scrypt when the digits are high enough.

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August 14, 2013, 05:18:47 PM
 #45

Srsly. The butthurt is strong with this one.

Can you elaborate who's butthurt?

Last time I posted that the price has bottomed out and it did.

Did I say anything about how the price will change from now? No I didn't.

Do I know where it will go? Probably.

Back to question #1 - oh wait - I see who is butthurt now Wink

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August 14, 2013, 05:22:12 PM
 #46

eCoinomist: Thank you for your thread and i accept any feedback, being constructive or otherwise. But it seems almost every point you brought up could be said about any coin. Why do you think Primecoin is more useless than others?

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August 14, 2013, 05:24:25 PM
 #47

eCoinomist: Thank you for your thread and i accept any feedback, being constructive or otherwise. But it seems almost every point you brought up could be said about any coin. Why do you think Primecoin is more useless than others?

It requires special miners, the bread an butter of mining is things like cgminer which doesn't work for xpm.
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August 14, 2013, 05:28:06 PM
 #48

Thats because it crunches prime numbers, not SHA or Scrypt like cgminer is designed to do. Thats like designing a wallet that holds all types of coins regardless of currency structure.

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August 14, 2013, 05:28:18 PM
 #49

Also to those who thing finding 9+ digit primenumber is scientically important, havent heard from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Internet_Mersenne_Prime_Search
they have 150+ Tflops/s in it and have found primes which has 12.5+ Million digits.

donations -> btc: 1M6yf45NskQxWXknkMTzQ8o6wShQcSY4EC
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August 14, 2013, 05:30:53 PM
 #50

Also to those who thing finding 9+ digit primenumber is scientically important, havent heard from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Internet_Mersenne_Prime_Search
they have 150+ Tflops/s in it and have found primes which has 12.5+ Million digits.

Errr it's not 9+ digits, it's a 9-chain (or 8- or 10-) or whatever
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August 14, 2013, 05:40:24 PM
 #51

Primecoin does have purpose other than solving for primes. It's meant as an attack for mining market share. The plan is that this will help gain acceptance of PPCoin in the long term. Whether this actually happens we'll have to wait and see.

Sunny King says it best here:

http://www.ppcointalk.org/index.php?topic=288.msg1715#msg1715

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August 14, 2013, 05:50:21 PM
Last edit: August 14, 2013, 06:06:48 PM by erk
 #52

Thats because it crunches prime numbers, not SHA or Scrypt like cgminer is designed to do. Thats like designing a wallet that holds all types of coins regardless of currency structure.
So why isn't there a fork of cgminer to crunch primes? Oh wait, I forgot, it's come from the same line as PPC that doesn't even have p2pool yet does it? But other PPC/PoS forks do:

http://www.ppcointalk.org/index.php?topic=265.0

Seems Sunny King has to call the shots, it's not a community effort. So you end up with a quirky coin that's hard to software support. Still waiting for XPM to appear on coinchoose.





Primecoin does have purpose other than solving for primes. It's meant as an attack for mining market share. The plan is that this will help gain acceptance of PPCoin in the long term. Whether this actually happens we'll have to wait and see.

Sunny King says it best here:

http://www.ppcointalk.org/index.php?topic=288.msg1715#msg1715
That post says little other then FUD about LTC and PoW, it claims PoS is better then doesn't say why! There is a mining industry with millions of dollars invested around PoW coins. They are not going to go away in a hurry. Sunny seems to miss the point about the energy cost of mining. Human labor is required to provide the energy, thus creating intrinsic value for the coin. PoS want to remove that intrinsic value under the guise of energy efficiency, I see this as counter productive.


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August 14, 2013, 06:23:47 PM
 #53

Demand is simply perception,

Perception is based on believes,

So when one stops believing all the crap talk about Primecoin, such as usefulness for scientific research (because some smart mathematicians have spoken out in this forum confirming no validity of such arguments, but pure speculations) the demand will fall. Shortly followed by price drop and VPS mining farms down.

By the time only botnet scammers remain operating, Primecoin is over, paving way for PrimeClone or something else, or perhaps Sunny can make a new coin based on new innovative hashing algorithm!

Even his supporters got pissed when he announced Primecoin last month!
This is hilarious, check it out.
Who cares what the PPC supporters said a month ago?  What are they saying today?  

Personally I laugh over you "smart mathematicians" comment.  Some of the most intelligent math people I know are downright stupid when it comes to dealing with people and real world things.  I once commented in a math thread how 2^9(512) was twice as large as 2^8(256) and a PhD jumped all over me saying it was only 1.125 times as large.  Technically we were both right, 256*2=512 and 9/8=1.125, but it depends on your point of view, and i caused one heck of an unintentional flame war over a simple statement.

