|
Paladin69 (OP)
|
 |
November 16, 2013, 09:49:44 PM |
|
Does that open the floodgates for manipulation? Naked short selling, etc?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rupture
|
|
November 16, 2013, 09:51:50 PM |
|
The markets would be flooded, regulation would be rife but the price will most likely go up.
|
|
|
|
|
rocks
Legendary
 Offline
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
|
|
November 16, 2013, 09:54:04 PM |
|
Does that open the floodgates for manipulation? Naked short selling, etc?
It means we have on the order of $100B to $1T going in bitcoin which is 10,000x to 100,000x the current order of around $10M the twins and BIT are able to invest. |
|
|
|
|
|
Paladin69 (OP)
|
|
November 16, 2013, 10:01:26 PM |
|
Does that open the floodgates for manipulation? Naked short selling, etc?
It means we have on the order of $100B to $1T going in bitcoin which is 10,000x to 100,000x the current order of around $10M the twins and BIT are able to invest. I should have pre-faced that I'm only interested in short-term analysis. I'd like a bit more conversation than "zomg next stop $1m". Global adoption is small enough for a few wealthy people to manipulate for some time to come yet. And this tool will be used by the media to scare people away. |
|
|
|
|
|
PrymeTyme
|
|
November 16, 2013, 10:19:47 PM |
|
Manipulation? Of course! How would it affect BTC ? Who Knows ! But Hey , Even the all mightY Dollar is Manipulated So..... BTC is not a Company not even PinkSheet/OTC nor a precious Commodity Its here to stay... And THEY know this ... It will Lift it to a New level for sure , but not for the worse... Stay tuned  |
|
|
|
|
Wilhelm
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1652
Merit: 1265
|
|
November 16, 2013, 10:24:51 PM |
|
zomg next stop $100m  |
Bitcoin is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get !!
|
|
|
|
TheJuice
|
|
November 16, 2013, 10:29:54 PM |
|
Where bitcoin is now is where the internet was in the early 1990s. We are still early adopters. Let the fun begin. If there is mass adoptions, in ~10 years eveyone who is holding > 10 bitcoins today will be millionaires.
|
|
|
|
|
|
BitcoinAshley
|
|
November 16, 2013, 10:40:20 PM |
|
Does that open the floodgates for manipulation? Naked short selling, etc?
In an unregulated market, unscrupulous players don't have a government to bail them out every time they fuck up ;-) Prepare to see some big boys get burned bad.  (Unless they're smart and realize their usual shenanigans will bite them in the butt) |
|
|
|
|
windjc
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1070
|
|
November 16, 2013, 11:03:04 PM |
|
I think hedge funds are already investing in Bitcoin.
The thing is that the market depth on exchanges is very shallow. So hedge fund investing is not going to happen on the exchanges - not unless/until the exchanges get A LOT more depth. Which means that at least US 1 exchange would have to be approved and regulated as an exchange in all 50 states, which a couple of exchanges are working on, but something that will probably take the next 6-12 months.
Meanwhile hedge fund investors will probably buy through private sales. When the ETF comes online, they will probably buy some on their too.
But I do not see the price going up exponentially because of hedge funds sending money to current exchanges. It would be nice if they did, and the price could be 10k+ in a few months. But that just is not going to happen.
|
|
|
|
|
Zangelbert Bingledack
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1036
Merit: 1000
|
|
November 17, 2013, 09:56:06 AM |
|
Off-exchange buys are even better. They create delayed, more steady price growth.
|
|
|
|
|
|
phoenix1
|
|
November 17, 2013, 12:48:27 PM |
|
More BTC moved into cold storage or just transferred from big holders via the OTC market without disrupting the exchange price.
The hedge funds that are getting involved now are not IMO doing it to manipulate BTC, they are saying to themselves and their clients 'Hey, this has the potential to explode, we could do a lot worse than having some.'
That said, they do have an incentive to keep buying small amounts to support their investements, but I cannot see them wanting to crash the market at this point. I believe that is paranoia. Those HFs that are buying in now are ahead of the curve ... why risk losing that carefully created position by messing about.
So in short, they are already amongst us and the impact is only price positive.
|
"Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves" - Confucius (China 551BC-479 BC)
|
|
|
|
TERA
|
|
November 17, 2013, 12:51:24 PM |
|
Bitcoin is doomed to fail. It's not something big money would be allowed to get into.
|
|
|
|
|
|
phoenix1
|
|
November 17, 2013, 01:04:42 PM |
|
Bitcoin is doomed to fail. It's not something big money would be allowed to get into.
LOL  It's already in, and there is more coming. You really think hedge funds give much of a f*ck about what the US gov says, especially the smaller ones that fly mostly below the radar and are based offshore precisely to avoid regulations? |
"Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves" - Confucius (China 551BC-479 BC)
|
|
|
|
|
|
phoenix1
|
|
November 17, 2013, 01:11:52 PM |
|
I would imagine that what is happening now is the tip of that iceberg. Some of the smaller, more flexible funds are allocating 1% of their capital to BTC. They are small enough to get through the door without moving the market too much and can afford to lose all of that 1%. Meanwhile they see the upside as huge and the bet as one well worth taking. |
"Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves" - Confucius (China 551BC-479 BC)
|
|
|
superresistant
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1120
|
|
November 17, 2013, 01:18:03 PM |
|
tldr
zomg next stop $100m
|
|
|
|
|
anu
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
RepuX - Enterprise Blockchain Protocol
|
|
November 17, 2013, 04:46:07 PM |
|
Bitcoin is doomed to fail. It's not something big money would be allowed to get into.
And why is that? Bitcoin allegedly is the money of criminals. It should have appeal to the mother of crime. |
|
|
|
Odalv
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1000
|
|
November 17, 2013, 07:52:17 PM |
|
Bitcoin is doomed to fail. It's not something big money would be allowed to get into.
Bitcoin is unstoppable. |
|
|
|
|
|
theonewhowaskazu
|
|
November 17, 2013, 08:32:11 PM |
|
Bitcoin is doomed to fail. It's not something big money would be allowed to get into.
Lol Why wouldn't big money be 'allowed' to get into it? Big money is 'allowed' to do pretty much whatever the heck it wants. |
|
|
|
CliffordM
Member
Offline
Activity: 95
Merit: 10
|
|
November 17, 2013, 10:38:59 PM |
|
Short selling requires someone to lend you bitcoins to sell.
An exchange might allow it -- i.e. accept your order and execute it, but Bitcoins would actually have to be delivered by someone -- possibly the exchange.
There's nothing special about hedge-funds shorting stuff, except that they like to do it , and have deep enough risk pockets to do it in reasonable size.
Any decent sized hedge-fund has a pretty strict set of assets that can be traded. I'm not aware of any big funds that have bitcoin on those lists -- but if the funds and trusts arrive as promised, many hedge-funds will be able to trade them simply as they are listed-shares.
It would be very beneficial to have someone lending bitcoins to allow shorting -- it brings stability and liquidity to a market.
The only real problem is that there are not enough coins to go around at current prices -- but this was always true.
|
|
|
|
|
|
