BFL Announces 600GH/s 28nm PCIe Mining Card

[Dalkore]

Everyone read this:

I have a July 15 2012 pre-order for 2 ASIC SC Singles and I still don't have them to this day. I am coming from a group buy upgrade so I can't really get a refund. I am thankful people with PayPal/Credit Cards were able to get their refunds.

Screw BFL.

Im coming from a July 10 2012 preorder for an Single and still havent received mine either, and of course we paid on the day we ordered.
Backing this post. FUCK THEM and their lies.

The fact that they go and announce this with plans to ship BEFORE THEY HAVE EVEN FINISHED THEIR CURRENT YEAR+ QUEUE IS BEYOND ME

Anyone who falls for this is fucking out of their mind.

Its the same thing they did when they announced ASIC and they have a 6 month backorder of FPGA singles.  How soon everyone forgets. sigh...

[k9quaint]

I pre-ordered multiple ASIC SCs, and I've received most of them. The rest were ordered later, and they haven't gotten to them yet.

You received your gear too late. You would have done better to order your BTC from MtGox or BTC-E than from BFL. 85% of the people who ordered from BFL haven't received their gear at all.

Out of all the hardware being offered, this new Monarch's claimed specs seem to be the most profitable, and I don't imagine any new hardware coming along and changing that.

Really? In the next 14 months, nobody can beat a VB.NET engineer at making hardware?

(KNC is also 28nm, but it's not a full-custom chip. BitFury is a fully-custom chip, but it's only 45nm, not 28nm. Both are just starting to roll out, and neither has any units in customer's hands. Avalon or ASICMiner could die-shrink, but I don't think that will help. They'd have to redo everything to accommodate a larger, multiple-hashing-core design.)

Bitfury is already in the market. There is at least one mining concern running 40TH/s composed bitfury devices.

So they have a spotty track record, but they've always delivered. They seem to have the best product for sale (or pre-order, depending on how you look at it). Why shouldn't I buy one? Or 10?

BFL actually has the worst products for sale because time is a very large variable. Better to have a PCI card that does 300MH/s in 2010 than a PCI card that does 600GH/s in 2015.

No one? The only thing I seem to be reading in this thread is the same old bullshit I've been hearing since I started looking into them over a year and a half ago.

It was too easy. Most people don't bother to shoot fish in a barrel. I just like fish.
Plus, this is the ghetto monarch thread. Try the main thread at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=276692.0

[Perseus353]

The question in all this is whether they will again underestimate the heat problem and fail to meet the design that they've announced -- as happened with the Jalapeno and Mini Rig.

[eve]

The question in all this is whether they will again underestimate the heat problem and fail to meet the design that they've announced -- as happened with the Jalapeno and Mini Rig.

We just don't know why someone wants to open a thread on Butterfly when it is consider a Scam.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

The question in all this is whether they will again underestimate the heat problem and fail to meet the design that they've announced -- as happened with the Jalapeno and Mini Rig.

We just don't know why someone wants to open a thread on Butterfly when it is consider a Scam.

Because of the news: Butterfly Labs wants to migrate pre-orders to the Monarch, a poisonous insect to most other creatures.

[vulgartrendkill]

The question in all this is whether they will again underestimate the heat problem and fail to meet the design that they've announced -- as happened with the Jalapeno and Mini Rig.

We just don't know why someone wants to open a thread on Butterfly when it is consider a Scam.

Because of the news: Butterfly Labs wants to migrate pre-orders to the Monarch, a poisonous insect to most other creatures.

I really doubt Josh et al got the irony of the name of their new progeny, and if they did, they are meaner than a bag full of pissed off skunks.

[nexus99]

The question in all this is whether they will again underestimate the heat problem and fail to meet the design that they've announced -- as happened with the Jalapeno and Mini Rig.

We just don't know why someone wants to open a thread on Butterfly when it is consider a Scam.

Because of the news: Butterfly Labs wants to migrate pre-orders to the Monarch, a poisonous insect to most other creatures.

I really doubt Josh et al got the irony of the name of their new progeny, and if they did, they are meaner than a bag full of pissed off skunks.

I am sure they hope that Monarch kills everything else off. If they deliver Monarch it will (nothing out there today matches the price/performance)... but they have to deliver and we all know how thin that ice is.

[Ytterbium]

Second, I pre-ordered multiple Singles knowing they would not be delivered when expected. I didn't expect a 12 month wait, but I did account for delays and setbacks when I did my profit calculations. Here is no different. I would not be surprised to see a March delivery. As long as you're realistic and take their timelines with a grain of salt, I think it can still be a good deal. However, their announcement did seem to indicate that they are MUCH farther along in the development than they were when they announced the SC Singles. It sounds like they've already got chips designed and in production. As someone else mentioned earlier, they don't have to worry about PSUs, another setback in the current product line.

You could order from KnC and get your unit in October and have it fully paid off by December or you could pay half as much and sit around for 6 months and get a monarch at a point in time where you make 5% of it's purchase cost per month.

