NixZiZ's mining rigs

[kalus]

I'm not sure what the BFD is with using open cases versus a normal chassis for GPU mining rigs.

With proper airflow front to back, I'm sure they would stay plenty cool.  *WITH* proper airflow.

I used to work in a data center and we put together servers all the time.  Most of the time, an open case was actually worse for cooling, because it disrupts the front-to-back airflow the chassis is designed for. 

Closed case: Cool air gets sucked through the front, channeled over components and hot air shoots out the back, 100% of moving air comes directly in contact with components and cools them down

Open case:  Cool air gets sucked in through the front, but most of it ends up shooting out the sides instead of being funneled directly over the components as it is with a closed chassis

Thats when you need some mobo shit to be cooled passivelly by airflow, like chipset, ram ,hdd, etc.  For mining rig this doesn't matter and GPU has active coooling system, so it sucks air itself and don't care about air flow inside case.

also, the open air mining rigs use risers to allow better spacing and airflow around the entire card.  they're also usually accompanied by large box fans that bolt on to the top or side. 

[NixZiZ]

Please be aware that I am a VERY VERY low volume computer seller. Ok, sure, I can RMA defective parts, which I will do after I have to drop my prices to 1350 as I make, again, almost no money.

The thing is that a RMA often takes weeks, and some people would be mighty pissed if I had to hold their product for a few weeks because I have to RMA a bad part etc etc. Well, that's where I am coming from.

the margins are too small for you to make a profit - why do it if you're not making any money?

if you have an account with a supplier, your RMA gets processed according to the terms of the contract.  You can't compete on price and turnaround if your supplier is tigerdirect.

Finally, I saw in one of your other threads, you posted an invoice from Tigerdirect w/ your parts costs, you're asking for way too much of a mark up on something that requires no special skills.

you must differentiate your product to justify asking for a higher price.  you can set whatever price you want, if you can show the customer value for money.  Apple does it, Lenovo does it, Asus, ATI, and nVidia do it too.

My differentiation is that these things are pre-configured and ready for you to just plugin and mine with.

If there is another way to differentiate let me know.

[kalus]

Please be aware that I am a VERY VERY low volume computer seller. Ok, sure, I can RMA defective parts, which I will do after I have to drop my prices to 1350 as I make, again, almost no money.

The thing is that a RMA often takes weeks, and some people would be mighty pissed if I had to hold their product for a few weeks because I have to RMA a bad part etc etc. Well, that's where I am coming from.

the margins are too small for you to make a profit - why do it if you're not making any money?

if you have an account with a supplier, your RMA gets processed according to the terms of the contract.  You can't compete on price and turnaround if your supplier is tigerdirect.

Finally, I saw in one of your other threads, you posted an invoice from Tigerdirect w/ your parts costs, you're asking for way too much of a mark up on something that requires no special skills.

you must differentiate your product to justify asking for a higher price.  you can set whatever price you want, if you can show the customer value for money.  Apple does it, Lenovo does it, Asus, ATI, and nVidia do it too.

My differentiation is that these things are pre-configured and ready for you to just plugin and mine with.

If there is another way to differentiate let me know.

then i would be giving away my business, right?  

marketing isn't hard:  start by looking at the market you're trying to sell to, and what advertisements you've seen that are effective.  

then rip them off.  

you should have some idea how many you'll sell per week, per month etc.  that is how you determine your inventory.  you also have to figure out how much inventory you need becuase of the batshit crazy fluctuations in radeon supply.

start by controlling your costs.  if you don't control your costs you'll stand to lose a lot of money you may not have to lose.  and learn how to RMA.  Even a technician at futureshop or best buy would be trained in expediting RMAs from their suppliers.

[NixZiZ]

Please be aware that I am a VERY VERY low volume computer seller. Ok, sure, I can RMA defective parts, which I will do after I have to drop my prices to 1350 as I make, again, almost no money.