Primecoin does have value other than electricity waste, just as the concept behind Curecoin has value other than electricity waste.  The work done on primecoin may one day be usable on things like curecoin, your statements lack insight.  Bitcoin will just continue to be a waste of electricity.

Your point on the 'no limit' VS limit, while intriging, is also kind of shoprtsighted.  Look at playstation for example.  When the PS3 came out, the people who got one of the first ones eagerly sold them to people who had to be 1st and made a bundle.  I bought my PS3 over a year after the release and I paid the same as the people who got the 1st ones.  Millions of PS3's have been produced since I bought mine, but I can still buy a new one for roughly what I bought mine at.

Now look at Magic the Gathering.  Bitcoin = Beta, Litecoin = Unlimited, ?coin = Revised and all the other altcoins = the various expansions.  MTG is both limited and unlimited in a way, kinda like the various crytpocoins.  I remember Ice Age coming out and getting a Jester's Cap, worth $50 at the time!  Since some of the early cards were over $2,000 I held on to it.  Today it's worth $5 and some of those $2,000 cards are under $400 and some has gone up insanely (mainly due to CGC grading).  No one cared THAT much about grading when they were $2000, but boy they sure do now.  Bitcoins don't have that luxury though, they aren't all that rare (I've mined over 5 BTC total between mining it and ALT coins) and their value depends on demand.  April's jump to $250 after it 'went public' and people wanted one lasted microseconds.  The recent plummet to $60 showed a lot of people bailing on it.  The current price seems close to the 'stable point', but that depends on the next hype or bailout.

If you want to use real-world terms, Bitcoin is technically *not* a currency, it is a commodity, like Gold, Silver, Tin, Iron, etc.  People call the halving of block rewards similar to Gold mining... the longer you mine the less is left available to find.  Bitcoin will end up like Gold today... mined by a stubborn few indivduals for the minute flecks and chunks they find and mass-mined by corporations as long as the cost does not exceed the income.  The more BTC climbs in price, the more you will see huge hubs mining it just like the gold mining companies useing acid-leeching to get the last minute dregs of gold from a huge pile of dirt.

Where does that leave Primecoin?  I see Primecoin as iron to BTC's gold.  There's a heck of a lot of it available to be mined, but it's at a fixed rate due to demand.

ASICs are the gold corporations of the BTC world.  Problem is that they are flooding into the marketplace and soon only the strong will 'survive' as difficulty climbs through the roof.  I think most people's estimates are way off... I forsee bitcoin reaching 1PH by Sept 1 with a likelyhood of 6PH+ by Oct 1.  Maybe now is the time to invest in BTC... the price increase caused by difficulty increases will do more damage to ALL altcoins than all your 'predictions'.

I do not suffer fools gladly... "Captain!  We're surrounded!"
I embrace my inner Kool-Aid.
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August 14, 2013, 06:42:23 PM
 #54

Here is something useful to do with Primecoins which you can not do with any other coin yet.

http://www.primecoinnews.com/

Use it to keep track of relevant URLs and put some weight behind your word with primecoins and profit when others like it.

FUN FACT: The site is run from a server which mined a bunch of coins in the early days...
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August 14, 2013, 08:33:51 PM
 #55

eCoinomist: Thank you for your thread and i accept any feedback, being constructive or otherwise. But it seems almost every point you brought up could be said about any coin. Why do you think Primecoin is more useless than others?

No, Bitcoing has a cap of about 21million coins, and so do many alt, that makes them commodity with some element of scarcity as I already pointed out in OP.

Most Scrypt miners will need at least 51% of network to do attack, but Primecoin can be taken for less.

I did not compare Primecoin against any other altcoins, but for reference, DigitalCoin has better confirmation speed.

Primecoin's days are numbered, as soon as PrimeClone comes out with some coin cap and better difficulty algorithm.

PS.
There many ppl posting in this thread attacking me personally, but if you analyse their replies, you'll find nothing but FUD.
They are trying to defend Primecoin because most likely they were greedy and just bought in after seeing Primecoin price increase lately.

Non of the disagreeing replies posted here so far has been backed by facts and proofs or logical deduction.

A OP like mine, which is the result of logical analysis and real world experience of mining Primecoin myself, is obviously a threat to these people.

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August 14, 2013, 08:52:14 PM
 #56

You are just full of shit..... and you have your agenda to talk crap and fud all for you greed and profit with some scam shit you hold

first of all, the primecoin have no cap will not bother anyone, why?
because as network power grow and GPU miners hit there will be deflation and not inflation as you say!

