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"I'm sure that in 20 years there will either be very large transaction volume or no volume." -- Satoshi
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evolve
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July 21, 2011, 10:18:01 PM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
as for how itll affect btc, who knows? on one hand, its decent publicity...on the other, it may encourage a crackdown on btc...
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em3rgentOrdr
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July 23, 2011, 10:02:50 AM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
as for how itll affect btc, who knows? on one hand, its decent publicity...on the other, it may encourage a crackdown on btc...
I do share some of those concerns, although I do secretly admire them for hacking into corporate servers that may have contained my passwords (of course non are unique) and my credit card info (of course I would have cancelled my card immediately a company I used was one of those compromised). It's complicated. There are a lot of interesting moral questions. For instance, is it necessarily immoral to hack into a computer system that isn't secured? Just like how it's not necessarily illegal to walk into a business if the door is unlocked. But very inspirational pastebin anyway. You can't trust governments or corporations. I only trust cryptography. |
"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.
Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
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em3rgentOrdr
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July 23, 2011, 10:26:51 AM |
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very bold and inspirational manifesto. Wow...I read that too! Very interesting read. The tl;dr summary is: "Copyright is immoral, the academic journal publishing system is obsolete, and forcing people to pay $19 to JSTOR for 80+ year-old public domain journal articles is wrong. Lobbying the government to release thm will take too long and waste too much resources, so I'm just going to upload my previously downloaded repository of Papers from Philosopical Transactions of the Royal Soceity to piratebay instead." Is it okay to post that entire manifesto text right in here to bitcoin forum. People may be afraid to visit the piratebay website. |
"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.
Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
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Sovereign
Member
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Activity: 80
Merit: 10
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July 23, 2011, 01:12:22 PM |
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Interesting.
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12uB1LSPrAqeEefLJTDfd6rKsu3KjiFBpa
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em3rgentOrdr
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July 23, 2011, 08:07:53 PM |
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"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.
Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
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Bitcoin_Silver_Supply
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July 23, 2011, 08:19:48 PM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
This. Governments have been waiting a long time for a substantive excuse to crack down on the internet and bring in internet IDs. The goatse antics are a great excuse to do so, to "stop the cyber terrorists" who are "threatening the economy" and personal info and so on, and so on. This is, in my view, the only reason they haven't already begun cracking down hard. They need some true chaos before public opinion will demand an "ordered," centralized internet; and it will. Some of the propaganda coming out of Anonymous is very effective and it has the potential to inspire people to question statism/corporatism outside of the media pen. However, I think the final result of this lulzsec/anon cooperation will be hugely unpleasant for those who value a free and decentralized net. Hopefully I'm wrong. |
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bittycoin (OP)
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July 24, 2011, 06:17:16 AM |
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So the consensus here is that the civil disobedience of Lulzsec et al will be used as a pretext to militarize the internet. Government and corporate elites have wanted to do this all along, and this is a convenient excuse that the proles will support.
This would be bad news for bitcoin, because a militarized internet would filter unapproved traffic.
Do you really think we're at that point? Do governments and corporations really have that much power?
Seems to me we'd need a much bigger and more urgent pretext than Lulzsec and Wikileaks. We'd need something on the scale of Pearl Harbor to justify an internet police state.
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GideonGono
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July 24, 2011, 07:19:19 AM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
as for how itll affect btc, who knows? on one hand, its decent publicity...on the other, it may encourage a crackdown on btc...
I read an article recently that was arguing against the notion that Anonymous & LulzSec should be condemned because govt will use it as a pre-text for a more draconian internet. I think it was on Lewrockwell.com. I'll post it when I find it. |
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evolve
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July 24, 2011, 07:24:48 AM |
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Do you really think we're at that point? Do governments and corporations really have that much power?
Seems to me we'd need a much bigger and more urgent pretext than Lulzsec and Wikileaks. We'd need something on the scale of Pearl Harbor to justify an internet police state.
i hope your right. i dont think you are, but i hope you are. personally, i think governments across the world would love to impose china level internet censorship...free information and communtication is a dangerous thing. it wont take much evidence (in my country at least) to convince the sheeple to give up those rights....just look at the patriot act.... |
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evolve
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July 24, 2011, 07:25:40 AM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
as for how itll affect btc, who knows? on one hand, its decent publicity...on the other, it may encourage a crackdown on btc...
I read an article recently that was arguing against the notion that Anonymous & LulzSec should be condemned because govt will use it as a pre-text for a more draconian internet. I think it was on Lewrockwell.com. I'll post it when I find it. please do |
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FCTaiChi
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July 24, 2011, 11:13:32 AM |
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The power seems to want more power. Clandestine ops, joining groups opposed to them is very common. It's hard to even tell who wants what anymore.
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em3rgentOrdr
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July 24, 2011, 01:14:57 PM |
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"We will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.
Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks, but pure P2P networks are holding their own."
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lemonginger
Full Member
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Activity: 210
Merit: 100
firstbits: 121vnq
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July 24, 2011, 07:21:23 PM |
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I would welcome a crackdown on the internet because it would spur on activist techies to get even more creative with privacy, routing, domain name resolution, etc. P2P darknets already function quite well, what is needed is further reason for more people to traverse them.
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LokeRundt
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Activity: 98
Merit: 10
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July 24, 2011, 08:31:04 PM |
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I hope the MondoNet (mondonet.org, check out the interview on agoristradio.com) project reaches critical mass before major governments go on CRACKdown
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lemonginger
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Activity: 210
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firstbits: 121vnq
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July 24, 2011, 09:35:36 PM |
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I should amend. I'm not one of those "hope the shit hits the fan so people realize how much it stinks" kinda people. But, if there's gonna be a crackdown, I think it will result in more resilient and private networks. Right now the internet essentially routes through google, the NSA, zuckerberg and the Chinese government
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bittycoin (OP)
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Activity: 33
Merit: 0
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July 25, 2011, 01:13:00 AM |
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This must be Manifesto Week. The Norwegian right-wing fanatic posted a 1400-page treatise before bombing downtown Oslo and shooting 85 young people. At least he didn't mention bitcoin.
So I'll amend my original post. I still think it would take a pretty major event to trigger a rapid militarization of the internet and crackdown on bitcoin. But it probably doesn't need to be on the scale of Pearl Harbor.
If this disturbed Norwegian had used bitcoin to fund the massacre, you can be sure the crackdown would be sure and swift.
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GideonGono
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July 25, 2011, 04:51:30 AM |
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i think lulzsec is playing with fire. thier antics were cute and funny at first, but i think they are paving the way for an internet crackdown...i think they will be propped up as examples of why the government should censor the internet.
as for how itll affect btc, who knows? on one hand, its decent publicity...on the other, it may encourage a crackdown on btc...
I read an article recently that was arguing against the notion that Anonymous & LulzSec should be condemned because govt will use it as a pre-text for a more draconian internet. I think it was on Lewrockwell.com. I'll post it when I find it. please do Can't find it. it was pretty good though. The crux of the argument was that the govt is gonna screw us no matter what, so should we take the ass raping lying down or fight even if you may lose either way. I choose to fight. |
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