The thing is that a RMA often takes weeks, and some people would be mighty pissed if I had to hold their product for a few weeks because I have to RMA a bad part etc etc. Well, that's where I am coming from.

the margins are too small for you to make a profit - why do it if you're not making any money?

if you have an account with a supplier, your RMA gets processed according to the terms of the contract.  You can't compete on price and turnaround if your supplier is tigerdirect.

Finally, I saw in one of your other threads, you posted an invoice from Tigerdirect w/ your parts costs, you're asking for way too much of a mark up on something that requires no special skills.

you must differentiate your product to justify asking for a higher price.  you can set whatever price you want, if you can show the customer value for money.  Apple does it, Lenovo does it, Asus, ATI, and nVidia do it too.

My differentiation is that these things are pre-configured and ready for you to just plugin and mine with.

If there is another way to differentiate let me know.

then i would be giving away my business, right?  

marketing isn't hard:  start by looking at the market you're trying to sell to, and what advertisements you've seen that are effective.  

then rip them off.  

you should have some idea how many you'll sell per week, per month etc.  that is how you determine your inventory.  you also have to figure out how much inventory you need becuase of the batshit crazy fluctuations in radeon supply.

start by controlling your costs.  if you don't control your costs you'll stand to lose a lot of money you may not have to lose.  and learn how to RMA.  Even a technician at futureshop or best buy would be trained in expediting RMAs from their suppliers.

Yeah, thanks for that.

I will see what I can do. I was thinking of re-writing my business plan...

Well... we will see what I can do. For now, I am working on securing a couple of custom orders.

[NixZiZ]

Please be aware that I am a VERY VERY low volume computer seller. Ok, sure, I can RMA defective parts, which I will do after I have to drop my prices to 1350 as I make, again, almost no money.

The thing is that a RMA often takes weeks, and some people would be mighty pissed if I had to hold their product for a few weeks because I have to RMA a bad part etc etc. Well, that's where I am coming from.

the margins are too small for you to make a profit - why do it if you're not making any money?

if you have an account with a supplier, your RMA gets processed according to the terms of the contract.  You can't compete on price and turnaround if your supplier is tigerdirect.

Finally, I saw in one of your other threads, you posted an invoice from Tigerdirect w/ your parts costs, you're asking for way too much of a mark up on something that requires no special skills.

you must differentiate your product to justify asking for a higher price.  you can set whatever price you want, if you can show the customer value for money.  Apple does it, Lenovo does it, Asus, ATI, and nVidia do it too.

My differentiation is that these things are pre-configured and ready for you to just plugin and mine with.

If there is another way to differentiate let me know.

then i would be giving away my business, right?  

marketing isn't hard:  start by looking at the market you're trying to sell to, and what advertisements you've seen that are effective.  

then rip them off.  

you should have some idea how many you'll sell per week, per month etc.  that is how you determine your inventory.  you also have to figure out how much inventory you need becuase of the batshit crazy fluctuations in radeon supply.

start by controlling your costs.  if you don't control your costs you'll stand to lose a lot of money you may not have to lose.  and learn how to RMA.  Even a technician at futureshop or best buy would be trained in expediting RMAs from their suppliers.

I guess this forum is not my target market then. My target market would be people who want to mine, but have no clue how to set up the miners, etc, just want to plug it in and run them.

[Amberdark]

ok you wanted constructive criticism:

• most people here know how to assemble their own rigs
• the ones that do not can go to a local shop and have them assembled for very cheap - they will not charge people 13% to do it
• you aren't offering anything impressive or new, or even good price wise
• if you want mining in closed enclosure then use liquid cooling - fans only go on the radiators for push-pull!
• if you are really serious and want to make something cool - find a cheap way to make liquid cooled U1 or U2 sized racks with GPUs like these guys made here - I for one would be extremely interested in something like this:

and yes this is litecoin mining at it's finest

[NixZiZ]

ok you wanted constructive criticism:

• most people here know how to assemble their own rigs
• the ones that do not can go to a local shop and have them assembled for very cheap - they will not charge people 13% to do it
• you aren't offering anything impressive or new, or even good price wise
• if you want mining in closed enclosure then use liquid cooling - fans only go on the radiators for push-pull!
• if you are really serious and want to make something cool - find a cheap way to make liquid cooled U1 or U2 sized racks with GPUs like these guys made here - I for one would be extremely interested in something like this:

and yes this is litecoin mining at it's finest

Damn, that is insane...

