[2018-02-12]Bitmain To Release Ethereum ASIC Miner F3 With 72Gb DDR3 Dram In Q2

[QuintLeo]

Or the F3 isn't an ethash miner - perhaps it's for some other algorithm?

[1714817425]

1714817425

[nerdralph]

Or the F3 isn't an ethash miner - perhaps it's for some other algorithm?

Equihash (zcash) has more room for optimization in an ASIC than ethash.  The first round in equihash is dominated by blake hash speed, which is much faster in an ASIC than a GPU (and Bitmain already has blake miners).  The subsequent rounds can be significantly faster with a modest-sized multi-banked SRAM.  Something with 256 banks of 1KB should be at least 2x faster than a Rx 480, even if the ASIC is clocked below 1Ghz.

[QuintLeo]

Or the F3 isn't an ethash miner - perhaps it's for some other algorithm?

Equihash (zcash) has more room for optimization in an ASIC than ethash.  The first round in equihash is dominated by blake hash speed, which is much faster in an ASIC than a GPU (and Bitmain already has blake miners).  The subsequent rounds can be significantly faster with a modest-sized multi-banked SRAM.  Something with 256 banks of 1KB should be at least 2x faster than a Rx 480, even if the ASIC is clocked below 1Ghz.

The numbers in that F3 video are NOT consistent with it being an Equihash miner - it was showing over 2 THOUSAND times more hashrate than a GTX 1080 ti.

I was thinking more likely Lyra2RE2 or perhaps Nist5.

[SDRebel]

Also this is interesting....

https://www.ccn.com/ethereum-developer-opens-eip-to-discuss-bricking-ethash-asic-miners/

An Ethereum developer has opened an Ethereum Improvement Proposal (EIP) to discuss whether the community should modify its Ethash mining algorithm to maintain ASIC resistance.  The EIP is a direct response to reports that Bitmain — by far the largest manufacturer of mining rigs that use Application Specific Integrated Circuit (ASIC) chips — has developed an Ethash ASIC miner and will begin shipping them within the next several months.

- by the way the same proposal to change algorithm was for the SIA coin, after Bitmain launched it's miner.    But finally SIA decided not to do so.

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.

180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

On the other hand, at $800 they WILL sell these things probably as fast as they can make them, for a while.

First batch isn't shipping 'till mid-July though - achieving 100% ROI is going to be a bit iffy even if POS gets pushed back a couple more times.

http://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180403174908564M8dMJKtz06B7

Note that Bitmain would have to sell well over ONE MILLION of these units to double the current ETH Network Hashrate (at current numbers right around 1.75 million, then add in a few hundred thousand more to cover ETC and the other forked ethash coins).
It took them almost 2 YEARS to achieve close to One Million sales on the S9, and the S9 is higher performance and efficiency than ANYTHING ELSE currently shipping.


Don't bother forking the algorithm on ETH for THESE miners, it's not worth the time and trouble.

damn, I've been out of the loop. when was it first available for sale? I see it sold out

[Goool]

ETH vs BITMAIN = soon 1-0

[wtfonly16]

ETH vs BITMAIN = soon 1-0

you mean 0-1
their not forking.

[QuintLeo]

I've somewhat changed my mind, after a couple facts collided in my mind last night.

I'm now thinking that the video claiming to be a "F3" model was more likely a prototype of a 14/16nm node next generation Bitmain SCRYPT miner (the hashrate is right where I would expect such a unit to end up).

The sale Bitmain started on the L3+ a couple days ago is looking like their usual "fire sale the old model, sell out our Hashnet units, as we replace them with the initial output of our first production run of the more efficient unit".

[ala12uk]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts
They have 2 years warranty not 6 months
They come from very well established "ÄMD" provider not from a shady one
You can buy the GPUs from a local shop and return it to the same local shop to swap it for a new GPU in case something goes wrong
You can buy it TODAY, you dont have to wait for 4 to 6 months

I dont see personalty ANY advantage for those called ASICs
They are just a punch of cheap memory chips, they are not really ASICs

One last thing,
You can also play games on a GPU ...