As far as their hardware goes 350W in a PCIe Card?  It's insanity.  AMD has had huge delays on their top of the line cards due to thermal issues. But a GPU doesn't lose it's value if it's 6 months late (at least not for gaming)

If they were doing a $1k, 87W card I wouldn't doubt they'd be able to ship on time, but their proposal is insanity.

[DPoS]

I bet it can run Crysis too!!

I just bought 8

CAN I HAZ ROEYES NOW?

[nexus99]

You could order from KnC and get your unit in October and have it fully paid off by December or you could pay half as much and sit around for 6 months and get a monarch at a point in time where you make 5% of it's purchase cost per month.

Has KNC been able to show a prototype device yet?

[millsdmb]

[erk]

You could order from KnC and get your unit in October and have it fully paid off by December or you could pay half as much and sit around for 6 months and get a monarch at a point in time where you make 5% of it's purchase cost per month.

Has KNC been able to show a prototype device yet?

Of course not, they don't their chips from the fab until Sept. They only did tape out in July.

[symzzi]

I will eat my shoes if this delivers on time with the specs described.

No way it will happen as predicted, the numbers do not add up in any way.

[Ytterbium]

You could order from KnC and get your unit in October and have it fully paid off by December or you could pay half as much and sit around for 6 months and get a monarch at a point in time where you make 5% of it's purchase cost per month.

Has KNC been able to show a prototype device yet?

They've shown the PCB:
https://www.kncminer.com/userfiles/image/ASIC_PCB.jpg

They can load the board up with FPGAs and run it with the same power as the real chips should take in order to test power delivery and thermal load.

[Bicknellski]

Where oh where are the Monarchs?

[Syke]

Where oh where are the Monarchs?

http://www.butterflylabs.com/monarch/

Q: When do the 28nm Monarch cards ship?

A: However, this is our second generation, so we have much greater clarity on the process and plan to begin shipments in February, 2014.

[Bicknellski]

August 19, 2013 by Phillip Archer wrote:

"Their website claims their design is in the final stages of development and will be sending wafers into production shortly.

We’re now we’re in at the final stage of development (Tapeout) and are sending wafers into production at the foundry in the next few weeks.
Foundry production takes 10 weeks.
Bumping, Slicing & BGA packaging takes approximately 2 weeks.
Initial shipments begin and ramp up to full capacity over the following 3 weeks.

Interestingly, they claim to have been working on chip development for 6 months now, meaning there was significant overlap between the period they began 28nm design and were working fixing delays in their 65nm product.

Customers now face the difficult challenge of deciding whether to roll over their current orders or to keep their spot in line. A Monarch delivered in December will be break-even at around a 75% monthly network increase through July. If shipments are pushed back to January, anything over a sustained monthly increase of 59% stops being profitable. Considering that the 500 GH/s rigs have not shipped yet, they seem the most likely candidates for conversion, though realistic expectations for shipping dates will be crucial to any decision."

13 months later still no chips.

[klondike_bar]

August 19, 2013 by Phillip Archer wrote:

"Their website claims their design is in the final stages of development and will be sending wafers into production shortly.

We’re now we’re in at the final stage of development (Tapeout) and are sending wafers into production at the foundry in the next few weeks.
Foundry production takes 10 weeks.
Bumping, Slicing & BGA packaging takes approximately 2 weeks.
Initial shipments begin and ramp up to full capacity over the following 3 weeks.

Interestingly, they claim to have been working on chip development for 6 months now, meaning there was significant overlap between the period they began 28nm design and were working fixing delays in their 65nm product.

Customers now face the difficult challenge of deciding whether to roll over their current orders or to keep their spot in line. A Monarch delivered in December will be break-even at around a 75% monthly network increase through July. If shipments are pushed back to January, anything over a sustained monthly increase of 59% stops being profitable. Considering that the 500 GH/s rigs have not shipped yet, they seem the most likely candidates for conversion, though realistic expectations for shipping dates will be crucial to any decision."

13 months later still no chips.

Think you meant 8 months, 1 week? (at least since the post on august)

either way, its disgusting. BFL-Josh seems to have even stopped bothering to show up and berate forum users

[Bicknellski]

Nope, 13 months based on BFL statements they started the 28nm 6 months before the announcement on August 17th 2013. So counting back that is  July 17 , June 17, May 17, Apr 17, Mar 17 and finally Feb 17 2013.

Source: http://tradeblock.com/research/butterfly-labs-tests-market-tolerance-with-600-ghs-pre-order-announcement/?replytocom=9279?replytocom=9279

Interestingly, they claim to have been working on chip development for 6 months now, meaning there was significant overlap between the period they began 28nm design and were working fixing delays in their 65nm product.

Customers now face the difficult challenge of deciding whether to roll over their current orders or to keep their spot in line. A Monarch delivered in December will be break-even at around a 75% monthly network increase through July. If shipments are pushed back to January, anything over a sustained monthly increase of 59% stops being profitable. Considering that the 500 GH/s rigs have not shipped yet, they seem the most likely candidates for conversion, though realistic expectations for shipping dates will be crucial to any decision.

Why you should never buy from them?

http://tarspublishing.com/butterflyrefund/

[Threader]

When it comes to BFL business practices...this pic says it all