Why is the forum a battleground? Is this why Theymos created this forum for?

[akamit]

Why is the forum a battleground? Is this why Theymos created this forum for?
I believe Theymos has created the forum as a center point of discussion for Bitcoin/Cryptocurrency and to unite the peoples of whole world for the same cause.

But look at the forum now, it's now a battleground, it's now a place to hate each other, it's now a place for gangs of likes/dislikes etc.

Before it was limited to DefaultTrust issue - I mean DT member's trust rating issue vs others received a rating. And now added another issue "Merit".

Just an example > https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2827620.0

Why it is needed to make the forum such complicated with all those systems whereas a simple solution can be done.
Those systems are just dividing the community into two, thus created the battleground because of the self-power one has due to those systems against the others with no power.

I hope everyone knows the stories already, nothing to say in details. SO WHAT IS THE SOLUTION TO STOP THE BATTLEGROUND AND MAKE A SOLID BITCOIN DISCUSSION FORUM FOR US ALL? ANY THOUGHTS?

What I wrote here just came up in my mind suddenly and I wrote it here without any second thought. But it is not intended to hurt anyone. Please ignore if you didn't like it.

PEACE! < THIS THING IS AWESOME.

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[pugman]

There is a solution already.
Serious Discussion
Ivory TowerMerit is not an issue. Its a solution. Who gives a shit about fucking whining scumbags. I like the merit system and I am definitely not the only one who likes it. You try to do anything good for anybody people will come up with something or other shit to whine about it. Please stop having a mindset of assuming merit system to be an "Issue".
And about the dispute betweeen DT members,only this can help.
 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=914641.0

[akamit]

There is a solution already.
Serious Discussion
Ivory TowerMerit is not an issue. Its a solution. Who gives a shit about fucking whining scumbags. I like the merit system and I am definitely not the only one who likes it. You try to do anything good for anybody people will come up with something or other shit to whine about it. Please stop having a mindset of assuming merit system to be an "Issue".
And about the dispute betweeen DT members,only this can help.
 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=914641.0

I'm not against the DT system/DT members or Merit system. My concerns are more about the situations arises due to those systems.
I was just wondering about how the battleground can be stopped, maybe some specific rules can stop? I don't know, but I believe some rules can be very useful.

[Lauda]

There is a fundamental flaw in the centralized trust system, i.e. the the centralizing factor (the person). Theymos does not act as frequently as he should, i.e. he does not act swiftly on obvious collusion as is in the recent case. Either decentralize it in a way, or act more frequently and more vigorously.
Therefore, yes it is battlefield between users trying to clean this place up and users who only care about their own profit. It is not going to change anytime soon (see above).

[pugman]

There is a solution already.
Serious Discussion
Ivory TowerMerit is not an issue. Its a solution. Who gives a shit about fucking whining scumbags. I like the merit system and I am definitely not the only one who likes it. You try to do anything good for anybody people will come up with something or other shit to whine about it. Please stop having a mindset of assuming merit system to be an "Issue".
And about the dispute betweeen DT members,only this can help.
 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=914641.0

I'm not against the DT system/DT members or Merit system. My concerns are more about the situations arises due to those systems.
I was just wondering about how the battleground can be stopped, maybe some specific rules can stop? I don't know, but I believe some rules can be very useful.

One,even if rules are there,people won't follow. US has banned gambling but still people gamble. People  jaywalk even if it is crystal clear to them that they are not supposed to do so. And definitely people won't bother to read the rules for a damn forum/money making machine. They don't give a shit about this forum. Point is that if rules exist,rule breakers exist as well. Period.
I know you're not against the trust and merit systems ,but nothing is going to help unless and until theymos does something. As of now ,something needs to be done to the trust system. Its getting fucked up real bad.

[gordeevaar]

I'm not against the DT system/DT members or Merit system. My concerns are more about the situations arises due to those systems.
I was just wondering about how the battleground can be stopped, maybe some specific rules can stop? I don't know, but I believe some rules can be very useful.

Simple solution is making an addition in official thread that new threads about the merit system will be deleted. And then deleting such threads made thereafter. Also, I think that official thread should be made sticky. It is fine if we have members discussing pros and cons of merit system but it should not be repeated in very new thread.

[akamit]

Theymos does not act as frequently as he should, i.e. he does not act swiftly on obvious collusion as is in the recent case. Either decentralize it in a way, or act more frequently and more vigorously.
Therefore, yes it is battlefield between users trying to clean this place up and users who only care about their own profit. It is not going to change anytime soon (see above).