[wtfonly16]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts
They have 2 years warranty not 6 months
They come from very well established "ÄMD" provider not from a shady one
You can buy the GPUs from a local shop and return it to the same local shop to swap it for a new GPU in case something goes wrong
You can buy it TODAY, you dont have to wait for 4 to 6 months

I dont see personalty ANY advantage for those called ASICs
They are just a punch of cheap memory chips, they are not really ASICs

One last thing,
You can also play games on a GPU ...

keep dreaming

bitmain has 70% of eth hashrate with these asics alone. They selling it for $800 but how much you think it costs them to run and deploy for themselves? prob around half that price... Wake up.

[QuintLeo]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts

Go by "at the wall" measurements, as nothing on the AMD side reports the power usage of the entire card because AMD's HARDWARE on the card only measures power usage of the GPU itself.

Software like Afterburner and Wattman ALWAYS get the power usage wrong, and UNDERreport it a lot on AMD cards as a result.

[nerdralph]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts

Go by "at the wall" measurements, as nothing on the AMD side reports the power usage of the entire card because AMD's HARDWARE on the card only measures power usage of the GPU itself.

Software like Afterburner and Wattman ALWAYS get the power usage wrong, and UNDERreport it a lot on AMD cards as a result.

It's correct for what it is reporting.  As you pointed out, often people are just looking at the power consumption of the GPU, from the output side of the VRM.  Power to the input side of the VRM will be ~10% higher, and there is a separate VRM for the RAM.  There's usually one or two more power rails as well, but their power consumption is minor compared to the GPU & RAM.

[QuintLeo]

Not saying it's incorrect on what it's reporting - just pointing out that it doesn't measure WHOLE CARD consumption unlike Nvidia cards, so the numbers are not comparable and tends to make AMD cards look better on a comparison against Nvidia cards or ASIC miners.

[Wefud]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts
They have 2 years warranty not 6 months
They come from very well established "ÄMD" provider not from a shady one
You can buy the GPUs from a local shop and return it to the same local shop to swap it for a new GPU in case something goes wrong
You can buy it TODAY, you dont have to wait for 4 to 6 months

I dont see personalty ANY advantage for those called ASICs
They are just a punch of cheap memory chips, they are not really ASICs

One last thing,
You can also play games on a GPU ...

keep dreaming

bitmain has 70% of eth hashrate with these asics alone. They selling it for $800 but how much you think it costs them to run and deploy for themselves? prob around half that price... Wake up.

I agree with that. But if ETH want to stick with ASIC, find another good coin.

[Ursul0]

Turns out the Bitmain E3 (NOT the F3 as reported) is not exactly a big GPU mining killer.
180 Mhash
800 watts

About the the SAME performance as a well-tuned 6 card RX 580/480 based rig, and slightly INFERIOR to a well-tuned 6-card GTX 1070 based rig.

My tuned RX 580 Special Edition GPU mine at 31 MH\s while consuming below 90 Watts
They have 2 years warranty not 6 months
They come from very well established "ÄMD" provider not from a shady one
You can buy the GPUs from a local shop and return it to the same local shop to swap it for a new GPU in case something goes wrong
You can buy it TODAY, you dont have to wait for 4 to 6 months

I dont see personalty ANY advantage for those called ASICs
They are just a punch of cheap memory chips, they are not really ASICs

One last thing,
You can also play games on a GPU ...

keep dreaming

bitmain has 70% of eth hashrate with these asics alone. They selling it for $800 but how much you think it costs them to run and deploy for themselves? prob around half that price... Wake up.

How did you figure the 70% of eth hashrate number?