I think there may be a way to do that.. but with custom parts, not stock.

EDIT. Found a way... A very interesting way.

[KingGoon]

I have a feeling your not trying to make money  all the dust & cotton swabs  wtf wtf  just spread a white blanket and make some pictures

[NixZiZ]

I have a feeling your not trying to make money  all the dust & cotton swabs  wtf wtf  just spread a white blanket and make some pictures

Lol those were zip ties. Yes, the pictures were rushed. I will get much better ones soon.

Just waiting for the milk crate & riser to take a picture of a milk crate rig.

This is just a launch product... I will have a more interesting one coming out later.

[NixZiZ]

ok you wanted constructive criticism:

• most people here know how to assemble their own rigs
• the ones that do not can go to a local shop and have them assembled for very cheap - they will not charge people 13% to do it
• you aren't offering anything impressive or new, or even good price wise
• if you want mining in closed enclosure then use liquid cooling - fans only go on the radiators for push-pull!
• if you are really serious and want to make something cool - find a cheap way to make liquid cooled U1 or U2 sized racks with GPUs like these guys made here - I for one would be extremely interested in something like this:

and yes this is litecoin mining at it's finest

Actually you will be surprised what forced airflow will do in a server, with the proper shrouds etc. I doubt those are liquid cooled... although the mobo and such I guess is custom with those. Looks more like an excellent implementation of air-cooling. It is very difficult to get proper liquid cooling into a server less than 4u, but is very easy to get very proper air cooling in a 2u server with 4 GPUs... Just use shrouds to direct the airflow and counter-rotating high-airflow directional fans, around 150CFM each. Should be more than enough to cool a GPU.

[Amberdark]

these are entirely liquid cooled, there are large radiators with giant fans set to push-pull on the back side of the racks
the guy that owns these told me that they really did a lot of scavenging to cut down on costs, for example the fans for the radiators are custom made, repurposed from broken AC units

Also the way they did it for easy removal is they added valves at the back of each rack, that way in case they need to remove one, they just close the valve and drain the liquid from the unit later

[NixZiZ]

these are entirely liquid cooled, there are large radiators with giant fans set to push-pull on the back side of the racks
the guy that owns these told me that they really did a lot of scavenging to cut down on costs, for example the fans for the radiators are custom made, repurposed from broken AC units

Also the way they did it for easy removal is they added valves at the back of each rack, that way in case they need to remove one, they just close the valve and drain the liquid from the unit later

Damn... then those are really nuts. If someone would be willing to buy a full rack I would do that, but not very... practical for a self-contained unit that can fit into any colo.

[NixZiZ]

these are entirely liquid cooled, there are large radiators with giant fans set to push-pull on the back side of the racks
the guy that owns these told me that they really did a lot of scavenging to cut down on costs, for example the fans for the radiators are custom made, repurposed from broken AC units

Also the way they did it for easy removal is they added valves at the back of each rack, that way in case they need to remove one, they just close the valve and drain the liquid from the unit later

So technically these aren't 1u sized units... their cooling needs an external rad that I could not ship with the units.


And a standard Colo place would not stand for it either lol

[Amberdark]

these are entirely liquid cooled, there are large radiators with giant fans set to push-pull on the back side of the racks
the guy that owns these told me that they really did a lot of scavenging to cut down on costs, for example the fans for the radiators are custom made, repurposed from broken AC units

Also the way they did it for easy removal is they added valves at the back of each rack, that way in case they need to remove one, they just close the valve and drain the liquid from the unit later

So technically these aren't 1u sized units... their cooling needs an external rad that I could not ship with the units.


