Did China just legalize Bitcoin, clarify regulation, for its free market use?

[EvilPanda]

Sry but extremly brief reply and you did not address my points. Bitcoin cant be a media of exchange as you have to pay taxes on every transaction. If you dont pay taxes you go to jail. I dont know how it is in your country, but thats how it works normally. Now you can say that people will risk going to jail, but I dont see that coming any time soon.

There are governments that interfere more and less. I happen to live where they steal more than 50% of your income if you add income tax, vat and property tax.
You seem to be a person who lives obeying the rules enforced by the "authorities" and don't want any changes. They tell you to pay taxes - you pay, then the taxes grow and you still pay, then they make you borrow in the banks so you can be their debt slave but you won't protest because that's how the system works, right?
Do you really think a system that enforces taxes anywhere it can is just? I am not against all taxes, people should give something to the community, but income tax is among the most unjust, it punishes people for being smart and creative so the ones that have bigger gains have to contribute more - this is ridiculous. Governments write in their constitutions that all men are equal, and yet they are not equally taxed, where's the logic in that. But this is going off topic.

No I dont believe that taxes are just. But the reality is that most people do and pay obidiently. Thats why government has power in the first place. Again cryptocurrencies wont bring down government.

Those brief replies

But they can allow you to get some goods and services anonymously. Let's say you write a program or create a website for someone and get paid in BTC, he has a broken pipe and pays a plumber to fix it with these btc, the plumber buys a used phone from his friend again with btc. Wouldn't that work? I'm not talking about big businesses employing thousands of people. I'm talking about John selling Judy his silver coin collection. Why the hell not use BTC for that?

[porc]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

You fail. I have made two very simple arguments and you cant disprove them in one post despite your numerous attempts. Linking an article and expecting me to read it is ridiculous, as anybody must be able to refute these points in one post if they can be refuted.

[porc]

Sry but extremly brief reply and you did not address my points. Bitcoin cant be a media of exchange as you have to pay taxes on every transaction. If you dont pay taxes you go to jail. I dont know how it is in your country, but thats how it works normally. Now you can say that people will risk going to jail, but I dont see that coming any time soon.

There are governments that interfere more and less. I happen to live where they steal more than 50% of your income if you add income tax, vat and property tax.
You seem to be a person who lives obeying the rules enforced by the "authorities" and don't want any changes. They tell you to pay taxes - you pay, then the taxes grow and you still pay, then they make you borrow in the banks so you can be their debt slave but you won't protest because that's how the system works, right?
Do you really think a system that enforces taxes anywhere it can is just? I am not against all taxes, people should give something to the community, but income tax is among the most unjust, it punishes people for being smart and creative so the ones that have bigger gains have to contribute more - this is ridiculous. Governments write in their constitutions that all men are equal, and yet they are not equally taxed, where's the logic in that. But this is going off topic.

No I dont believe that taxes are just. But the reality is that most people do and pay obidiently. Thats why government has power in the first place. Again cryptocurrencies wont bring down government.

Those brief replies

But they can allow you to get some goods and services anonymously. Let's say you write a program or create a website for someone and get paid in BTC, he has a broken pipe and pays a plumber to fix it with these btc, the plumber buys a used phone from his friend again with btc. Wouldn't that work? I'm not talking about big businesses employing thousands of people. I'm talking about John selling Judy his silver coin collection. Why the hell not use BTC for that?

Now you must already realize that for 1) large businesses 2) medium sized businesses 3) small businesses bitcoin is out of the question.

For the transactions you speak of we have two problems.

1) You have to show how you make a living (plumber). If you have stuff that cant be afforded with the income you show, governments will pursue you and put you in jail.

2) If you decide to buy virtual goods then these goods cant come from any small, medium sized or large business. Most virtual services are free anyways.

3) If wealth can only be spend on virtual goods than that wealth is useless if its significant (again if you have 2 million and can only spend it on virtual goods from tiny companies then these 2 million are useless). Rather pay taxes and be able to buy real stuff.

4) Most people wont risk going to jail if they only safe small amounts.

[AnonyMint]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

You fail. I have made two very simple arguments and you cant disprove them in one post despite your numerous attempts. Linking an article and expecting me to read it is ridiculous, as anybody must be able to refute these points in one post if they can be refuted.