NOTE: 31MH/s of Ethash on 14nm Polaris consumes around 120W with the core running at around 850mv

NOTE2: Also re ASICs: GPU is also an ASIC and apparently it's good for more than just graphics processing... It's all a matter of R&D and production investment vs the returns.

[QuintLeo]

keep dreaming

bitmain has 70% of eth hashrate with these asics alone. They selling it for $800 but how much you think it costs them to run and deploy for themselves? prob around half that price... Wake up.

How did you figure the 70% of eth hashrate number?

They apparently believe the unsupported claims by Marvel2 about the majority of existing ETH hashrate being ASIC, despite all the evidence against those claims and ZERO supporting evidence.

[Marvell2]

keep dreaming

bitmain has 70% of eth hashrate with these asics alone. They selling it for $800 but how much you think it costs them to run and deploy for themselves? prob around half that price... Wake up.

How did you figure the 70% of eth hashrate number?

They apparently believe the unsupported claims by Marvel2 about the majority of existing ETH hashrate being ASIC, despite all the evidence against those claims and ZERO supporting evidence.

how is this unsupported, we saw the same pattern with monero, huge exeplained jumps in difficulty when gpus were in short supply. Monero forks snd poof 60 % of the hashrate disspears lol.

Eth is older and the jumps happpen far earlier, Ive been mining since 2013 and I saw all these jumps first hand , the biggest one around june or oct of last year (id have to look at the chart) gpus had been out of stock since febuary and all of a sudden we go from around 90th to 120 then 150 then 180th, basically jumps of 30 th a month in a time of gpu
not being available. 

Gimme a break if you all cant read the pattern or have your heads in the sand or what i font know.

and now Shitmain magically lists a new E3 miner forcsale in massive amounts , this from a company we already know
mines with thier gear for at least a year before selling these old model chips to you idiot peons?

Maybe I shouls start a detective agency or something becuase it seems I’m one of the few who cam put a simple two and two together ... thats four right? lol

[nerdralph]

They apparently believe the unsupported claims by Marvel2 about the majority of existing ETH hashrate being ASIC, despite all the evidence against those claims and ZERO supporting evidence.

how is this unsupported, we saw the same pattern with monero, huge exeplained jumps in difficulty when gpus were in short supply. Monero forks snd poof 60 % of the hashrate disspears lol.

Eth is older and the jumps happpen far earlier, Ive been mining since 2013 and I saw all these jumps first hand , the biggest one around june or oct of last year (id have to look at the chart) gpus had been out of stock since febuary and all of a sudden we go from around 90th to 120 then 150 then 180th, basically jumps of 30 th a month in a time of gpu
not being available. 

Gimme a break if you all cant read the pattern or have your heads in the sand or what i font know.

and now Shitmain magically lists a new E3 miner forcsale in massive amounts , this from a company we already know
mines with thier gear for at least a year before selling these old model chips to you idiot peons?

Maybe I shouls start a detective agency or something becuase it seems I’m one of the few who cam put a simple two and two together ... thats four right? lol

Monero(Cryptonight) can't be compared to ethash, as the algorithms are very different.  If you are actually interested in understanding ethash (& equihash) look at my posting history as I've analyzed both in-depth as well as done a lot of kernel coding.  Ethash also doesn't have botnets like Monero, which is likely where much of the hashrate drop came from after the fork.

You're basically doing a better job proving yourself wrong.  GPUs have been back-ordered due to high demand from mining; AMD can't ramp up production fast enough to keep up with demand.
"Revenue was $1.65 billion, up 40 percent year-over-year and 23 percent quarter-over-quarter, driven primarily by higher revenue in the Computing and Graphics segment."
http://ir.amd.com/news-releases/news-release-details/amd-reports-first-quarter-2018-financial-results

[revelacaogr]

https://eurominers.net

STAY AWAY....

[Branko]

https://eurominers.net

STAY AWAY....

How about some details?

[revelacaogr]

https://eurominers.net

STAY AWAY....

How about some details?

made an order and never received...