Ripple starts to conquer the world from China

[AmazonStuff]

It has been "released" the network was in use.  If it was an internal closed testnet that would be one thing but the network has been released to the public. 

Have you ever heard of open-beta?

[DeathAndTaxes]

Permission which can be revoked at any point in the future for any reason. 

By the way, how do you plan to revoke sources from 100 of groups which have them now?

Simple.  Release a new version which drops connections from servers older than prior version.  Revoke access to the proprietary closed source binary to those you no longer want to run the server.

[DeathAndTaxes]

It has been "released" the network was in use.  If it was an internal closed testnet that would be one thing but the network has been released to the public.

Have you ever heard of open-beta?

Beta doesn't magically make it open source.  Bitcoin is considered an open-beta and the source code is available.  Imagine that.


Microsoft Windows 8.1 Preview (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/preview)
Closed Source, Beta

Bitcoin
Open Source, Beta

Ripple
Closed Source, Beta

[yvv]

the network has been released to the public

It clearly states "beta" on ripple web page.

By the Open Source Initiative (http://opensource.org/), the Ripple server is not open source.

Not closed source either.

Say 10 years have passed and the source code hasn't been made available "yet".

If it will not be released within several month, no matter closed or open source, it will die.

[AmazonStuff]

It has been "released" the network was in use.  If it was an internal closed testnet that would be one thing but the network has been released to the public.

Have you ever heard of open-beta?

Beta doesn't magically make it open-source.  Bitcoin is considered an open-beta and the source code is available.  Imagine that.


Microsoft Windows 8.1 Preview (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/preview)
Closed Source, Beta

Bitcoin
Open Source, Beta

Ripple
Closed Source, Beta

I agree, beta doesn't magically make it open source, but you must agree that it doesn't make it closed-source neither, that is something that is determined when software is officially released.

[DeathAndTaxes]

If it will not be released within several month, no matter closed or open source, it will die.

It won't be released ... certainly not in the next couple months.  OpenCoin is already distancing itself from Joel comments about wanting (not promising) the source code to be released by the end of the year.  It won't die because it was always intended to be bait and switch.  Just like you are trying to tell me night is day (closed source binary isn't closed source) in a couple months you (and others) will be even more invested and have a dozen excuses/rationals on why the code can't be released yet.

[DeathAndTaxes]

I agree, beta doesn't magically make it open source, but you must agree that it doesn't make it closed-source neither, that is something that is determined when software is officially released.

Of course I don't.  It is closed source until it is released under open source license.  By your "logic" if they NEVER release the source code then it can never be closed source.  Hmm?  Yeah that makes sense.

Source code =/= open source.

Open Source is an open license.  It can't be undone.  If Satoshi showed up tomorrow and said "nope I want Bitcoin to be closed source in the future" he would have no legal authority to do so.  The MIT license grants others the right to modify and distribute the code.  Open Source is about free software (free speech not free beer).  Until it is licensed as open source you are just hoping they will do so in the future.  If they don't?  Well that sucks but you have no legal authority to modify or distribute the code.  Open Source can't be "reversed" and that makes it incredibly powerful.

Ripple Server is closed source until it isn't.  Maybe it will be open sourced in the future but .... maybe it won't.  That is the whole point.

[yvv]

Permission which can be revoked at any point in the future for any reason. 

By the way, how do you plan to revoke sources from 100 of groups which have them now?

Simple.  Release a new version which drops connections from servers older than prior version.  Revoke access to the proprietary closed source binary to those you no longer want to run the server.

You are talking crap here. It is essential for ripple network to have many servers running by different groups. Whatever OpenCoin does, this will not stop those who have server codes continue running their servers. Even if OpenCoin disappear immediately after ripple release, the network will continue to run until somebody is running servers.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Permission which can be revoked at any point in the future for any reason.  

By the way, how do you plan to revoke sources from 100 of groups which have them now?

Simple.  Release a new version which drops connections from servers older than prior version.  Revoke access to the proprietary closed source binary to those you no longer want to run the server.

You are talking crap here. It is essential for ripple network to have many servers running by different groups. Whatever OpenCoin does, this will not stop those who have server codes continue running their servers. Even if OpenCoin disappear immediately after ripple release, the network will continue to run until somebody is running servers.

It isn't essential for OpenCoin that ANYONE but OpenCoin (or approved lackeys) run servers.  It may be essential to your goals but OpenCoin has indicated that the network will work fine with just a handful of servers.   With decent hardware a handful (or one) server could handle tens of thousands of transactions a second without breaking a sweat.

If OpenCoin (and the source code dispaeared) tomorrow you really think the Ripple network could survive?  What someone is going to reverse engineer the server software?  At best that would be an incompatible hard fork.  The existing network operates solely at the will of OpenCoin.  Period.

[yvv]

By your "logic" if they NEVER release the source code then it can never be closed source. 

Dont juggle mister. Closed source software is one which is released under closed license.