Sorry I told you already the linked thread can't be summarized.

Please don't make me repeat the same reply over and over again.

Now you must already realize that for 1) large businesses 2) medium sized businesses 3) small businesses bitcoin is out of the question.

Nonsense.

[porc]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

You fail. I have made two very simple arguments and you cant disprove them in one post despite your numerous attempts. Linking an article and expecting me to read it is ridiculous, as anybody must be able to refute these points in one post if they can be refuted.

Sorry I told you already the linked thread can't be summarized.

Please don't make repeat the same thing over and over again.

You dont have to summarize the linked thread.

You have to address my arguments in one simple post. Also if the thread talks about large businesses its not relevant as my argument holds true for small, medium sized businesses and even for individuals.

Are you saying that individuals dont exist in future?

Stop evading and start answering my simple argument in one post.

[AnonyMint]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

You fail. I have made two very simple arguments and you cant disprove them in one post despite your numerous attempts. Linking an article and expecting me to read it is ridiculous, as anybody must be able to refute these points in one post if they can be refuted.

Sorry I told you already the linked thread can't be summarized.

Please don't make repeat the same thing over and over again.

You dont have to summarize the linked thread.

You have to address my arguments in one simple post

The linked thread addresses your arguments. It can't be summarized. You are free to try to summarize that thread if you want.

You will not force me to summarize what I said can't be summarized.

Are you going to continue? You are filling up this thread like a broken record repeating the same post over and over again. You've been given the opportunity to air your point, I told you the rebuttal is the linked thread. Done.

[porc]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

Sorry sometimes knowledge can fit into a "sound bite".

This isn't a political contest. You either want to learn or you don't. I can't make that decision for you.

Sry but your thread is about the fact that in future its about software and knowledge and not capital.

Fact is:

1) We need food 2) We want vacations 3) we need machines and hardware for software 4) we want transportation 5) we want entertainment in different localities 6) we need to produce energy 7)  we buy property

Again I dont see your point. You expecting me to read hours of your babbling is the real problem. Instead of addressing my points you links threads with pages of info that are not directly linked to my questions. I will stop replying as you refuse to anwer my questions but instead link me to mountains of information and expect me to read them. As your vision of a future with no large, medium sized or even small business is very unlikely (judging by economics and history) I dont think I have to emerse myself in such a fringe opinion.

Keep living your dream that you will destroy government via cryptocurrencies. I dont really care.

[AnonyMint]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

Sorry sometimes knowledge can fit into a "sound bite".

This isn't a political contest. You either want to learn or you don't. I can't make that decision for you.

Sry but your thread is about the fact that in future its about software and knowledge and not capital.

Fact is:

1) We need food...

Read the linked thread again. You missed the point.

Food will become such a incredibly small percentage of knowledge workers' expenses, like a grain of sand.

I dont really care.

Put some Vaseline in your anus so the coming NWO collective ass fscking won't be too painful.

[porc]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

Sorry sometimes knowledge can fit into a "sound bite".

This isn't a political contest. You either want to learn or you don't. I can't make that decision for you.

Sry but your thread is about the fact that in future its about software and knowledge and not capital.

Fact is:

1) We need food...

Read the linked thread again. You missed the point.

Food will become such a incredibly small percentage of knowledge workers' expenses, like a grain of sand.

I dont really care.

Put some Vaseline in your anus so it won't be too painful.

Summarize the point you fool. Why are there in future

1) not even small / medium businesses (even though economics and history points to large ones)
2) why is energy, food, property, machines, hardware, vacation, transport, entertainment in other localities not a huge part in tomorrows economy. Why is knowledge always software and why are sofware companies one man businesses.

[EvilPanda]

Now you must already realize that for 1) large businesses 2) medium sized businesses 3) small businesses bitcoin is out of the question.

For the transactions you speak of we have two problems.

1) You have to show how you make a living (plumber). If you have stuff that cant be afforded with the income you show, governments will pursue you and put you in jail.

2) If you decide to buy virtual goods then these goods cant come from any small, medium sized or large business. Most virtual services are free anyways.

