[RESOLVED] Another Transaction Gone Sour (dalamchops and Garrett Burgwardt)

[dalamchops]

This is the original sales thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=37372.0

Here's from the beginning to the end. Garrett can feel free to add in any important details i've missed.

Pretty much we agreed on a sale price of 62BTC (without ssd). 50 BTC upfront, and 12 BTC upon USPS receiving it. That went smoothly.

Garrett received laptop today, sent an email to me saying there are vertical lines on the screen (assuming this happened during postage, i used the laptop up until the moment i took out the ssd and packed it). He sent me some pictures, and he was accurate. He demanded either 30BTC to fix the screen (cost of radiance screen), or a full refund of the laptop + 2 BTC for shipping.

I specifically asked for a picture with a white background.

http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/2984/img20110825193558.jpg

The reason for that is if you look in the original post, there was a piece of dust under the screen that i specifically mentioned to the buyer, to accurately describe the condition to the potential buyer. I wanted Garrett to find me the dust (very visible in my pictures) so i can confirm we are talking about the same screen. I also added that i was fully ready to pay $200 + 2.23BTC (all i have in btc atm) to help alleviate the cost, but i would not cover the entire cost because I was not at fault because we are still assuming that the damage occurred during shipping (trentzb can attest to how i package things, sold him a laptop).

He then replied saying that he actually opened the screen and tried to clean the dust off. Now that's where the advice is needed.

There's absolutely no proof that he can provide to prove that he didn't damage the screen by trying to clean the dust. He admitted to the screen being tampered with. To me, that automatically tells me that i absolutely should not take the laptop back (which i won't) since it's been messed with. However i am still willing to send $150 (half the cost to fix) to Garrett so he can try to get a screen.

I am asking for advice on what i should do.

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[dalamchops]

Sounds like HE broke it, you owe nothing.

Thx. Obviously i told him about this thread, and i want the public to hear his side of the story before we conclude everything.

[thavok]

Agreed if he opened the screen after deliver he broke it he bought it.

[Stefanie Andrea]

He broke it & you don't owe anything.

[Hollie]

You don't owe him anything.

He broke it himself after delivery.

[Garrett Burgwardt]

I'll agree with that chain of events, for the most part.

After seeing this thread I went through my phone looking to see if any of the junk pictures I took when I first was documenting the screen had the speck of dust (which is a great identifier for the laptop, btw   )

Found this one, which may help out. Note that I did not open the laptop, simply popped the plastic sheet that is in front of the screen off to see if there was something between it and the screen that was causing the lines. Unfortunately, there weren't, and I didn't touch the screen aside from a very gentle wipe with a fiber free cloth.

https://i.imgur.com/yXEXr.jpg

I blame shipping, as according to the pictures that were taken before shipping it didn't have this problem. Thus the onus is on dalamchops to either refund me shipping and the purchase price of the laptop, or pay for a new screen, which I am willing to accept as 30 BTC despite the lower price of BTC at the moment.

-Garrett

[dalamchops]

Whatever you pointed out as the spec of dust is of different color and size to the original pictures i showed. Regardless, there's no way to tell if that picture is before or after you opened it.


http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/2158/imag0099h.jpg
http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/3931/imag0100tj.jpg

[kookiekrak]

where in gods name are you guys getting the price of a screen replacement from?

these things should only be max 150$ from ebay, not 30 btc worth...

here's one i found:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-ENVY-14-14-5-HD-SCREEN-REPLACEMENT-LCD-TFT-PANEL-/270736121956?pt=UK_Computing_LaptopAccess_RL&hash=item3f09216064

and imo, you guys should split the price of the screen. everyone knows the risks of shipping a laptop, and the blame lies with neither one of you.

[dalamchops]

where in gods name are you guys getting the price of a screen replacement from?

these things should only be max 150$ from ebay, not 30 btc worth...

here's one i found:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-ENVY-14-14-5-HD-SCREEN-REPLACEMENT-LCD-TFT-PANEL-/270736121956?pt=UK_Computing_LaptopAccess_RL&hash=item3f09216064

and imo, you guys should split the price of the screen. everyone knows the risks of shipping a laptop, and the blame lies with neither one of you.

The screen is a radiance display 1600x900 no longer manufactured. Price is $300 for a used one. Like in OP, i'm still ready to pitch in half for a screen DESPITE everyone saying that i shouldn't.

