Ripple: The Best Way To Legitimize Bitcoin

[JohnsonRobinson]

Correction:

www.ripplescam.org

[__ johnnyb__]

I don't like ripple at all.. they have been increasing the price in purpose since the very beginnings.. and I keep asking myself.. what do they have? nothing have been tested yet, so I wouldn't invest in it..

[bibbit]

There's nothing peer-to-peer about ripple.  It relies on 'trusted gateways'.

Then please explain the PeerFinder code within the rippled source tree: https://github.com/ripple/rippled/tree/9e519af887b0854ef167a45e52f4b50000cdf85c/src/ripple/peerfinder

There is a very nice Readme right at that link that explains the P2P design. Remember BearShare, one of the Gnutella clients? The person responsible for that is crafting the Ripple P2P design. He knows the topic area from hard won real world experience.

Gateways, on the other hand, are a convenience for moving the currency of your choice into and out of the Ripple system. Bitcoin relies on trusted exchanges for people to do the same, but they are more limited. "Oh," you say, "it is possible to use Bitcoin without ever using an exchange!" Well, it is similarly possible to use Ripple without using a gateway, but both systems are much more useful if you do. The choice in both is left to the user. There is no compulsion.

[PirateButtercup]

Ripple is, I believe, a lot more in line with Central Banking ideology than other cryptocoins.  It is distributed but not decentralized.  But they claim the opposite.

Actually it's very, very far from a centralized banking ideology.

Here's an overview of Ripple ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zxA3Gt7y3c

Here is an explanation of Ripple in 60 seconds ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwyIEMyMfqs

Here is a video to help you understand how a Gateway works ...  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M16ZatXbmLg

Here is a video to help you understand how the consensus ledger works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj1QVb1vlC0

Perhaps this video will help you understand how the client works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06H86TNeJMw



If that doesn't provide you with enough, you may download Rippled from Github and add your own server to the network.

Additionally, you can go to https://ripple.com/wiki/ to get more accurate information that you can possibly read.

[PirateButtercup]

Correction:

www.ripplescam.org

If you notice the dates, it was long before Ripple went open source. The author understandably didn't update his blog after the fact. Nor has he allowed 1 comment to be posted since.

I have personally refuted every single one of the inaccuracies , however for some strange reason my post has been 'PENDING APPROVAL' for weeks.

If the originator had one shred of dignity he would update his site, allow comments to refute him, etc.

[dancupid]

Ripple is simply amazing!!

If you don’t know, Ripple is actually 3 different things…

1. It is an internet protocol (like FTP, HTTP, etc.) designed for the sole purpose to federate existing financial systems the same way SMTP brought all the different email companies under one umbrella.

2. It is a market place that allows for the exchange and sale of fiat and crypto currencies.  

3. It is a currency created, not to hold value, but to lubricate the system. By charging .00001 XRP per transaction …. on a scale that proportionally increases to the volume of transactions the sender creates…..it prevents spam and defends against denial of service attacks.


Comparing fiat and crypto currencies to one another is similar to comparing different kinds of cars with different features. Dollars, Bitcoin, euros, litecoin, sterling….they all have something that make them stand out.

Ripple is VERY different. Ripple is the market place to buy and sell those cars and… more importantly .. the road on which they can faster than ever before!!!

I LOVE Bitcoin...that's why I'm using Ripple....I want to see Bitcoin succeed!!!!


(If you MUST have a conceptual comparison, try this: email meets bitcoin meets western union meets the forex)

Anyone want these? They look like bitcoins don't they?
You want them? just post your ripple address and trust me for 4 'bitcoins' and I'll send them to you.

I tell you what, I'll write you a check for 'em. In fact, I'll write you a check for a million dollars apiece.

You will accept a check, right? Checks....also known as IOUs....have been a cornerstone of the finance industry for centuries. Surely you would take my million dollar check then, right?