3) If wealth can only be spend on virtual goods than that wealth is useless if its significant (again if you have 2 million and can only spend it on virtual goods from tiny companies then these 2 million are useless). Rather pay taxes and be able to buy real stuff.

4) Most people wont risk going to jail if they only safe small amounts.

1) You think there are people driving around the town, entering people's houses and checking what stuff they got inside to tax them? Never heard bout that...
2) Escrow isn't free, data recovery as well, and try to get a good website or house project made for free.
3) 7 billion people doing 1% of their trades in BTC seems significant enough for me
4) They won't put anyone in jail if BTC becomes big. If you can't fight them join them
And as for the power of the internet - the piratebay guys are enjoying their freedom. Somehow your jail and execution talk doesn't scare me.

[AnonyMint]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

Sorry sometimes knowledge can fit into a "sound bite".

This isn't a political contest. You either want to learn or you don't. I can't make that decision for you.

Sry but your thread is about the fact that in future its about software and knowledge and not capital.

Fact is:

1) We need food...

Read the linked thread again. You missed the point.

Food will become such a incredibly small percentage of knowledge workers' expenses, like a grain of sand.

I dont really care.

Put some Vaseline in your anus so it won't be too painful.

Summarize the point you fool.

Amazing the point is right there above.  

I guess you haven't considered direct connection to the brain then all your physical assets seem real but they are not. Even sex.

Or disposable assets that our 3D printers can print at will.

But still that isn't the point. You would need to actually not be stubborn and take time to read and digest.

[AnonyMint]

4) They won't put anyone in jail if BTC becomes big. If you can't fight them join them

You were doing good but that part of your argument isn't logical.

[porc]

Now you must already realize that for 1) large businesses 2) medium sized businesses 3) small businesses bitcoin is out of the question.

For the transactions you speak of we have two problems.

1) You have to show how you make a living (plumber). If you have stuff that cant be afforded with the income you show, governments will pursue you and put you in jail.

2) If you decide to buy virtual goods then these goods cant come from any small, medium sized or large business. Most virtual services are free anyways.

3) If wealth can only be spend on virtual goods than that wealth is useless if its significant (again if you have 2 million and can only spend it on virtual goods from tiny companies then these 2 million are useless). Rather pay taxes and be able to buy real stuff.

4) Most people wont risk going to jail if they only safe small amounts.

1) You think there are people driving around the town, entering people's houses and checking what stuff they got inside to tax them? Never heard bout that...
2) Escrow isn't free, data recovery as well, and try to get a good website or house project made for free.
3) 7 billion people doing 1% of their trades in BTC seems significant enough for me
4) They won't put anyone in jail if BTC becomes big. If you can't fight them join them
And as for the power of the internet - the piratebay guys are enjoying their freedom. Somehow your jail and execution talk doesn't scare me.

1) Yes. If you report low taxes but live a good lifestyle the tax man is coming after you.
2) Excrow... ever heard of cash. Thinking that cash is less anonymous than bitcoin is totally off base.
3) why 1%? You give no reason.. if most businesses dont accept it nobody will want your bitcoins
4) It wont become big as large, medium and small businesses wont accept it.

[AnonyMint]

2) Excrow... ever heard of cash. Thinking that cash is less anonymous than bitcoin is totally off base.

Cash is being eliminated. No more $1000 or 1000 Euro bills. Less and less from Euro ATMs per day, etc..

[porc]

In the linked thread I provided to you, the point is made by CoinCube, that my thesis can not be summarized. You will actually have to read.

Sorry sometimes knowledge can fit into a "sound bite".

This isn't a political contest. You either want to learn or you don't. I can't make that decision for you.

Sry but your thread is about the fact that in future its about software and knowledge and not capital.

Fact is:

1) We need food...

Read the linked thread again. You missed the point.

Food will become such a incredibly small percentage of knowledge workers' expenses, like a grain of sand.

I dont really care.

Put some Vaseline in your anus so it won't be too painful.

Summarize the point you fool.

Amazing the point is right there above.  

I guess you haven't considered direct connection to the brain then all your physical assets seem real but they are not. Even sex.

Or disposable assets that our 3D printers can print at will.

