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Mikcik (OP)
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December 28, 2013, 01:51:03 AM
 #1


There are some conspiracy theories about Bitcoin. To those who belive that everyting IS a conspiracy- you are WRONG (sorry to destroy your worldview). On the other hand, for those that think that EVERY conspiracy theory is just plain nonsense, you are WRONG also (sorry to destroy your worldview). This is a fact, check history.

As some of you may know there are "economic conspiracy theories" regarding the comming collapse of US (petro)dollar, and the end of dollar status as the world reserve currency and his replacement with basket of currencies or gold-back- yuan (Chinese currency). The underlying base issue is that USA and western economies in general are not in a good shape, the numbers (inflation, unemployement, GDP etc.) are manipulated to look better than what they really are, and there should be a much worse recesion than that in 2008 (in the upcoming months or few years...), maybe even worse than the recesion in 1913. How does bitcoin relate to this?

The conspiracies say that Bitcoin is a product of some government (probably western, probably USA) to somehow manipulate the current (bad economic)situation. Its true that the NSA has known about the possibilities (threats) of crypto currencies as back as of 1996 (really, look it up on web), and bitcoin is build up on sha-256 which was developed i think by usa military or darpa or NSA, so they COULD have (not "have", but "could have")some backdoor mechanism there to break it if wanted). Also the gov. may have i dont know, maybe even quantum computers these days. Its a common knowledge that military/gov. is few years of development ahead than anybody "outside" thinks. Throw in the absolutely weird senate hearings in USA which were somehow mysteriously in favour of bitcoin, also the weird fact that bitcoin wasnt already banned worldwide (which it should have been cause its threating the status of paper printed national currencies(which isnt somethine any state would like)) and throw in also the mysterious Satoshi Nakamoto indentity... Ugh and also one "possible big enemy" of USA, china has been negative on bitcoin...and you have a nice "conspiracy theory playground". Also theres the theory of so called "New World Order" (in which i dont belive fully) that wants 1 united world goverment  and 1 global currency.

So lets be a little bit crazy, lets say for a moment that theres really some government (or secret service) plot behind bitcoin (lets say its the USA), and lets conspire :-). What would be the reason for something like this:

(Also please people, reply only if you know something about the subject (if you dont )know what a petrodolar is for example, its probably not worth for you to even bother with this thread))

1) USA wants to prevent china from having a world reserve currency (gold back?) yuan? The dollar will probably be soon dead so it needs something else, and here comes the old (1996) idea of crypto currencies... Its made to look as it was developed by some "random inteligent independent liberty loving dude" to encourage the adoption ("by the people for the people"). And USA will as time rises become stronger and stronger advocate of Bitcoin... (just to try to stand ground and somehow try to cripple the rising power of YUAN (China), trying to prevent it from becoming as strong as it could be by offering (secretly) an alternative - bitcoin. Its also worth considering, that USA probably doesnt have any gold in FED or Fort Knox (see Germany gold repatriation problem), so if china backs it currency by gold (the only on the world, making it theoretically very demanded), the USA has nothing to respond with, it has no gold, the dollar is inflated like hell, and the whole economy is crippled. China is the strong one here (bully) and USA the weaker one, if usa wants to win, it has to play inteligently because it has "nothing", so it comes secretly with this revolutionary concept of Bitcoin (which doesnt cost them a penny to make (almost)) :-), wouldnt it be a briliant idea :-)!? Also dont forget that usa pulled of similiar and original trick "before" when the dollar was unplugged totally from the gold standard, and thus was "just a paper" overnight (threating to lose the status of world reserve currency) and Henry Kissinger (or someone) came with original and briliant idea to peg it with oil producing countries, thus giving birth to a petrol dolar :-). Do you see the similiarities :-)? (Im not saying its this way totally, but both seems similiar and almost brilliant strategic moves)

2) This is separate theory, or it could enhance the previous. USA (gov. secret service i dont know) didnt just invent bitcoin, but it has also a backdoor in it (im not a programmer), it has backdoor to sha-256 algorythm, or it (gov) has currently acces to greater computing power than anybody thinks (maybe quantum computers...). Gov. are ahead of the development, think of stealth bombers (the technology existed (far?) before it was "shown" to the public) etc. So USA might almost fully adopt bitcoin as its own (+western countries) currency in the future just to offset the role or Yuan (china+russia aliance+BRICS). And because of the backdoor, theres the possibility to secretly inflate if needed (in the long term)