If you can find someone stupid enough to accept 'bitcoin checks' issued by dancupid, then send them on to me when your done...I'll see what they'll take for a million dollar check....or some magic beans....

You obviously have to exercise due diligence whenever you deposit your money anywhere....an online broker, a bank, a gateway, a mutual fund, etc. A person's willingness to accept a bad check is not a condemnation of the system.

But I still have these 4 'bitcoins' in my ripple account - they look the same as normal bitcoins, ripple tells me I have 4 bitcoins, but I know I have no bitcoins in my Ripple account.
I cannot now use Ripple, since I cannot tell which bitcoins are real and which are not.
It doesn't work, becasue it lets you store fake bitcoins and you have no way of telling which are real and which are not.
I do not trust it. So I will not use it.

[PirateButtercup]

I don't like ripple at all.. they have been increasing the price in purpose since the very beginnings.. and I keep asking myself.. what do they have? nothing have been tested yet, so I wouldn't invest in it..

Ripple is a payment system, a currency exchange and a currency (XRP) needed to lubricate the two previously mentioned functions. As an XRP is just over .03 cents (US), I am confused by your comment about them 'raising the price'. I have been testing it for weeks now. I have been using it successfully to send money all over the world, instantly in several different currencies. Ripple is still in Beta, but perhaps you are looking at the wrong site....

[codegeek]

I think mastercoin is quite a bit better than ripple and it's gotten a lot more funding from what I've heard.

[PirateButtercup]

Ripple is simply amazing!!

If you don’t know, Ripple is actually 3 different things…

1. It is an internet protocol (like FTP, HTTP, etc.) designed for the sole purpose to federate existing financial systems the same way SMTP brought all the different email companies under one umbrella.

2. It is a market place that allows for the exchange and sale of fiat and crypto currencies.  

3. It is a currency created, not to hold value, but to lubricate the system. By charging .00001 XRP per transaction …. on a scale that proportionally increases to the volume of transactions the sender creates…..it prevents spam and defends against denial of service attacks.


Comparing fiat and crypto currencies to one another is similar to comparing different kinds of cars with different features. Dollars, Bitcoin, euros, litecoin, sterling….they all have something that make them stand out.

Ripple is VERY different. Ripple is the market place to buy and sell those cars and… more importantly .. the road on which they can faster than ever before!!!

I LOVE Bitcoin...that's why I'm using Ripple....I want to see Bitcoin succeed!!!!


(If you MUST have a conceptual comparison, try this: email meets bitcoin meets western union meets the forex)

Anyone want these? They look like bitcoins don't they?
You want them? just post your ripple address and trust me for 4 'bitcoins' and I'll send them to you.

I tell you what, I'll write you a check for 'em. In fact, I'll write you a check for a million dollars apiece.

You will accept a check, right? Checks....also known as IOUs....have been a cornerstone of the finance industry for centuries. Surely you would take my million dollar check then, right?

If you can find someone stupid enough to accept 'bitcoin checks' issued by dancupid, then send them on to me when your done...I'll see what they'll take for a million dollar check....or some magic beans....

You obviously have to exercise due diligence whenever you deposit your money anywhere....an online broker, a bank, a gateway, a mutual fund, etc. A person's willingness to accept a bad check is not a condemnation of the system.

But I still have these 4 'bitcoins' in my ripple account - they look the same as normal bitcoins, ripple tells me I have 4 bitcoins, but I know I have no bitcoins in my Ripple account.
I cannot now use Ripple, since I cannot tell which bitcoins are real and which are not.
It doesn't work, becasue it lets you store fake bitcoins and you have no way of telling which are real and which are not.
I do not trust it. So I will not use it.

How did you get 4 BTC that you know you don't have? It sounds like you created another account, extended trust to that account, and then sent 4 Bitcoin from one to the other. What you did was 'write a check' off of one wallet and put in another. Can you please post the trust lines that are currently in that wallet?