But still that isn't the point. You would need to actually not be stubborn and take time to read and digest.

If the bold part is your point I can only laugh.

1) Food ? 2) property ? 3) digital printers ? 4) transport ? Or will you just stay in one place in your virtual world 5) wont these companies that reconnect your brain be at least small sized ...

see you are making following points to refute my arguments:

1) No small, medium or large sized businesses (arguing against history and economics)
2) Individuals cant be controlled as mostly (90+%?) software and knowledge not physical assets will be consumed (no way to control what you actually bought to see if tax returns are accurate you say)
3) These software companies wont be number 1) regarding size
4) I will live to see this transition in my lifetime.

Keep trying.

[EvilPanda]

1) Yes. If you report low taxes but live a good lifestyle the tax man is coming after you.
2) Excrow... ever heard of cash. Thinking that cash is less anonymous than bitcoin is totally off base.
3) why 1%? You give no reason.. if most businesses dont accept it nobody will want your bitcoins
4) It wont become big as large, medium and small businesses wont accept it.

Sry but I feel like talking to a wall here.

1) Your all knowing tax man knows how much I spent on my household appliances and that I'm having fun with whores every night. He must be a god :O
2) Not excrow but escrow. Try paying someone living in another town with cash - you are planning to mail it to him, right?
3) I said 1% to pick the smallest number so you won't go "why 50%? nobody pays 50% for virtual goods and services". It can be even more but 1 could be enough.
4) They will, it's just a matter of time. There are many possiblilities one of which is BTC functioning along fiat, so you could freely exchange it and pay your taxes with fiat.

[EvilPanda]

4) They won't put anyone in jail if BTC becomes big. If you can't fight them join them

You were doing good but that part of your argument isn't logical.

Doing my best

Puting people who use btc in jail is not only illogical but also improbable. Prisons are full already  
Governments will have to one day recognize BTC if only enough people vote for it. We have democracy, right?

[porc]

1) Yes. If you report low taxes but live a good lifestyle the tax man is coming after you.
2) Excrow... ever heard of cash. Thinking that cash is less anonymous than bitcoin is totally off base.
3) why 1%? You give no reason.. if most businesses dont accept it nobody will want your bitcoins
4) It wont become big as large, medium and small businesses wont accept it.

Sry but I feel like talking to a wall here.

1) Your all knowing tax man knows how much I spent on my household appliances and that I'm having fun with whores every night. He must be a god :O
2) Not excrow but escrow. Try paying someone living in another town with cash - you are planning to mail it to him, right?
3) I said 1% to pick the smallest number so you won't go "why 50%? nobody pays 50% for virtual goods and services". It can be even more but 1 could be enough.
4) They will, it's just a matter of time. There are many possiblilities one of which is BTC functioning along fiat, so you could freely exchange it and pay your taxes with fiat.

1) Firstly bitcoins are not anonymous (if you want to buy them via an exchange the exchange demands personal information which it will hand out to governments.) Secondly you keep assuming that maybe when bitcoin ever becomes anonymous (how?) it might be used for a fringe purporse instead of cash. Why? Why not use cash to buy household appliances and whores. Again its much more cumbersome to use bitcoin. Also you dont explain how the business selling you household appliances will evade taxes via bitcoin.

Most people will not want to evade taxes.

2) Again if this guy is operating a small/ medium/ larger business he will need to pay taxes. Having customers is a public act; if you buy stuff with profits that are physical this is true also for the software entrepreneur. How do you know what business he is operating and if he is going to report tax?

3) Again why would anybody use bitcoin for fringe small time transaction and not cash? Yes if you buy something from him and he lives in another city. But how will you know about him? Via websites offering products? Public and therefore not anonymous for the person selling these products via the web.

Serious and competent businesses dont evade taxes. Nobody wants to risk jail time.

4) No that would assume governments loosing the money monopoly. You have not addressed my points concerning small, medium and large businesses and tax controls.

[niothor]

Oh crap another thread wasted by somebody trying to argue with AnnoyMint.
ps.
You,  Panda! , out of the way:)

[PenAndPaper]

Both answers are wrong because china haven't talked about bitcoin but about bitcoin as a currency and bitcoin as a commodity.