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[GigaDice]

For what's worth, so far you have entirely sidestepped the discussion regarding the provably fair method used at gigadice. Can't you clearly explain it ?

Anyway, here is how I understood the process. For this example I took the bets 1 and 8 at http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=1 and http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=8. Bet 1 rolled 18.71 with user seed 208606, Bet 8 rolled 56.03 with user seed 597414. To check the outcome is the expected one, concatenate the rolled number, the user seed, and the daily secret of 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 for these rolls. Apply SHA 512 on the concatenated message and take the hex digest, if they match the one published at "Server Seed (Hash) for that Roll" for that bet, then the result is the expected one. For these rolls, the hashes match -- EXCEPT it is missing the most important step: WHAT did it do to roll 18.71 and 56.03 there ?

There are yet two other issues about how you're handling this (beyond not properly answering it earlier). First issue: the hash of the daily secret 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 is not shown anywhere, if it is I can't find it. Second issue regards the way you describe your method, if it is done exactly as specified there, then it is not provably fair again.

Here is the part that is wrong in every instance: """Prior to betting, you receive a "Server Seed" and a "Client Seed." The Server Seed is a combination of your roll, your client seed, and our secret - hashed""". This is telling me I get a user seed before the bet is placed, it doesn't clearly say that the player sends its own seed. /If/ it is not the player who specifies his seed, then it is not provably fair and it should be obvious why that is the case. The description regarding "Server seed" is also confusing, but I mentioned this in an earlier post.

Since this is relatively long, let me resume: 1) you are not describing how the rolled number is picked; 2) the way you describe "user seed" makes it not provably fair; 3) "server seed" is confusing as it is not a seed of anything.

...
It would be impossible or very illogical to force the user into submitting a client seed every bet, we do however allow users if they feel the need to change it if they feel the need to. If you're wondering how the rolls are determined it is through a simple php rand function.

Wow, take some time and think about what you just wrote there. How can the user possibly know that the roll was done in a provably fair manner considering what you just wrote ? Here is the result of "a simple php rand function": 32, who can I know I did it in a fair manner ? You (the player actually) have no way to check that with this current method.

Pay attention to this: neither the user seed nor the daily secret have any effect in the rolled number. If you know of any site that do this, you picked the wrong example to follow.

I have answered this multiple time at the moment the client seed doesn't affect affect the roll but we're looking to implement it in the future. I'm looking to ways to increase our provability and transparency and very much appreciate your feedback.

Do you understand that gigadice is not provably fair ?

This is what I've been trying to get him to understand. He doesn't seem to get the difference between provably fair and provable results.

Provably Fair: The house picks a number in such a way that the user can verify that the house did not have any control over the outcome of the roll

Provable Results: The house supplies a way to show that the outcome did not change from when the hash/seed was provided and after the roll. There is no way to verify the house is not controlling the outcome of the roll.

GigaDice has provable results.


(He also doesn't know the difference between credited and accredited)

Thank you for your feedback and suggestions thus far, we will definitely be adding a different method of provably fair in Gigadice 2.0. I have added some balance to your account for helping us improve our site. If you have any more suggestions or questions feel free to message me or contact me through email at admin@gigadice.com

[julian_datminer]

signd up ^^
username: sickdoctor

LET THE GAME BEGIN !!!!

[steveds]

registered with username steveds
i was part of your beta so fund away

[GigaDice]

Added balance to every account I have missed. Hope you guys enjoy the site.

[steveds]

i sent you an error on your pms please reply

[GigaDice]

i sent you an error on your pms please reply

I will not send the BTC to your address, I have added it to your balance as requested.

[steveds]

i sent you an error on your pms please reply

I will not send the BTC to your address, I have added it to your balance as requested.

read the new pm thanks

[mises]

Is gigagold essentially money? US laws making it illegal to bet with anything besides BTC.

[GigaDice]

Is gigagold essentially money? US laws making it illegal to bet with anything besides BTC.

US laws don't apply as we have prohibited US users from accessing Gigagold.