3) The Bitcoin is a true, well intended, true and honest idea, no conspiracy involved. The gov. of course doesnt like bitcoin (who would give up the power to print money voluntarily) and has its own plan for the dolar collapse, economic problems, possible one world future currency. It will let bitcoin become more spread and when will all look "sunshine and butterflies" and the bitcoin would be gaining more and more confidence, they will step in and under some pretex ban all bussines from accepting bitcoin, thus DESTROYing bitcoin price and bitcoin itself, leaving many "investors" poor and effectivelly killing any fate in the cryptocurrency concept in general... At least i would do it this way, its more effective and youll be sure that people will stay away from any other future cryptocurrencies bearing the fatal crash they experienced with bitcoin... Be nice, nice, nice, let it grow, noobs (masses) will come, everyting looks nice and then, CRASH. Masses willl bear the feeling of their vanishing savings a long time after this and will BEG for fiat :-). Quick and effective.

4) Bitcoin is really the "one global currency" that supposedly NWO wants (check NWO (new world order) on google. When the global financial system fails, the banks fail, bail-ins, bail-outs, savings vanishing, here comes the saver... the Bitcoin... Which would then ("naturally" (read secretly pushed)) become the one world currency, with (supposedly) peoples choice :-)... (but i dont really belive fully in NWO so...)


If we accept that theres is a conspiracy in Bitcoin (just for the sake of this discusion if you dont belive in it), what version is the most possible? I belive version 1 (or 2), or even 3, whats your opinion on this?
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December 28, 2013, 07:37:51 AM
 #2

A conspiracy theory I've had is that bitcoin was created by a nation state, why i don't know. but the ability for someone like the nsa to track every single transaction going on certainly seems like something they would like, especially given the difficulty they have in monitoring funds of terrorists/persons of interest in foreign countries.  Add into the number of people who have past connections with the NSA and now work in various positions that give them a lot of control over monitoring things , you got yourself a conspiracy. Also the fact that whoever did create bitcoin has manged to somehow remain anonymous, that's pretty hard to but it's something a state nation could quite easily pull off if need be.

Not saying it's true or not, I lean towards not. But it is something I've pondered about while sitting around with too much time on my hand.

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December 28, 2013, 07:59:52 AM
 #3

Yes! I believe you. As the forward march of globalization has stopped with 2008 financial crisis giving a way to more conditional interventionist-nationalist model. Globalization depends on technology and politics. Bitcoin is both. Historically, technology has been single most important force for opening up of borders. In 1800's- its was spread of steam ship and refrigeration, expansion of rail roads and invention of telegraph that gave a push to globalization. In 1980-90's, it was shipping container and more recently it has been internet allowing information and exchanged to she shared in blink of an eye. Technology is not enough, globalization also needs political patronage. Nothing great has been achieved without political patronage.

He's Nick Sazbo from Washington. I've my answer. Or Hal? :O
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December 28, 2013, 09:10:57 AM
 #4

Sorry if this destroys your world view OP, but there is no "backdoor" in SHA256, its a public known and tested algorithm.  One might be able to put a backdoor into an implementation or application based on it, or in a random number generator seeding the algorithm, but the algo itself is sound.  Also, China isn't going to become gold backed, their currency and entire economy is export driven and backed by sales of goods to the west, so they wind up owning lots of our currency (and assets).
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December 28, 2013, 10:18:41 AM
 #5



Alex Jones here. Bitcoin was created by the globalist elite as a one world currency to enslave us all.

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December 28, 2013, 11:40:30 AM
 #6

Sorry if this destroys your world view OP, but there is no "backdoor" in SHA256, its a public known and tested algorithm.  One might be able to put a backdoor into an implementation or application based on it, or in a random number generator seeding the algorithm, but the algo itself is sound.  Also, China isn't going to become gold backed, their currency and entire economy is export driven and backed by sales of goods to the west, so they wind up owning lots of our currency (and assets).

