If Bitcoins Go Up Will USB Bitcoin Miners Be Profitable?

[marketorder]

Ok as of right now you can't make a profit off of those USB miners. But what if the price shoots up to $250 per coin or even higher in the future? Will you then be able to make a profit off of those USB miners?

[-ck]

If you buy 1 bitcoin now and the value of bitcoin rises, you have made a profit. Not so if you pay with the usb miner and you never recoup the same amount. Doesn't make sense using that as an argument.

[dwdoc]

Ok as of right now you can't make a profit off of those USB miners. But what if the price shoots up to $250 per coin or even higher in the future? Will you then be able to make a profit off of those USB miners?

If you compare mining revenue to instead just holding the purchase price of the hardware in btc the value of btc compared to fiat is irrelevant.

[chriswilmer]

In the defense of the OP, if bitcoins were worth $infinity, so that USD denominated electricity costs were zero, and assuming that there is a finite amount of silicon in the earth from which to manufacture ASIC miners... all miners will reach positive ROI, although you may have to wait several million years.

The short answer is: unlikely.

[lucazane]

if you buy a USB miner at 30$ and in 3 years 1 BTC worth 1000$ => you have  a ROI ^^

[Nancarrow]

You don't buy a USB miner for any amount of $. Rather you buy it for a certain amount of BTC. The question is then whether or not you get back more BTC than the miner cost you. And it's looking like, for all the miners sold in the last three months or so, and probably all the ones coming in the next six to nine months, the answer is no, you won't even get those BTC back, let alone get any more.

Made up example: say BTC1=$120 now, and you order a miner from FlarbleASIC for BTC1. It comes in a few days, you start mining straight away. But difficulty keeps rising exponentially for several months, then it levels off, but by then it costs more $ in electricity than it makes in BTC. So you switch it off. You look at the total amount of BTC you mined. It's BTC0.7.

That means you lost BTC0.3, and there's no two ways about it. You've got 0.7 but if you hadn't bought the miner you'd have 1.0.

Ah but, you say, what if I'd spent $120 to buy that one bitcoin, and by the time I've got BTC0.7, the exchange rate is $20000 per bitcoin? Then you could sell your BTC0.7 for $14000, and you've made a profit of $13880. Sweet! Yes, but the profit was made entirely from the appreciation in exchange rate, NOT the mining. If you'd just bought the bitcoin and NOT the miner you'd have made a profit of $19880. All the miner has really done for you is cost you $6000!

ETA: in fact it wouldn't even matter if your purchase IS conducted entirely in $ not BTC. The same principle would apply. If the exchange rate shot up massively you'd make $, but only BECAUSE OF THE EXCHANGE RATE, not because of the miner, and you WOULD have made more if you HADN'T bought the miner.

[dwdoc]

if you buy a USB miner at 30$ and in 3 years 1 BTC worth 1000$ => you have  a ROI ^^

Just buy $30 worth of btc.

[Bitweasil]

The convoluted math that goes on to try and justify a bad purchase is always funny.

And everyone seems to assume bitcoin will always go up. Which it does, as long as you ignore the times it drops. Much like the housing market!

[eafdeafd]

As difficulty keeps increasing exponentially, it's unlikely that USB miners will be profitable. Even if BTC rises quite a bit, you have to factor in things like electricity cost and mining difficulty.

[dwdoc]

As difficulty keeps increasing exponentially, it's unlikely that USB miners will be profitable. Even if BTC rises quite a bit, you have to factor in things like electricity cost and mining difficulty.

The price of BTC whether it rises or falls is irrelevant. All that matters is whether you generate more BTC mining then the amount in BTC you spent on hardware and electricity.

[Beastlymac]

Actually you can purchase a USB miner for $ eBay etc are good examples also ssinc sells them for $~28 PayPal. So if in its lifetime you mine 0.05 and the value of btc goes up to $1000 you will have got a roi.

[Bitweasil]

Actually you can purchase a USB miner for $ eBay etc are good examples also ssinc sells them for $~28 PayPal. So if in its lifetime you mine 0.05 and the value of btc goes up to $1000 you will have got a roi.

Please counter the following:

If I buy Bitcoin with $28 right now, I get around 0.24 btc.

If Bitcoin then goes up to $1000, I have $240.  Not $50.

If your argument for ROI involves bitcoin going up, YOU ARE BETTER OFF BUYING BITCOIN than buying a miner.

There is no logical argument to spend more for a device than it will ever return unless you have very specific requirements (such as being in a country that will not allow you to buy bitcoin easily).

Paying 0.3 btc for a device that may return 0.1 btc is stupidity, no matter how much the price of bitcoin goes up.  You'd have been better off buying bitcoin directly!

//EDIT: To be crystal clear and concise:  Any argument about mining ROI that includes "Bitcoin going up" is worse off than just buying bitcoin at the current price.

[dwdoc]

Actually you can purchase a USB miner for $ eBay etc are good examples also ssinc sells them for $~28 PayPal. So if in its lifetime you mine 0.05 and the value of btc goes up to $1000 you will have got a roi.