[Zhoy]

There seems to be a problem showing the balance, recent bets, and stats when viewing with Chrome, but seems okay with IE. Or is this just me? 

[GigaDice]

There seems to be a problem showing the balance, recent bets, and stats when viewing with Chrome, but seems okay with IE. Or is this just me? 

This seems to happen sporadically to a small portion of our users. I've found that closing the browser and re visiting the site solves the problem. Nonetheless we're looking to find a permanent solution to this and pinpoint what exactly is causing this. I have added some balance to your account for your troubles.

[🏰 TradeFortress 🏰]

Looking at your verification page I was under the assumption that the client seed DOES affect the rolled number.

Is the result generated in advance of when I click on bet?

[Mooshire]

Looking at your verification page I was under the assumption that the client seed DOES affect the rolled number.

Is the result generated in advance of when I click on bet?

It is, that's what we've been saying.

[Mooshire]

For what's worth, so far you have entirely sidestepped the discussion regarding the provably fair method used at gigadice. Can't you clearly explain it ?

Anyway, here is how I understood the process. For this example I took the bets 1 and 8 at http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=1 and http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=8. Bet 1 rolled 18.71 with user seed 208606, Bet 8 rolled 56.03 with user seed 597414. To check the outcome is the expected one, concatenate the rolled number, the user seed, and the daily secret of 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 for these rolls. Apply SHA 512 on the concatenated message and take the hex digest, if they match the one published at "Server Seed (Hash) for that Roll" for that bet, then the result is the expected one. For these rolls, the hashes match -- EXCEPT it is missing the most important step: WHAT did it do to roll 18.71 and 56.03 there ?

There are yet two other issues about how you're handling this (beyond not properly answering it earlier). First issue: the hash of the daily secret 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 is not shown anywhere, if it is I can't find it. Second issue regards the way you describe your method, if it is done exactly as specified there, then it is not provably fair again.

Here is the part that is wrong in every instance: """Prior to betting, you receive a "Server Seed" and a "Client Seed." The Server Seed is a combination of your roll, your client seed, and our secret - hashed""". This is telling me I get a user seed before the bet is placed, it doesn't clearly say that the player sends its own seed. /If/ it is not the player who specifies his seed, then it is not provably fair and it should be obvious why that is the case. The description regarding "Server seed" is also confusing, but I mentioned this in an earlier post.

Since this is relatively long, let me resume: 1) you are not describing how the rolled number is picked; 2) the way you describe "user seed" makes it not provably fair; 3) "server seed" is confusing as it is not a seed of anything.

...
It would be impossible or very illogical to force the user into submitting a client seed every bet, we do however allow users if they feel the need to change it if they feel the need to. If you're wondering how the rolls are determined it is through a simple php rand function.

Wow, take some time and think about what you just wrote there. How can the user possibly know that the roll was done in a provably fair manner considering what you just wrote ? Here is the result of "a simple php rand function": 32, who can I know I did it in a fair manner ? You (the player actually) have no way to check that with this current method.

Pay attention to this: neither the user seed nor the daily secret have any effect in the rolled number. If you know of any site that do this, you picked the wrong example to follow.

I have answered this multiple time at the moment the client seed doesn't affect affect the roll but we're looking to implement it in the future. I'm looking to ways to increase our provability and transparency and very much appreciate your feedback.

Do you understand that gigadice is not provably fair ?

This is what I've been trying to get him to understand. He doesn't seem to get the difference between provably fair and provable results.

Provably Fair: The house picks a number in such a way that the user can verify that the house did not have any control over the outcome of the roll

Provable Results: The house supplies a way to show that the outcome did not change from when the hash/seed was provided and after the roll. There is no way to verify the house is not controlling the outcome of the roll.

GigaDice has provable results.


(He also doesn't know the difference between credited and accredited)

Thank you for your feedback and suggestions thus far, we will definitely be adding a different method of provably fair in Gigadice 2.0. I have added some balance to your account for helping us improve our site. If you have any more suggestions or questions feel free to message me or contact me through email at admin@gigadice.com

Bribing me isn't going to keep me quiet.