OH... REALLY :-)...

http://www.vdschagt.com/bitcoin-surprisingly-dodges-cryptographic-bullet/

Even thought its not connected to bitcoin directly, (it doesnr affect him), its nice to see that all your crypto encryption fate isnt that strong (or rather correct)...

EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.
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December 28, 2013, 12:27:18 PM
 #7


That is about the random number generator, not SHA256, so consistant with the point I made.
Mikcik (OP)
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December 28, 2013, 01:21:41 PM
 #8


That is about the random number generator, not SHA256, so consistant with the point I made.

WTF!? Someone is stupid here... as far as i get it (granted, english is not my native language),  the random number generator (the  Dual Elliptic Curve Deterministic Random Bit Generators ) is somehow tigtly connected to SHA256 (one of its versions), so if the " Dual Elliptic Curve Deterministic Random Bit Generator" is compromised, the (one version) of sha256 is compromised, do i get it right?
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December 28, 2013, 01:52:20 PM
 #9



EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I love it when paranoid conspiracy theorists become paranoid of other paranoid conspiracy theorists.
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December 28, 2013, 01:59:27 PM
 #10

Sorry if this destroys your world view OP, but there is no "backdoor" in SHA256, its a public known and tested algorithm.  One might be able to put a backdoor into an implementation or application based on it, or in a random number generator seeding the algorithm, but the algo itself is sound.  Also, China isn't going to become gold backed, their currency and entire economy is export driven and backed by sales of goods to the west, so they wind up owning lots of our currency (and assets).

OH... REALLY :-)...

http://www.vdschagt.com/bitcoin-surprisingly-dodges-cryptographic-bullet/

Even thought its not connected to bitcoin directly, (it doesnr affect him), its nice to see that all your crypto encryption fate isnt that strong (or rather correct)...

EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I haven't seen any evidence supporting that he's a CIA asset, but he does seem to be making a decnt living off peddling his paranoia products.


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MULTI
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1500+
CASINO GAMES
CRYPTO EXCLUSIVE
CLUBHOUSE
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December 28, 2013, 07:07:44 PM
 #11



EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I love it when paranoid conspiracy theorists become paranoid of other paranoid conspiracy theorists.

Well, no thats just the fool-mans sence, check the reality.
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December 28, 2013, 07:19:13 PM
 #12

Sorry if this destroys your world view OP, but there is no "backdoor" in SHA256, its a public known and tested algorithm.  One might be able to put a backdoor into an implementation or application based on it, or in a random number generator seeding the algorithm, but the algo itself is sound.  Also, China isn't going to become gold backed, their currency and entire economy is export driven and backed by sales of goods to the west, so they wind up owning lots of our currency (and assets).

OH... REALLY :-)...

http://www.vdschagt.com/bitcoin-surprisingly-dodges-cryptographic-bullet/

Even thought its not connected to bitcoin directly, (it doesnr affect him), its nice to see that all your crypto encryption fate isnt that strong (or rather correct)...

EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I haven't seen any evidence supporting that he's a CIA asset, but he does seem to be making a decnt living off peddling his paranoia products.



Well if you want to talk about it... didnt you notice yet? His behavior etc. Just look on his face, he is a liar really NOT a good actor (he should work on it more), but thats just my impression. But other proofs- Just check the video where he debates on youtube with piers morgan (on gunt control issue) and with some british anchor on bilderberg group... Look at him, what impresion does he gave you... a CRAZY MAN, its a TOTAL overreaction... He doesnt behave this way when he is on his own program... He discredits with such behaviour the whole conspiracy "movement", which he says hes a part of... Seriously if you failed to realize that, then you are have been conned.

I started listenign to his youtube channel for a few days and immidiatelly canceled my subscription to his channel , because its obvious he belongs to the "crazy conspiracy" circles, and not by accident, i really belive that hes role is to divert any people who might be interested in conspiracies, when they sence that something isnt right, theyll will start to look into this issue a little but more, THEN they will find alex jones, and what will the be reaction of the stupid majority of them---- "OH MY GOD, its really not true, look at him, hes crazy, all the conspiracies are crazy, i will never pay attention to anything like this anymore", thats his role :-). Seriously you didnt notice yet

And Alex Jones is not a crazy person, he is very inteligent, but a "con man".
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December 29, 2013, 02:01:26 AM
 #13



EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I love it when paranoid conspiracy theorists become paranoid of other paranoid conspiracy theorists.