As I tried to get at earlier, I can write a check for a million dollars issued by the Bank of PirateButtercup. But why in the world would anyone take it?

You're not storing 'fake' Bitcoin. You're storing outlandish checks that you have written to yourself (or have accepted from a friend). Try to redeem your check at a gateway and you'll get nowhere.

Until you understand what you're doing, it is HIGHLY recommended that you do not extend trust lines (accept checks) from anyplace other than the bank (Gateway) where you deposited your money.

[PirateButtercup]

I think mastercoin is quite a bit better than ripple and it's gotten a lot more funding from what I've heard.

I am not well read on Mastercoin. However, it is clear that they are limited to crytpo-currencies. They do not have any systems to interact with dollars, yen, euros, sterling, etc.....let alone other value containers like frequent flier miles, starbucks credits, what-have-you.

It's inability to bridge the gap between fiat and crypto currencies as well as other units of value makes it a less viable option to Ripple, as it can handle ALL of the coins, all of the fiat and anything else you can dream up. (One guy for example started a currency backed by 1,000s of silver dimes he has....called DYM if you're interested)

In terms of funding, the seed money provided by Google Ventures, Andreesen Horowitz, et al has not been disclosed. The Angel funding simply isn't known. The Venture funding (the last round in November) was only $3.5. There are several articles online regarding the different types of funding as they progress if you want more information.

[mmeijeri]

You want them? just post your ripple address and trust me for 4 'bitcoins' and I'll send them to you.

You shouldn't be able to send them to people that don't trust TradeFortress.

[dancupid]

Ripple is simply amazing!!

If you don’t know, Ripple is actually 3 different things…

1. It is an internet protocol (like FTP, HTTP, etc.) designed for the sole purpose to federate existing financial systems the same way SMTP brought all the different email companies under one umbrella.

2. It is a market place that allows for the exchange and sale of fiat and crypto currencies.  

3. It is a currency created, not to hold value, but to lubricate the system. By charging .00001 XRP per transaction …. on a scale that proportionally increases to the volume of transactions the sender creates…..it prevents spam and defends against denial of service attacks.


Comparing fiat and crypto currencies to one another is similar to comparing different kinds of cars with different features. Dollars, Bitcoin, euros, litecoin, sterling….they all have something that make them stand out.

Ripple is VERY different. Ripple is the market place to buy and sell those cars and… more importantly .. the road on which they can faster than ever before!!!

I LOVE Bitcoin...that's why I'm using Ripple....I want to see Bitcoin succeed!!!!


(If you MUST have a conceptual comparison, try this: email meets bitcoin meets western union meets the forex)

Anyone want these? They look like bitcoins don't they?
You want them? just post your ripple address and trust me for 4 'bitcoins' and I'll send them to you.

I tell you what, I'll write you a check for 'em. In fact, I'll write you a check for a million dollars apiece.

You will accept a check, right? Checks....also known as IOUs....have been a cornerstone of the finance industry for centuries. Surely you would take my million dollar check then, right?

If you can find someone stupid enough to accept 'bitcoin checks' issued by dancupid, then send them on to me when your done...I'll see what they'll take for a million dollar check....or some magic beans....

You obviously have to exercise due diligence whenever you deposit your money anywhere....an online broker, a bank, a gateway, a mutual fund, etc. A person's willingness to accept a bad check is not a condemnation of the system.

But I still have these 4 'bitcoins' in my ripple account - they look the same as normal bitcoins, ripple tells me I have 4 bitcoins, but I know I have no bitcoins in my Ripple account.
I cannot now use Ripple, since I cannot tell which bitcoins are real and which are not.
It doesn't work, becasue it lets you store fake bitcoins and you have no way of telling which are real and which are not.
I do not trust it. So I will not use it.

How did you get 4 BTC that you know you don't have? It sounds like you created another account, extended trust to that account, and then sent 4 Bitcoin from one to the other. What you did was 'write a check' off of one wallet and put in another. Can you please post the trust lines that are currently in that wallet?