[kklljsw]

Signed up with username: kklljsw

Thank you

[knowitnothing]

Looking at your verification page I was under the assumption that the client seed DOES affect the rolled number.

The seeds /do not affect/ the rolled number, not even the daily secret affects it. The user seed and daily secret are only used to show that sha2_512("whatever roll it decided to output" + "user seed" + "daily secret") == hash shown before the roll. The user seed is completely irrelevant.

The operator also cannot properly explain the process of producing a roll. It was mentioned that the rand function from php is used. If that is all there is to it, you are using a method known to be breakable and then an attacker will guess the next outcomes and will bankrupt the site.

[GigaDice]

I have brought up the changes to provably fair to my developer and they will be implemented within a day or two.

[ASICSRUS]

For what's worth, so far you have entirely sidestepped the discussion regarding the provably fair method used at gigadice. Can't you clearly explain it ?

Anyway, here is how I understood the process. For this example I took the bets 1 and 8 at http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=1 and http://gigadice.com/verification.php?betid=8. Bet 1 rolled 18.71 with user seed 208606, Bet 8 rolled 56.03 with user seed 597414. To check the outcome is the expected one, concatenate the rolled number, the user seed, and the daily secret of 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 for these rolls. Apply SHA 512 on the concatenated message and take the hex digest, if they match the one published at "Server Seed (Hash) for that Roll" for that bet, then the result is the expected one. For these rolls, the hashes match -- EXCEPT it is missing the most important step: WHAT did it do to roll 18.71 and 56.03 there ?

There are yet two other issues about how you're handling this (beyond not properly answering it earlier). First issue: the hash of the daily secret 61f476d793488e3d47fd348011c203084c60be24 is not shown anywhere, if it is I can't find it. Second issue regards the way you describe your method, if it is done exactly as specified there, then it is not provably fair again.

Here is the part that is wrong in every instance: """Prior to betting, you receive a "Server Seed" and a "Client Seed." The Server Seed is a combination of your roll, your client seed, and our secret - hashed""". This is telling me I get a user seed before the bet is placed, it doesn't clearly say that the player sends its own seed. /If/ it is not the player who specifies his seed, then it is not provably fair and it should be obvious why that is the case. The description regarding "Server seed" is also confusing, but I mentioned this in an earlier post.

Since this is relatively long, let me resume: 1) you are not describing how the rolled number is picked; 2) the way you describe "user seed" makes it not provably fair; 3) "server seed" is confusing as it is not a seed of anything.

...
It would be impossible or very illogical to force the user into submitting a client seed every bet, we do however allow users if they feel the need to change it if they feel the need to. If you're wondering how the rolls are determined it is through a simple php rand function.

Wow, take some time and think about what you just wrote there. How can the user possibly know that the roll was done in a provably fair manner considering what you just wrote ? Here is the result of "a simple php rand function": 32, who can I know I did it in a fair manner ? You (the player actually) have no way to check that with this current method.

Pay attention to this: neither the user seed nor the daily secret have any effect in the rolled number. If you know of any site that do this, you picked the wrong example to follow.

I have answered this multiple time at the moment the client seed doesn't affect affect the roll but we're looking to implement it in the future. I'm looking to ways to increase our provability and transparency and very much appreciate your feedback.

Do you understand that gigadice is not provably fair ?

This is what I've been trying to get him to understand. He doesn't seem to get the difference between provably fair and provable results.

Provably Fair: The house picks a number in such a way that the user can verify that the house did not have any control over the outcome of the roll

Provable Results: The house supplies a way to show that the outcome did not change from when the hash/seed was provided and after the roll. There is no way to verify the house is not controlling the outcome of the roll.

GigaDice has provable results.


(He also doesn't know the difference between credited and accredited)

who coined this term : "PROVABLY FAIR" does anyone know? tia!

[knowitnothing]

who coined this term : "PROVABLY FAIR" does anyone know? tia!

An old enough reference:

Constructive and Provably Fair Coin Flip in Byzantine Networks. B Awerbucb, B Char, S Goldwasser, S Micali - 1984.

[Aalesund]

Is there an option for Auto betting?