I locked all the doors and lowered all the lights so that I could reply to this post. I think... WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT NOISE? BRB...

Back! It was nothing. Nothing at all. Like I was saying, while enjoying a nice ice cold glass of Kool Aid...
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December 29, 2013, 02:46:55 AM
 #14

Mikcik, what you are obviously missing here, is that any encryption is composed of multiple elements.

So for your idea:

SHA256: this hashes the data nothing more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA-2#Pseudocode
Enigma machine simplification, the order you put the rotating encryption wheels.

secp256r1 & secp256k1: http://www.secg.org/collateral/sec2_final.pdf page 15 & 16
Uhm this is a hard one to explain, if you know a bit about crypto, you know that the more complex you make the encryption, the harder it to bruteforce it. What these curves are supposed to do, is give a map, where you only have to do one step and it shows you the whole path, but just by moving that step by a millimeter, you see a totally different path. Which results into the fact, that if you generate a very large random number, it will be impossible for anyone to figure out the path you take.
Enigma machine simplification, you have the rotating wheels for encrypting decrypting, see a curve as one of those wheels. (but instead of giving you number 1 to 27, it gives you a whole curve of numbers, almost stretching into infinity.)

ECDSA: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elliptic_Curve_DSA
You use this to get a conversion from private to public key.
Enigma machine simplification, this would be the full enigma machine.

Think this is as simple as I can put it.
One part breaks, it can affect the whole thing.
I could be wrong in some of this (I don't believe I am but still) so if I'm wrong please correct me. (with references please)

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December 29, 2013, 01:26:52 PM
 #15

All those people who are jealous from newly popularized currency bitcoin are spreading false conspiracies to destroy bitcoin. But in actual bitcoin is a strong currency which shall not be impacted by the false conspiracies but shall keep on popularizing until it reaches in every person hand in the world.
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December 29, 2013, 01:34:28 PM
 #16

I heard that Max Keiser might actually be Satoshi Nakamoto!

Cheesy
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December 29, 2013, 01:41:40 PM
 #17

Sorry if this destroys your world view OP, but there is no "backdoor" in SHA256, its a public known and tested algorithm.  One might be able to put a backdoor into an implementation or application based on it, or in a random number generator seeding the algorithm, but the algo itself is sound.  Also, China isn't going to become gold backed, their currency and entire economy is export driven and backed by sales of goods to the west, so they wind up owning lots of our currency (and assets).

OH... REALLY :-)...

http://www.vdschagt.com/bitcoin-surprisingly-dodges-cryptographic-bullet/

Even thought its not connected to bitcoin directly, (it doesnr affect him), its nice to see that all your crypto encryption fate isnt that strong (or rather correct)...

EDIT: Alex Jones is probably a CIA asset or in other words "fake" (and also has a nice business ripping people of), if you didnt realize it yet, you are doomed.


I haven't seen any evidence supporting that he's a CIA asset, but he does seem to be making a decnt living off peddling his paranoia products.



Well if you want to talk about it... didnt you notice yet? His behavior etc. Just look on his face, he is a liar really NOT a good actor (he should work on it more), but thats just my impression.

I find many conspiracy theorist's behaviour odd. I don't believe he believes half the bullshit he peddles, but who knows. Maybe he is actually nuts, but he's running a business at the end of the day, so it's in his interests to keep the paranoid paranoid.

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December 29, 2013, 01:48:28 PM
 #18



Alex Jones here. Bitcoin was created by the globalist elite as a one world currency to enslave us all.


I thought the dollar already was doing a good job at that
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December 29, 2013, 01:49:41 PM
 #19

I heard that Max Keiser might actually be Satoshi Nakamoto!

Cheesy


Probably started by Alex Jones.
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December 29, 2013, 01:51:11 PM
 #20

I heard that Max Keiser might actually be Satoshi Nakamoto!

Cheesy


Probably started by Alex Jones.

I actually saw an interview with Alex Jones and Max Kaiser where he accused Max of being Satoshi Nakamoto and making Bitcoin to get back at people for something or other that happened to him back in the day, I lol'd Cheesy
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