As I tried to get at earlier, I can write a check for a million dollars issued by the Bank of PirateButtercup. But why in the world would anyone take it?

You're not storing 'fake' Bitcoin. You're storing outlandish checks that you have written to yourself (or have accepted from a friend). Try to redeem your check at a gateway and you'll get nowhere.

Until you understand what you're doing, it is HIGHLY recommended that you do not extend trust lines (accept checks) from anyplace other than the bank (Gateway) where you deposited your money.

These are tradefortressIOUbitcoins - I bought them in this auction thread (to prove a point) https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=207054.0;all

Anyone can send a million spam emails telling people if they trust me for $100 I will send them 100 ripple dollars. People will just think 'ok - it can't do any harm'
There is no trust involved - no one cares if they think they have $100 in their ripple account.
And once they have their $100 they have no way of getting rid of that fake money and their ripple account no longer works.  
Fake money will sit in people accounts and they won't know what is real and what isn't.
People will build lines of fake trust, becasue that's how the internet is.

[PirateButtercup]

That sounds like a shitload lot of work for a normal person. No way that they will understand how to do it without researching it for hours. Like I said before, Ripple is a lot harder to grasp and understand then Bitcoin and this proves it onces again.

The primary reason it is so much harder to grasp is because it is WAY more than a crypto-currency. In fact, XRP...the currency in Ripple...is far from significant. Dollars, Euros, Bitcoin, Yen, Litecoin, etc. are what's important.

Perhaps these videos will help you:

Here's an overview of Ripple ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zxA3Gt7y3c

Here is an explanation of Ripple in 60 seconds ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwyIEMyMfqs

Here is a video to help you understand how a Gateway works ...  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M16ZatXbmLg

Here is a video to help you understand how the consensus ledger works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pj1QVb1vlC0

Perhaps this video will help you understand how the client works ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06H86TNeJMw

[codegeek]

So, what's your role with Ripple? Obviously not just a patron.

[PirateButtercup]

Ripple is simply amazing!!

If you don’t know, Ripple is actually 3 different things…

1. It is an internet protocol (like FTP, HTTP, etc.) designed for the sole purpose to federate existing financial systems the same way SMTP brought all the different email companies under one umbrella.

2. It is a market place that allows for the exchange and sale of fiat and crypto currencies.  

3. It is a currency created, not to hold value, but to lubricate the system. By charging .00001 XRP per transaction …. on a scale that proportionally increases to the volume of transactions the sender creates…..it prevents spam and defends against denial of service attacks.


Comparing fiat and crypto currencies to one another is similar to comparing different kinds of cars with different features. Dollars, Bitcoin, euros, litecoin, sterling….they all have something that make them stand out.

Ripple is VERY different. Ripple is the market place to buy and sell those cars and… more importantly .. the road on which they can faster than ever before!!!

I LOVE Bitcoin...that's why I'm using Ripple....I want to see Bitcoin succeed!!!!


(If you MUST have a conceptual comparison, try this: email meets bitcoin meets western union meets the forex)

Anyone want these? They look like bitcoins don't they?
You want them? just post your ripple address and trust me for 4 'bitcoins' and I'll send them to you.

I tell you what, I'll write you a check for 'em. In fact, I'll write you a check for a million dollars apiece.

You will accept a check, right? Checks....also known as IOUs....have been a cornerstone of the finance industry for centuries. Surely you would take my million dollar check then, right?

If you can find someone stupid enough to accept 'bitcoin checks' issued by dancupid, then send them on to me when your done...I'll see what they'll take for a million dollar check....or some magic beans....

You obviously have to exercise due diligence whenever you deposit your money anywhere....an online broker, a bank, a gateway, a mutual fund, etc. A person's willingness to accept a bad check is not a condemnation of the system.