[AmazonStuff]

I've been watching what is going on in OpenCoin lately and they are constantly hiring new developers, designers... They started to communicate on their forum, 5 days ago they got their new Director of Communication, new videos are appearing, website is redesigned, I have an impression that they are in a hurry. I think they are in a hurry because they are preparing something for Money2020:

http://www.money2020.com/
https://ripple.com/blog/win-free-tickets-to-the-exclusive-money2020-ripple-developer-conference-and-50000-xrp/

They have a long list of speakers:
Welcome and Introduction – Chris Larsen, CEO
Ripple Technical Overview – Stefan Thomas, CTO
Integrating with Ripple for Merchants and Gateways – Bob Way, Integration Engineer and Brian Keller-Heikkila, CTO of ZipZap, Inc.
Ripple Architecture and Advanced Uses – David Schwartz, Chief Cryptographer and Denis Kiselev, Founder and CEO of SnapSwap, Inc.
and at the last day a Ripple Dev Con will occur.

[yvv]

If OpenCoin (and the source code dispaeared) tomorrow you really think the Ripple network could survive?  What someone is going to reverse engineer the server software?  At best that would be an incompatible hard fork.  The existing network operates solely at the will of OpenCoin.  Period.

What will stop those who are running servers now continue to do it?

[DeathAndTaxes]

If OpenCoin (and the source code dispaeared) tomorrow you really think the Ripple network could survive?  What someone is going to reverse engineer the server software?  At best that would be an incompatible hard fork.  The existing network operates solely at the will of OpenCoin.  Period.

What will stop those who are running servers now continue to do it?

With no bugfixes, improvements, enhancements ever?  No the network wouldn't insta-die but imagine Satoshi had kept Bitcoin closed source and then disapeared.  Do you think Bitcoin would have flourished?

[yvv]

Beta doesn't magically make it open source.  Bitcoin is considered an open-beta and the source code is available.  Imagine that.


Microsoft Windows 8.1 Preview (http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/preview)
Closed Source, Beta

Bitcoin
Open Source, Beta

Ripple
Closed Source, Beta

MtGox
Closed Source, Not Beta

MWHAHAHAHA!

[yvv]

With no bugfixes, improvements, enhancements ever?  No the network wouldn't insta-die but imagine Satoshi had kept Bitcoin closed source and then disapeared.  Do you think Bitcoin would have flourished?

Hundred different groups have rippled sources. What is a problem with bugfixes, improvements and enhancements?

[DeathAndTaxes]

By your "logic" if they NEVER release the source code then it can never be closed source. 

Dont juggle mister. Closed source software is one which is released under closed license.

Which the server IS otherwise it would include a copy of the source code and a open license.

You do understand that in contract law there is the concept of default provisions.  Unless otherwise licensed the code and any resulting binaries are the property of OpenCoin, Inc.   

Likewise lets say Microsoft's servers got hacked and someone released a complete copy of the windows source code.  It wouldn't be open source.  The source code would still belong to Microsoft, they would have the legal authority to go after those who distribute and modify it.  Now people could (and likely would) make unauthorized copies but unless the source code is licensed using an open license it remains the property of the owner.  The source code remains the property of OpenCoin, the haven't licensed it.  The server is a closed source, and proprietary.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Hundred different groups have rippled sources. What is a problem with bugfixes, improvements and enhancements?

No they don't.  The ripple server (rippled) is released as binary only.  Nobody has a copy of the source code except OpenCoin, Inc.   Even if someone did it would be no different than stealing source code from Microsoft.  It continues to remain the property of the owner and that owner could seek legal action against those who fraudulently use, modify, or distribute it.  If OpenCoin went bankrupt before releasing the source code under an open source license the assets of OpenCoin could be bought by another company say PayPal for the sole purpose of killing the project.

[DeathAndTaxes]

MtGox
Closed Source, Not Beta

I don't have to use MtGox to use Bitcoin.  I have to use the proprietary closed source ripple network to use Ripple.
See the difference?

[yvv]

Hundred different groups have rippled sources. What is a problem with bugfixes, improvements and enhancements?

No they don't.  The ripple server (rippled) is released as binary only.  Nobody has a copy of the source code except OpenCoin, Inc.   Even if someone did it would be no different than stealing source code from Microsoft.  It continues to remain the property of the owner and that owner could seek legal action against those who fraudulently use, modify, or distribute it.  If OpenCoin went bankrupt before releasing the source code under an open source license the assets of OpenCoin could be bought by another company say PayPal for the sole purpose of killing the project.

https://ripple.com/wiki/Rippled#Rippled

Rippled is the server component of the Ripple network. The source code is not currently publicly available. Rippled will be open sourced soon.

Early access to the source code is available to select business partners. If you are planning a Ripple based business and are interested in early access, please contact partners@ripple.com

You can talk to people who have rippled source code on ripple forum.

[yvv]

I don't have to use MtGox to use Bitcoin. 

Only in theory. Bitcoin is damn cool and damn useless without currency exchange. By MtGox I mean any centralized exchange.