[rokh]

If it's USPS's fault, one of you might be able to get some money out of them for mis-handling it.

PS: Sucks to see you get 2(that i've seen) transactions that went bad, but cheer up, you can't have bad luck with transactions forever

[kookiekrak]

are the lines really bad? cause if not, then theres no real point in replacing it.

[dalamchops]

http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/2984/img20110825193558.jpg

These are the lines if looking at the entire screen. I'd say it's pretty bad.

[kookiekrak]

damn. i'd say split the cost of the new screen.

dont bother with trying to file any claims with usps. i was RMA'ing a 300$ psu and it got stolen in transit even with tracking. they told me to call back two weeks later to file a claim and when I did, they told me all they could do is look out for it. worthless people

[trentzb]

I specifically requested (and paid more for) USPS insurance for the laptop dalamchops sold/shipped me. Fortunately I didn't need to file a claim and yes dalamchops packaged and shipped (with insurance) the laptop superbly. No complaints with the transaction.

It's too bad that the middleman/carrier can cause such a problem between two upstanding members of the community and suffer no liability of their own.

Kudos to dalamchops for the offer to make things right with Garrett despite recently losing some BTC to that other guy.

[Garrett Burgwardt]

Like I said, I agree it's USPS' fault. The packaging seemed a bit light when I got it (as in, the box the laptop was in was right up against the top of the box with half a sheet of bubble wrap around it), but I've shipped worse that got through fine (before I joined these forums, don't worry).

I still take issue with only half of the screen coming from dalamchops - he's the one that will get the USPS claim if I understand their form properly, and he's the shipping party, so the onus on protection is his.

Not only that, but he offered more before I told him I had checked to make sure it wasn't something simple to fix, with a simple unclipping of the screen protector. That's like saying it's my fault the laptop is broken for opening the ram slot on the bottom.

-Garrett

[dalamchops]

Like I said, I agree it's USPS' fault. The packaging seemed a bit light when I got it (as in, the box the laptop was in was right up against the top of the box with half a sheet of bubble wrap around it), but I've shipped worse that got through fine (before I joined these forums, don't worry).

I still take issue with only half of the screen coming from dalamchops - he's the one that will get the USPS claim if I understand their form properly, and he's the shipping party, so the onus on protection is his.

Not only that, but he offered more before I told him I had checked to make sure it wasn't something simple to fix, with a simple unclipping of the screen protector. That's like saying it's my fault the laptop is broken for opening the ram slot on the bottom.

-Garrett

The problem is that, i was alleviated of all the blame/responsibility the moment you opened up the screen. For most laptop manufacturer, if you mess with anything besides hard drive and ram, u would've immediately voided any warranty. I think i am being way more than fair for offering to cover half the cost of the screen. Most agreed that i shouldn't even do anything at all.

[deslok]

File for the usps claim if they give you anything use the entirety of it towards the screen, if it doesn't cover the cost of a new screen since you two agree that it happened during shipping split the cost between the two of you. If it does cover the entire cost split what's left. If they don't give you anything I have to say i've never heard of poping something off the screen without dismantling the bezel at the very least the pressure to the side of a lcd could rupture some of the lines vertically as weak ones collapse to account for the added pressure and have to say that garrett is soley responsible for that.

[Garrett Burgwardt]

But I didn't open the screen - I'll take a video of this if I have to.

I opened the top lid of the computer, the front of which is a piece of thin flexible plastic - to remove it all I had to do was slide a fingernail between the two halves, even easier than opening something with screws tbh. No screws were touched, no adhesive dealt with and no pressure put on any of the screen. Only a complete imbecile would be able to damage the screen in the process. The whole sheet of plastic just bent forward a bit, I gently wiped at both the smudge of dust and the dead pixels to confirm that they were a problem with the screen and not a liquid or dirt or something between the two layers, and snapped the assembly back together.

If I'd opened the actual unit, ie removed screws or separated any components, I would agree with you, but I didn't, and let me remind you that this problem existed before I did anything with the laptop. I can't prove that of course, but my word should carry some weight, either as a long time member of these forums or as a trader with many good references behind him.

@deslok see above, yes I had to separate the bezel, but it required no pressure.

[rokh]

Used computers are a murky subject, so I'll just say that even seperating the bezel would have voided a new laptop's warranty from any manufacturer(except one very specific manufacturer).

[deslok]

Why don't you two try and file the claim first before sitting here assigning blame this fighting may all be a waste of effort.