But I still have these 4 'bitcoins' in my ripple account - they look the same as normal bitcoins, ripple tells me I have 4 bitcoins, but I know I have no bitcoins in my Ripple account.
I cannot now use Ripple, since I cannot tell which bitcoins are real and which are not.
It doesn't work, becasue it lets you store fake bitcoins and you have no way of telling which are real and which are not.
I do not trust it. So I will not use it.

How did you get 4 BTC that you know you don't have? It sounds like you created another account, extended trust to that account, and then sent 4 Bitcoin from one to the other. What you did was 'write a check' off of one wallet and put in another. Can you please post the trust lines that are currently in that wallet?

As I tried to get at earlier, I can write a check for a million dollars issued by the Bank of PirateButtercup. But why in the world would anyone take it?

You're not storing 'fake' Bitcoin. You're storing outlandish checks that you have written to yourself (or have accepted from a friend). Try to redeem your check at a gateway and you'll get nowhere.

Until you understand what you're doing, it is HIGHLY recommended that you do not extend trust lines (accept checks) from anyplace other than the bank (Gateway) where you deposited your money.

These are tradefortressIOUbitcoins - I bought them in this auction thread (to prove a point) https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=207054.0;all

Anyone can send a million spam emails telling people if they trust me for $100 I will send them 100 ripple dollars. People will just think 'ok - it can't do any harm'
There is no trust involved - no one cares if they think they have $100 in their ripple account.
And once they have their $100 they have no way of getting rid of that fake money and their ripple account no longer works.  
Fake money will sit in people accounts and they won't know what is real and what isn't.
People will build lines of fake trust, becasue that's how the internet is.

Interesting point. I know I have no need to trust anyone but the bank (gateway) where I deposited my money. If someone wants a loan, I'm just gonna send it to them....not open a trust line. According to the Ripple wiki they will have three levels of Gateways....

Now...in terms of the 'Ripple Dollars' you mentioned, not all dollars have the same value. (You can read about the 'free banking era' in the U.S. if you want a real extreme case of this.) The value of dollars from different gateways have different values. This is the same as how a Canadian quarter loses value the further you walk into the U.S. with it.....or how a dollar in the airport doesn't have the same value as a dollar at Walmart.

Before it comes out of Beta, Ripple has posted on the wiki page that there will be a 3 tiered system of Gateways. Personally, I'll only trust those who have been vetted, maintain a super high reserve ratio and have been approved by the International Ripple Business Association (IRBA).

That is no different than me saying that'll only open a checking account with a bank that is FDIC insured, and duly licensed and registered.

I'm sorry to say, but I won't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of Dancupid....and I would hope you don't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of PirateButtercup ;-)

[dancupid]

I'm sorry to say, but I won't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of Dancupid....and I would hope you don't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of PirateButtercup ;-)

I won't be extending any trust to the Ripple concept - so I won't be using it.

[PirateButtercup]

So, what's your role with Ripple? Obviously not just a patron.

Well....I've been donating a lot of processor time to World Community Grid to crunch data to cure cancer, aids, etc. They of course giveaway XRP for this.

I really relish the idea of a virtual Switzerland, where I can put money that I with minimal government intrusion. I wire money around the globe frequently and hate waiting days or weeks for it to get there (depending on holidays/weekends). I travel internationally and .... if you've ever been to a currency exchange ... get sick every time I pay money to use a different money.

I have a few XRP, but...honestly....I don't feel that it will ever exceed .10 cents.....maybe a dollar if it goes CRAZY.

It's the ease of the system that I love, the fact that it's open source. I also LOVE Bitcoin, I love it's anti-establishment nature. But I'm afraid it may be too anti-establishment (as demonstrated by China's/France's announcements).

I see the Ripple system as an excellent way to bridge the existing systems fiat with the future of cryptos, without which I'm afraid governments are gonna come out swinging ... as cryptos completely undermine the nation state.

Oh...and I abhor misinformation.

[laudub]

Hey all, super newbie here...