I agree with your two points.

I've spent two years here and I've witnessed that most people come here to make money, for them bitcointalk is just a money printing machine.
They just don't care anything about the forum, they just use their brain on how to multiply their earnings in a legit way or scammy way. But mostly scammy way.

That's why there is something needed as "RULES" for all newcomers or existing abusers. Such as a page for "rules" where every rule will be written which Theymos/staff/Mods/DT agreed to.
That "RULES" page need to be visible for all users and it can be placed beside our avatar or right side of that row, an extra big font maybe with red color can be more visible.
So even after any user breaks the rules, then they will be simply banned. No chance to pollute the forum, as an example https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2948458.0
It will be better to mention the reason for which someone will be banned... You are banned due to X reason.

Regarding Theymos,
I respect him very much due to the fact that after Satoshi's invention, he has created an awesome opportunity for all of us by creating this forum.
The thing I love most is, we are connected to each other in cryptospace through this forum, isn't it a cool thing? Making new friends, new opportunities are created daily etc.
My earnest request to him will be to create the final "RULES" and select some members from DT besides staff to look after his beautiful forum.

[Jet Cash]

There is a solution already.
Serious Discussion
Ivory Tower

The Speculation board is interesting as well. Especially at the moment when the economy of the world is in such a mess.

[Husires]

Why is the forum a battleground? Is this why Theymos created this forum for?

Satoshi and Sirius created this forum, Theymos add trust system "Who has a real test" and new merits system.
This battleground has been old since people began to be scammers.
the first big battle was https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1171059.0 and the end may be today.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

There is a fundamental flaw in the centralized trust system, i.e. the the centralizing factor (the person). Theymos does not act as frequently as he should, i.e. he does not act swiftly on obvious collusion as is in the recent case. Either decentralize it in a way, or act more frequently and more vigorously.
Therefore, yes it is battlefield between users trying to clean this place up and users who only care about their own profit. It is not going to change anytime soon (see above).

The flawed trust system, plus the unregulated presence of scammers, shitposters, and account sales, along with the rift between camps of people sharing differing and often contentious views on all of those things--this is why the forum is a battleground.  And the lack of strong leadership on top of everything.  Ugh, what a mess.

[Lauda]

There is a fundamental flaw in the centralized trust system, i.e. the the centralizing factor (the person). Theymos does not act as frequently as he should, i.e. he does not act swiftly on obvious collusion as is in the recent case. Either decentralize it in a way, or act more frequently and more vigorously.
Therefore, yes it is battlefield between users trying to clean this place up and users who only care about their own profit. It is not going to change anytime soon (see above).

The flawed trust system, plus the unregulated presence of scammers, shitposters, and account sales, along with the rift between camps of people sharing differing and often contentious views on all of those things--this is why the forum is a battleground.  And the lack of strong leadership on top of everything.  Ugh, what a mess.

The goal of the cartel interested only in their self-gain has is within reach. Almost a scammers' Utopia.
From your own perspective, you're fine as long as you use what I suggested[1]. For the others (i.e. 99% of the forum members, they have been essentially thrown into a pit with hungry monsters). It's sad when self-greed due to own failing endeavors takes over your judgement as is the case here.
[1] This:

~HostFat
gmaxwell
~OgNasty
qwk
Vod
~Tomatocage
DiamondCardz
KWH
ibminer
~defcon23
Mitchell
~cyclops
Blazed
hilariousandco
~shorena
~jonald_fyookball
~CryptoImperator
~chronicsky
~Quickseller
Zepher
actmyname
The Pharmacist
Lutpin
Gunthar

[Welsh]

The flawed trust system, plus the unregulated presence of scammers, shitposters, and account sales, along with the rift between camps of people sharing differing and often contentious views on all of those things--this is why the forum is a battleground.  And the lack of strong leadership on top of everything.  Ugh, what a mess.

Strong leadership isn't always about banning things out right, and I like the forums approach of trying to find solutions which don't limit legitimate users. Besides, when you have such a diverse amount of people who come to share their opinions about things there's obviously going to be a few clashes here and there.

There's guidelines to keep these sort of arguments and "battles" on topic. The trust system works somewhat in that it prevents a lot of scams from happening. Yes, there's a Default list of people that might not be deserving of that place but, that's why everyones encouraged to make their own trust list rather than blindly trusting DefaultTrust. It's partly the systems fault as well as it's users.