And a standard Colo place would not stand for it either lol

you just make the entire u1 or u2 unit with the cooling pipes and everything inside, then make a nice hole at the back and add one of these (do not fill up the thing with the cooling liquid - let the user do that himself, as shipping with liquid inside is not a great idea):

and then you can sell the radiators, fans, pumps as a kit or even separately and just include a step by step instruction manual in the kit.. as you've determined people here are tech savvy so they will pretty much know what to do, but in case they don't they always have the manual

[NixZiZ]

these are entirely liquid cooled, there are large radiators with giant fans set to push-pull on the back side of the racks
the guy that owns these told me that they really did a lot of scavenging to cut down on costs, for example the fans for the radiators are custom made, repurposed from broken AC units

Also the way they did it for easy removal is they added valves at the back of each rack, that way in case they need to remove one, they just close the valve and drain the liquid from the unit later

So technically these aren't 1u sized units... their cooling needs an external rad that I could not ship with the units.


And a standard Colo place would not stand for it either lol

you just make the entire u1 or u2 unit with the cooling pipes and everything inside, then make a nice hole at the back and add one of these (do not fill up the thing with the cooling liquid - let the user do that himself, as shipping with liquid inside is not a great idea):

and then you can sell the radiators, fans, pumps as a kit or even separately and just include a step by step instruction manual in the kit.. as you've determined people here are tech savvy so they will pretty much know what to do, but in case they don't they always have the manual

Very interesting. I will have to look into that for sure then. I guess I can always make a 2u radiator system also. I am only one person, so getting this one out may be a while, but it would be interesting for sure.

[gsupp]

ok you wanted constructive criticism:

• if you are really serious and want to make something cool - find a cheap way to make liquid cooled U1 or U2 sized racks with GPUs like these guys made here - I for one would be extremely interested in something like this:

and yes this is litecoin mining at it's finest

I'm not sure where you're getting your information from, but those are not Litecoin mining rigs, they are not liquid cooled and they don't have GPUs in them. They were custom built for the Internet Archive (http://archive.org) and named PetaBox http://archive.org/web/petabox.php They are storage servers, you can even see the "Internet Archive" logo in the picture on the 2U blank panels.

OP: I believe there is a market for selling mining rigs. There are people interested in cryptocurrency that can't build their own rigs. Unfortunately you won't find many of these people on this forum. Building your own computer from parts is a special skill that not everyone has, just most people on this forum have it.

[NixZiZ]

ok you wanted constructive criticism:

• if you are really serious and want to make something cool - find a cheap way to make liquid cooled U1 or U2 sized racks with GPUs like these guys made here - I for one would be extremely interested in something like this:

and yes this is litecoin mining at it's finest

I'm not sure where you're getting your information from, but those are not Litecoin mining rigs, they are not liquid cooled and they don't have GPUs in them. They were custom built for the Internet Archive (http://archive.org) and named PetaBox http://archive.org/web/petabox.php They are storage servers, you can even see the "Internet Archive" logo in the picture on the 2U blank panels.

OP: I believe there is a market for selling mining rigs. There are people interested in cryptocurrency that can't build their own rigs. Unfortunately you won't find many of these people on this forum. Building your own computer from parts is a special skill that not everyone has, just most people on this forum have it.

Thanks man. Yeah, I did lots of work to figure out if something like that would work... it would not without me spending tens of thousands where if I spent it I may as well develop an ASIC miner!


I re-jigged my pricing to make it better.

I am still dedicated to doing these rigs.

[gsupp]

Thanks man. Yeah, I did lots of work to figure out if something like that would work... it would not without me spending tens of thousands where if I spent it I may as well develop an ASIC miner!


I re-jigged my pricing to make it better.

I am still dedicated to doing these rigs.

Can you keep the cards cool enough in a HAF XM case? I tried running 3 cards on a 3-way SLI motherboard without risers and I couldn't keep the cards from overheating and shutting off. Even with a 103 CFM fan blowing directly on them.

[NixZiZ]

Yes, it is more than possible to keep the cards cool in such a case. It's a big case, with lots and lots of airflow already in it, so adding two fans forcing air down should not hurt the already decent temps a bit.

May I ask what card you were running? I set my cards to 85% fan speed when I mine. I don't let it use auto fan... that is like a card-death waiting for you.