I'm not using Ripple yet and I'm not sure I plan to after reading what people here have to say about it. Yet I'm genuinely curious about it and I've got a question...

Can Ripple be used to buy LTC from BTC without having XRP involved in the process? Or is the "small fee" always paid in XRP?

Also, if I don't really "trust" Ripple to put all my eggs into and have no faith whatsoever in XRP, can I still use Ripple to, say:

- transfer a tiny amount of BTC from Bitstamp to Ripple
- exchange the tiny amount of BTC into another crypto currency at Ripple
- transfer the new cryptocurrency to my wallet(s)

How long would that take?

Basically I take it that my question comes down to: even if I don't trust Ripple much, can it still be useful to convert and move small amounts to/from different crypto currencies? (hence never being exposed too much to Ripple being a scam or getting owned by the feds / DoJ or hacked or anything else that could happen to the centralized dot com server).

[PirateButtercup]

I'm sorry to say, but I won't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of Dancupid....and I would hope you don't extend credit (trust) to the First National Gateway Bank of PirateButtercup ;-)

I won't be extending any trust to the Ripple concept - so I won't be using it.

I know someone who's wife left them because she met an old fling on Facebook....he won't use FB now.

I know someone who actually fell for that Nigerian email scam years ago....and they never use email now.

I know someone who owned a Mac in that late 80's that broke ...  he won't buy another Apple product.

I understand you've got some of TradeFortress's BTC...that sucks....and I understand why you won't be using Ripple now.



BTW...I recently learned of DATA (Digital Asset Transfer Authority) that is being set up to self-regulate the virtual money industry before governments start sledgehammering regulations. Bitcoin, Ripple and Ven seem to be the 3 represented bodies. It'll be interesting to see what they do to stop people like TradeFortress, or the robberies of earlier BTC sites.

Wish you luck, man....

[PirateButtercup]

Hey all, super newbie here...

I'm not using Ripple yet and I'm not sure I plan to after reading what people here have to say about it. Yet I'm genuinely curious about it and I've got a question...

Can Ripple be used to buy LTC from BTC without having XRP involved in the process? Or is the "small fee" always paid in XRP?

Also, if I don't really "trust" Ripple to put all my eggs into and have no faith whatsoever in XRP, can I still use Ripple to, say:

- transfer a tiny amount of BTC from Bitstamp to Ripple
- exchange the tiny amount of BTC into another crypto currency at Ripple
- transfer the new cryptocurrency to my wallet(s)

How long would that take?

Basically I take it that my question comes down to: even if I don't trust Ripple much, can it still be useful to convert and move small amounts to/from different crypto currencies? (hence never being exposed too much to Ripple being a scam or getting owned by the feds / DoJ or hacked or anything else that could happen to the centralized dot com server).

One XRP costs about .03 cents. There are 1,000,000 'drops' in a ripple. The system charges 10 drops.... or .000001 cents to send currency (other than XRP) from one account to another. This is required to prevent spam and denial of service attacks on the system.

I believe 20 XRP are required for an active account, but there are free XRPs everywhere.

Yes, you can buy and sell LTC/BTC in the Ripple system.
Yes you can transfer a tiny amount of BTC from Bitstamp into Ripple.
Yes you can exchange that tiny amount of BTC for any fiat or crypto currency available. (It's still in Beta, mind you.)
Yes you can transfer that new crypto currency (i.e. Litecoin) back out of Ripple. (you may wanna consider using JustCoin)
You will never need more than .50 cents worth of XRP in your entire life as it will cover 20,000,000 transactions.

Everything that you do within the Ripple system is instant.

Ripple is not on a centralized server. The consensus ledger is kept on numerous servers around the world. In fact, I'm in the process of setting up RippleD server right now. It is Open Source. (https://ripple.com/wiki/)

If you find a money swapping pair that is not available in the system....(for example Litecoin for Yen) ... then there is an opportunity for you to set yourself up as a market maker by offering that pair....

Good luck!! :-)