Also you CAN NOT 51% attack if primecoin is mined on ~300 000 CPU`s so you bullshit less then 51% attack is insane!

Also slow diff retarget will not make miners leave coin for few days like FTC crap and your crap coin which you hold!

Also your are insane if you say solo mining is not profitable?Huh, mine one i5 CPU now mine a block in ~3-4 days, so far i have mined 400+ coins in a month that`s like almost 400$!

even with 6-7 blocks a month thats 50$ at least! so just pls STFU

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eCoinomist (OP)
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August 15, 2013, 06:57:30 AM
Last edit: August 15, 2013, 07:12:45 AM by eCoinomist
 #57

You are just full of shit..... and you have your agenda to talk crap and fud all for you greed and profit with some scam shit you hold

first of all, the primecoin have no cap will not bother anyone, why?
because as network power grow and GPU miners hit there will be deflation and not inflation as you say!

Also you CAN NOT 51% attack if primecoin is mined on ~300 000 CPU`s so you bullshit less then 51% attack is insane!

Also slow diff retarget will not make miners leave coin for few days like FTC crap and your crap coin which you hold!

Also your are insane if you say solo mining is not profitable?Huh, mine one i5 CPU now mine a block in ~3-4 days, so far i have mined 400+ coins in a month that`s like almost 400$!

even with 6-7 blocks a month thats 50$ at least! so just pls STFU

All I hear is the sound of upset troll in here.

1) When GPU hits, there will be huge inflation initially, not deflation, you noob

2) cannot 51% attack 300,000 CPU? Lmao, if GPUs are 50 times faster when it comes out, it won't take more than a handful of Large GPU miners collabrating together to take Primecoin down.

3) I only hold BTC, LTC and XPM atm, so if your say they are crap, then may I know what it is that you are holding which is not crap?

4) I never said solomining is not profitable, so STFU yourself

5) Yeah, right, congratulations for mining a whopping 400 XPM! If I remember correctly, I think I dumped that much in one day.. Uhm... I must have been really dumb. Undecided

Happy making your $50/month, I really admire your sound business advice Smiley

usahero
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August 15, 2013, 07:20:19 AM
 #58

51% attack doesn't take the coin down. It just make attacker able to double/triple/whatever-spend.

bitcoin has cap limit 21 million somewhere in future, but you claimed "Unlike Bitcoin, there is no cap to how many Primecoins will be made per year.", which is factually incorrect. Also there is no guarantee bitcoin's reward algorithm will always stay that way, also there is no guarantee that bitcoin's reward algorithm is optimal.


Quote
Due to difficulty algorithm of Prime, here is what happens:

Demand Increase -> Supply Decrease

Demand Decrease -> Supply Increase

Due to reward algorithm, these claims can be invalidated given the right variable values, variables being hashing speed of technology being used. It is hard to expect supply increase given there will be hashing speed jump in near future.

2) Primecoin is not a Currency


It is just as much currecny as any other crypto-currency. Now if you name it differently, thats semantics.


If you release a new PrimeClone that is exactly the same as Primecoin but with limited, lets say, 20M coins cap,

I have not done calculation, but there is a chance we would have to wait many years to reach 20 million coins. At the rate 15000 day, we would have to wait 3.5 years+ to reach 20 million. I am pretty sure that reward will go down so the time required to reach 20 million coins will be much higher. 3.5 years in crypto world is a lot. Most coins either die or flourish by then.


Basically every other coin has similar weaknesses as you claim for xpm.
FoldingTime
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August 15, 2013, 08:07:02 AM
 #59

eCoinomist: Thank you for your thread and i accept any feedback, being constructive or otherwise. But it seems almost every point you brought up could be said about any coin. Why do you think Primecoin is more useless than others?

It requires special miners, the bread an butter of mining is things like cgminer which doesn't work for xpm.

Actually, the opposite. Any computer can mine XPM, however, you need dedicated mining rigs to mine all the other non-CPU friendly coins.
erk
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August 15, 2013, 08:10:47 AM
 #60

eCoinomist: Thank you for your thread and i accept any feedback, being constructive or otherwise. But it seems almost every point you brought up could be said about any coin. Why do you think Primecoin is more useless than others?

It requires special miners, the bread an butter of mining is things like cgminer which doesn't work for xpm.

Actually, the opposite. Any computer can mine XPM, however, you need dedicated mining rigs to mine all the other non-CPU friendly coins.
What are you going on about? You can't CPU mine XPM with cgminer, as I said, it requires a special miner. You seem to be confusing a miner with a mining rig.

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