BlackArrow => Scam or not?

[melmo]

The guys from BlackArrow and CardReaderFactory are probably not scammers, but I question their ethics, as CardReaderFactory sells the "world's smallest bluetooth magnetic stripe readers" - have a look at product MSRv008.  I'm not sure why else someone would drop $2000 on this device other than to build an ATM skimming device.

They may not be scammers, but they like to sell parts to the scammers  

Interesting. Is it possible that it could be used
 for some sort of mobile card reader?

Sure, you could build whatever you want, but you could always just buy something like an IDTech which plugs into your phone or iPad and only costs $50.  Or get the Square device https://squareup.com/ which is free, but you have to use their service.

Bluetooth.  Battery-powered.  Super-thin.  Hmm, sounds like an Apple product

[McKinley]

haha, yesterday and today i got 4 emails from blackarrow that "Order #... has been placed successfully. Well i did not do anything....
They all have the same order # from an old order i once placed in December, but despite an inquiry at Blackarrow they never sent me a single reply. And now i'm getting automated mails about it being newly created.

haha. I don't even believe they are humans. Probably just a piece of code working on some server and getting programmed by some - by now - rich guy.

In December, I was sooo close, but now i'm so happy i didn't send the money. Now there is no way i am going to ever submit any money to Blackarrow.

[Gator-hex]

There's lots of people in the Bitcoin industry with a shady pasts, even BFL's Sonny did time, so I wouldn't worry about that.

My thinking is they'll deliver, but deliver last, as they started development later than everyone else on the 28nm node.
That's why their price of $3/GH is the lowest out there to reflect this.

[jimmothy]

There's lots of people in the Bitcoin industry with a shady pasts, even BFL's Sonny did time, so I wouldn't worry about that.

My thinking is they'll deliver, but deliver last, as they started development later than everyone else on the 28nm node.
That's why their price of $3/GH is the lowest out there to reflect this.

Source?

Afaik we don't have much info about the development process besides that they still plan to ship on time.

[McKinley]

There's lots of people in the Bitcoin industry with a shady pasts, even BFL's Sonny did time, so I wouldn't worry about that.

Blackarrow has shady past? - wtf....

are you just writing this, or you have some source
I asume you're not refering to my post, as i regard a few day old mails or an ~1 1/2 months old order not really ignorable "past".

[Gator-hex]

They sold miners through card read factory many moons ago. What do you think "smallest portable magnetic stripe card readers in the world" are used for? Many people on these forums have bought their miners and we've had photos from inside their factory, saw their FPGA to ASIC development hardware, if it's a scam, they went to a lot of trouble to hire a factory and fill it with mining hardware.  

Of course they could fail. Building a board and putting someone else's chip on it it easier than building your own ASIC from scratch. We saw that happen to bASIC, they delivered FPGAs, but later failed to deliver on a subsequent ASIC project.

Many in the community thought Butterfly Labs would be a scam, but they delivered (eventually), on their promises.

If you don't want to risk money in a pre-order buy a 28nm miner from Technobit with PayPal, but even he gets scammer accusations!

It's just the nature of the Bitcoin market... More risk, more reward!

Source?

are you just writing this, or you have some source

Photos of Flappysocks previous order with Black Arrow.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3866034#msg3866034

Photos from inside Black Arrows factory in China.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3884729#msg3884729

Photo of Black Arrows 22nm FPGA to ASIC development board.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3893629#msg3893629

"Re: Butterfly Labs CEO 25 Million USD Mail Fraud — A Concise Summary of Evidence"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110805.0

"TOWN HALL (prep) Meeting: Butterfly Labs"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110786.0

"The "What Black Arrow does not want you to know" thread"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=313049.0

"Black Arrow Software real or fake?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=365535.0

"Blackarrow Software Legit or Scam?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=339163.0

"Re: "BlackArrow" ASIC's, Trustable?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=316214.0

[jimmothy]

They sold miners through card read factory many moons ago. What do you think "smallest portable magnetic stripe card readers in the world" are used for? Many people on these forums have bought their miners and we've had photos from inside their factory, saw their FPGA to ASIC development hardware, if it's a scam, they went to a lot of trouble to hire a factory and fill it with mining hardware.  

Of course they could fail. Building a board and putting someone else's chip on it it easier than building your own ASIC from scratch. We saw that happen to bASIC, they delivered FPGAs, but later failed to deliver on a subsequent ASIC project.

Many in the community thought Butterfly Labs would be a scam, but they delivered (eventually), on their promises.

If you don't want to risk money in a pre-order buy a 28nm miner from Technobit with PayPal, but even he gets scammer accusations!

It's just the nature of the Bitcoin market... More risk, more reward!

Source?

are you just writing this, or you have some source

Photos of Flappysocks previous order with Black Arrow.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3866034#msg3866034

Photos from inside Black Arrows factory in China.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3884729#msg3884729

Photo of Black Arrows 22nm FPGA to ASIC development board.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=294197.msg3893629#msg3893629

"Re: Butterfly Labs CEO 25 Million USD Mail Fraud — A Concise Summary of Evidence"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110805.0

"TOWN HALL (prep) Meeting: Butterfly Labs"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110786.0

"The "What Black Arrow does not want you to know" thread"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=313049.0

"Black Arrow Software real or fake?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=365535.0

"Blackarrow Software Legit or Scam?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=339163.0

"Re: "BlackArrow" ASIC's, Trustable?"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=316214.0

Thanks for the great list of sources. I agree that this does look like bfl but from what I've read BA has a much better track record of shipping on time. I'm hoping for less than 1 month delay. Or at least before asicminer gen3 chips go up for sale.