If you had just bought btc with your $'s instead of the miner you would be better off. Therefore no ROI.

[Beastlymac]

Actually you can purchase a USB miner for $ eBay etc are good examples also ssinc sells them for $~28 PayPal. So if in its lifetime you mine 0.05 and the value of btc goes up to $1000 you will have got a roi.

Please counter the following:

If I buy Bitcoin with $28 right now, I get around 0.24 btc.

If Bitcoin then goes up to $1000, I have $240.  Not $50.

If your argument for ROI involves bitcoin going up, YOU ARE BETTER OFF BUYING BITCOIN than buying a miner.

There is no logical argument to spend more for a device than it will ever return unless you have very specific requirements (such as being in a country that will not allow you to buy bitcoin easily).

Paying 0.3 btc for a device that may return 0.1 btc is stupidity, no matter how much the price of bitcoin goes up.  You'd have been better off buying bitcoin directly!

//EDIT: To be crystal clear and concise:  Any argument about mining ROI that includes "Bitcoin going up" is worse off than just buying bitcoin at the current price.

I never said it was a good option. I am just saying a roi in $ is possible. Basing you chances of roi on the price of btc going up is never a good idea.

Actually you can purchase a USB miner for $ eBay etc are good examples also ssinc sells them for $~28 PayPal. So if in its lifetime you mine 0.05 and the value of btc goes up to $1000 you will have got a roi.

If you had just bought btc with your $'s instead of the miner you would be better off. Therefore no ROI.

True but you are still achieving a roi in $

[bcp19]

Ok as of right now you can't make a profit off of those USB miners. But what if the price shoots up to $250 per coin or even higher in the future? Will you then be able to make a profit off of those USB miners?

The simple answer is no.  Since the USB are priced as BTC, if BTC = $250 the .18BTC = $45.  If BTC = $1000 that .18BTC = $180.  AM's using BTC as the steady-state price = no chance of RoI (unless he sells them for .01BTC)

[polarhei]

Your mentioned should be the current fiat price.

Currently, more the better. The small amount like 330Mhash/s unless you have a way to re-construct for Scrypt(N,1,1) or Scrypt (1024,1,1) array, You only protect the network instead of making profit in fiat.

Additionally, the methods of finding. Currently the finding method is currently not so optimal due to the additional stable cost like air conditioning. If you do something in nerd way like repack your "rig" as engines, you will be safe from the cooling cost as the cooling cost kills your efforts.


If you want to win the match, Only three ways. Obtaining more hashrate, Doing scryptmining or Finding a way to reconstruct the Scrypt (1024,1,1) array with your current usb miners.

[timk225]

There is a way to make money with USB miners.  You'd need to have a lot of them (like hundreds or thousands) pimping away for you.

The only problem is that you would normally pay for the miners, either in $ or BTC.  And that ruins the profit for a long time to come.

So the solution, although not entirely LEGAL in the strictest definition of the word, would be to steal or otherwise obtain USB miners in a way that costs you no $ or BTC.

Then you would have only profit from mining with them.

So you need to find the location of these ASIC companies and go visit them late at night.....

It's better to mine Scrypt coins, where the resale value of the GPUs will stay.

[Zeek_W]

To ROI with a USB ASIC is to buy them via a group buy here or somewhere cheap. Then onsell them on ebay for more. Instant ROI!

[cardcomm]

You don't buy a USB miner for any amount of $. Rather you buy it for a certain amount of BTC. The question is then whether or not you get back more BTC than the miner cost you. And it's looking like, for all the miners sold in the last three months or so, and probably all the ones coming in the next six to nine months, the answer is no, you won't even get those BTC back, let alone get any more.

Made up example: say BTC1=$120 now, and you order a miner from FlarbleASIC for BTC1. It comes in a few days, you start mining straight away. But difficulty keeps rising exponentially for several months, then it levels off, but by then it costs more $ in electricity than it makes in BTC. So you switch it off. You look at the total amount of BTC you mined. It's BTC0.7.

That means you lost BTC0.3, and there's no two ways about it. You've got 0.7 but if you hadn't bought the miner you'd have 1.0.

Ah but, you say, what if I'd spent $120 to buy that one bitcoin, and by the time I've got BTC0.7, the exchange rate is $20000 per bitcoin? Then you could sell your BTC0.7 for $14000, and you've made a profit of $13880. Sweet! Yes, but the profit was made entirely from the appreciation in exchange rate, NOT the mining. If you'd just bought the bitcoin and NOT the miner you'd have made a profit of $19880. All the miner has really done for you is cost you $6000!

ETA: in fact it wouldn't even matter if your purchase IS conducted entirely in $ not BTC. The same principle would apply. If the exchange rate shot up massively you'd make $, but only BECAUSE OF THE EXCHANGE RATE, not because of the miner, and you WOULD have made more if you HADN'T bought the miner.

Excellent, well articulated example!

[marketorder]

You can group buy USB miners? If so what section of the forums would I find this in?

To ROI with a USB ASIC is to buy them via a group buy here or somewhere cheap. Then onsell them on ebay for more. Instant ROI!